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Old 02-02-2009, 08:13 PM   #76
rossosud
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

win with 4+BB i disagree. Not that many
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:14 PM   #77
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

10% is way high IMO
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:28 PM   #78
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

Quote:
Originally Posted by ********** View Post
you sir have 63 poasts.....please stop giving your input where it does not belong
you are a total assclown
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:57 AM   #79
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

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Originally Posted by Sham_wow View Post
If you're playing with a bunch of spewtards / calling stations then you want to tighten up a bit.
lol please continue to think this
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:59 AM   #80
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

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Originally Posted by ********** View Post
LOL....shooting for 5BB/100 is like shooting for the stars at full ring. if you win at 3BB/100 you are vastly more solid than 99% of other regs. 16-17/12-13 is optimal at full ring. anyone who says any different is either a nit, or a spewtard or just sux at poker. and a big LOL goes out to having too high a showdown win% is bad. if i win 100% of my showdowns how is that bad?
I love seeing posts like this. Assures me that poker will always be extremely profitable.
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Old 02-03-2009, 02:08 AM   #81
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

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I 16 tabled 200NL and have been winning at 5BB/100 for the past 6 months. But to expect that from anyone playing any style other than 16/12 is just completely unrealistic
Brilliant logic there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ********** View Post
do the research yourself.....look up all the 100 and 200nl regs on tableratings and you will find that a VAST VAST majority of them grind out less than a 1BB/100 profit. The really really good ones typically grind out between 2-3BB/100 and the Exceptional few grind out greater than 3
And does tableratings tell you anything about player's pre-flop stats? I didn't think so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ********** View Post
my name is Babar, i have 211 poasts, and i play NL400-1000 so I am the man at poker. Uhhhhhh fish, the real men at poker use your buyin for the Big Blind. You don't know **** either.
Babar > you at poker.

Seriously it's been a long time since I've seen this much FAIL from one person in the small-stakes FR thread.
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Old 02-03-2009, 02:18 AM   #82
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

And Rossosud, do you even play poker?

You talk a lot about your "friends" who are pros above 100nl as if this somehow qualifies you to talk about "optimal" stats.

There is no such thng as "optimal" stats and anyone who was played mid-stakes should know this by now.
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Old 02-03-2009, 02:22 AM   #83
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabethebabe View Post
I´m owning the Ongame tables with my 0.45/0.45 style.
lolz.
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Old 02-03-2009, 02:27 AM   #84
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

so I just filtered all my AA hands in HEM and I'm playing 100/100 making 23482384234 BB/100 so obviously 100/100 is optimal. If you don't play 100/100 you obviously suck at poker. My way is the only way to play poker. If you disagree I have friends who prove you wrong. I 40-table (Belok style) 100/100 and my friends can all prove that and prove you all suck at poker 2+2 makes me lol sometimes everyone knows all the big winners play 100/100 and 2+2 tries to hide that to make poker profitable.
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Old 02-03-2009, 04:24 AM   #85
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

Quote:
Originally Posted by zachvac View Post
so I just filtered all my AA hands in HEM and I'm playing 100/100 making 23482384234 BB/100 so obviously 100/100 is optimal. If you don't play 100/100 you obviously suck at poker. My way is the only way to play poker. If you disagree I have friends who prove you wrong. I 40-table (Belok style) 100/100 and my friends can all prove that and prove you all suck at poker 2+2 makes me lol sometimes everyone knows all the big winners play 100/100 and 2+2 tries to hide that to make poker profitable.
oh.
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Old 02-03-2009, 07:07 AM   #86
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

Anyone who makes definitive claims of "optimal" preflop stats is an idiot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ********** View Post
lol....all these ******s that come in here and say omg you be playing 10/8 or 22/18 are just ******ed, 16/12 is 100% optimal. I 16 tabled 200NL and have been winning at 5BB/100 for the past 6 months. But to expect that from anyone playing any style other than 16/12 is just completely unrealistic.
Please tell me this is a level.

Last edited by king_nothing_; 02-03-2009 at 07:13 AM.
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Old 02-03-2009, 07:29 AM   #87
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

that little article shows a statline and when i saw it i was like, 'wtf that's me'

except i make more win than him!

oh and wtf @ not being able to do 16 tables, i do 24 and it's no big deal. Well, it took awhile to get used to that, but I was doing 16 after like 2 months.
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Old 02-03-2009, 09:17 AM   #88
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

Quote:
Originally Posted by ********** View Post
do the research yourself.....look up all the 100 and 200nl regs on tableratings and you will find that a VAST VAST majority of them grind out less than a 1BB/100 profit. The really really good ones typically grind out between 2-3BB/100 and the Exceptional few grind out greater than 3
sad but true
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Old 02-03-2009, 09:20 AM   #89
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

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Originally Posted by king_nothing_ View Post
Anyone who makes definitive claims of "optimal" preflop stats is an idiot.
+1
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Old 02-03-2009, 09:48 AM   #90
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

yes I found this thread from title to finish very interesting, A+

would read again...lol
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Old 02-03-2009, 10:05 AM   #91
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

Quote:
Originally Posted by zachvac View Post
so I just filtered all my AA hands in HEM and I'm playing 100/100 making 23482384234 BB/100 so obviously 100/100 is optimal. If you don't play 100/100 you obviously suck at poker. My way is the only way to play poker. If you disagree I have friends who prove you wrong. I 40-table (Belok style) 100/100 and my friends can all prove that and prove you all suck at poker 2+2 makes me lol sometimes everyone knows all the big winners play 100/100 and 2+2 tries to hide that to make poker profitable.
liar, no wai anyone has 100/100 over a decent sample size. my vpip is just 97.56 DUCY?

Last edited by Shephard; 02-03-2009 at 10:07 AM. Reason: the amount of retardation ITT is mind-boggling
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Old 02-03-2009, 10:23 AM   #92
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

VPIP>15
PFR>12
ATS>27
AFq>45
=
crush 100NL full ring

Anything significantly higher than these numbers is probably overkill but will be good for you as you move up. If you're in the 18-22 VPIP/15-19 PFR range at small stakes full ring, you are burning money by not playing 6max.
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Old 02-03-2009, 12:24 PM   #93
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

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Originally Posted by Shephard View Post
liar, no wai anyone has 100/100 over a decent sample size. my vpip is just 97.56 DUCY?
Nah I have a really good poker face so no one gives me walks in the BB and no shortstackers ever shove before I have a chance to put in a raise. Maybe you need to practice. Playing 100/100 isn't easy and takes a lot of training but it's easily the most optimal style if you can pull it off. Keep working hard and it'll hopefully pay off .
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Old 02-03-2009, 12:34 PM   #94
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

Threads like this make me so happy to reopen my 10MM hand database and note that only 2-3 players have winrates of 2.5BB/100 over 100K hand samples.
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Old 02-03-2009, 12:39 PM   #95
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

I have not used the word optimal once. The original poster asked for the hand range I believe he should be at. Anyone who asks (which he should if he wants to know) I believe should play in that range to start. As for the comments about knowing pro players. I wont even answer. I am confident that a whole pile of ppl on here are friends or related to very very good poker players. All hand ranges and stats I suggested were recommending to me when started that level and I stand by. I believe if you push these numbers up you will require a much stronger post flop game (not that some of the ppl dont have it) merely that a newer player probably doesn't. Take the advice or leave either way fine with me.
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:55 PM   #96
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

[ ] games are dead
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Old 02-03-2009, 03:55 PM   #97
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

16/12 is optimal, I have datamined several sites and winrates get higher as stats converge towards this. This is only at 100/200NL though... when you move up to 400NL the dynamic changes drastically and you have to play completely different.

Also, from my experience 120K hands definately proves that somebody hasn't been running hot and everything they say is correct. The biggest winners never run bad for more than 20K hands consecutively over a million hand sample size, so any varience will always be ironed out by the 120k sample size.
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Old 02-03-2009, 05:30 PM   #98
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

[ ] This, or any thread will have a real answer to this question.

[x] this thread delivers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBiceps View Post
It depends on how others are playing at the table.

VPIP between 6-28
PFR between 2-28
*nods* I'd agree with this.

Last edited by RapidEvolution; 02-03-2009 at 05:33 PM. Reason: Found something I agree with :)
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Old 02-03-2009, 06:13 PM   #99
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

I currently 9 table the deep FT full ring 0.5/1 games and always look up at tableratings the names I see alot of for game selection purposes. Only one reg so far at >5PTBB (and I suspect alot of this sample came from crushing HU 0.5/1, not all at fullring). In fact there are only a handful >1PTBB to which I mark red, which is a solid winrate after that deadly 5% rake is taken out. And when I login trust me there ain't much red out there.
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Old 02-03-2009, 09:35 PM   #100
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Re: optimal vpip/pfr for 100nl

Quote:
Originally Posted by yemen View Post
16/12 is optimal, I have datamined several sites and winrates get higher as stats converge towards this. This is only at 100/200NL though... when you move up to 400NL the dynamic changes drastically and you have to play completely different.

Also, from my experience 120K hands definately proves that somebody hasn't been running hot and everything they say is correct. The biggest winners never run bad for more than 20K hands consecutively over a million hand sample size, so any varience will always be ironed out by the 120k sample size.
wow, someone else has a brain....thanks
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