Good explanation of both

I'm really just posting because I'm one good round away from single digits for the first time in my life.

Wish me luck Sunday!!!!

+2.8 - Shoot59
+2.4 - JTrout
+2.0 - K-Slay
+1.4 - LimitGod
+1.1 - westhoff
+0.9 - stadler
0.1 - black knight
1.0 - dzh90
1.5 - Butcho22
1.5 - bigsoonerfan
1.7 - tuq
1.7 - duvvard
2.1 - mediaslut
2.9 - dug
3.1 - ghostface
3.2 - sonartec23b
3.2 - fullstop
3.3 - Nick B.
4.7 - Number7
6.0 - WLVRYN
6.2 - TripleH68
6.7 - BuckTeeth
7.0 - 41eater
7.8 - bonds
8.0 - fatshaft
9.0 - Brocktoon
9.1 - Here2gamble
9.7 - ArcticKnight
9.8 - larrylegend
10.5 - dcasper70
10.6 - tdrot
12.5 - Hey_Porter
13.0 - RainbowWarrior
13.2 - roy_miami
15.0 - BrunoThePug
16.0 - offTopic
16.4 - mvoss
17.0 - Ballzack
17.0 - brettbrettr
17.1 - Cornboy
17.6 - Troll_Inc
18.0 - AndysDaddy
18.1 - john kane
18.2 - gharp
18.7 - dizong
20.0 - CalledDownLight
20.+ - JackInDaCrak
20.+ - 4Tay
21.9 - EDonk
22.8 - crosse91
25.0 - surfinillini
26.1 - yellowdoyle
29.1 - Wrym2
32.0 - Clarkmeister
33.0 - mad_hatter

4.2

Now 15.8.

Progress!

3.7

+2.8 - Shoot59
+2.4 - JTrout
+2.0 - K-Slay
+1.4 - LimitGod
+1.1 - westhoff
+0.9 - stadler
0.1 - black knight
1.0 - dzh90
1.5 - Butcho22
1.5 - bigsoonerfan
1.7 - tuq
1.7 - duvvard
2.1 - mediaslut
2.9 - dug
3.1 - ghostface
3.2 - sonartec23b
3.2 - fullstop
3.3 - Nick B.
3.7 - donkontilt
4.2 - Low_Card2
4.7 - Number7
6.0 - WLVRYN
6.2 - TripleH68
6.7 - BuckTeeth
7.0 - 41eater
7.8 - bonds
8.0 - fatshaft
9.0 - Brocktoon
9.1 - Here2gamble
9.7 - ArcticKnight
9.8 - larrylegend
10.2 - dcasper70
10.6 - tdrot
12.5 - Hey_Porter
13.0 - RainbowWarrior
13.2 - roy_miami
15.0 - BrunoThePug
15.8 - brettbrettr
16.0 - offTopic
16.4 - mvoss
17.0 - Ballzack
17.1 - Cornboy
17.6 - Troll_Inc
18.0 - AndysDaddy
18.1 - john kane
18.2 - gharp
18.7 - dizong
20.0 - CalledDownLight
20.+ - JackInDaCrak
20.+ - 4Tay
21.9 - EDonk
22.8 - crosse91
25.0 - surfinillini
26.1 - yellowdoyle
29.1 - Wrym2
32.0 - Clarkmeister
33.0 - mad_hatter

Hmm, that's a tough goal. I need to take 4.3 shots of my handicap. Everyone's needs a challenge!

Still trying to think what the odds of this might be? 50 to 1? 500 to 1? 5000 to 1?

It depends on how much time and effort you have put into getting to 1.5.
And how much time/effort you will put into improving from here on...

If the answers are "alot, not much" then the odds are extremely long".

If the answers are "not much/ alot" then the odds are good.


I know from the age demographic thread that your age is same as mine.
I would guess of the top of my head that you would be looking at something along the lines of:
playing at least 72 holes per week.
practicing at least 20 hours per week.
spending most of this time working on short game.

My scoring made dramatic improvements twice:
The first was in college where I made a swing change that allowed me to know where my misses would be. I could then have a little course management.
The second was when I improved my iron play.
I would take my shag bag full of nice Titleists, put the bag at a certain (known) yardage, and then hit from a nice piece of turf.
I soon learned the difference between hitting a ball 120 vs. 115.
I learned how to best get a few extra yards out of a club, or take a few yards off. I learned how to take one more club and knock it down.
I learned what was the absolute max I could hit a club, and that trying to do that wasn't the best way to have a tight pattern around that shag bag.
I knew how far I hit each club, and through lots of hitting, then going and picking them up and observing where most balls finished, I tightened my pattern tremendously.
Lots more birdie putts. Lots more confidence.

I did the same thing with SW, but to a tighter extreme.
Hitting to one of those circular pvc pipe swing training things that used to be popular, I'd put my shag bag in the center of it.
I'd put 10 balls at 40yds, 50yds, and so on and work on landing them within the circle.
When I began this, I rarely landed one in the circle.
By the end of the summer, I could land 50% in the circle from different distances.
When I had a 50 yard pitch in a round, I could see the pvc pipe, and the Titleist shag bag sitting at the base of the pin. And I believed I could make it!

I only wish I'd had a significant improvement in putting somewhere along the way!

Sorry for the rambling. Hope it helps a little.

2.8 - Shoot59
+2.4 - JTrout
+2.0 - K-Slay
+1.4 - LimitGod
+1.1 - westhoff
+0.9 - stadler
0.1 - black knight
1.0 - dzh90
1.5 - Butcho22
1.5 - bigsoonerfan
1.7 - tuq
1.7 - duvvard
1.9 - DrVanNostrin
2.1 - mediaslut
2.9 - dug
3.1 - ghostface
3.2 - sonartec23b
3.2 - fullstop
3.3 - Nick B.
3.7 - donkontilt
4.2 - Low_Card2
4.7 - Number7
6.0 - WLVRYN
6.2 - TripleH68
6.7 - BuckTeeth
7.0 - 41eater
7.8 - bonds
8.0 - fatshaft
8.5 - brick
9.0 - Brocktoon
9.1 - Here2gamble
9.7 - ArcticKnight
9.8 - larrylegend
10.2 - dcasper70
10.6 - tdrot
12.5 - Hey_Porter
13.0 - RainbowWarrior
13.2 - roy_miami
15.0 - BrunoThePug
15.8 - brettbrettr
16.0 - offTopic
16.4 - mvoss
17.0 - Ballzack
17.1 - Cornboy
17.6 - Troll_Inc
18.0 - AndysDaddy
18.1 - john kane
18.2 - gharp
18.7 - dizong
20.0 - CalledDownLight
20.+ - JackInDaCrak
20.+ - 4Tay
21.9 - EDonk
22.8 - crosse91
25.0 - surfinillini
26.1 - yellowdoyle
29.1 - Wrym2
32.0 - Clarkmeister
33.0 - mad_hatter

Had a good couple of months (but didn't play as much). lol variancements

Trout, you got to do all that on a course, or a really good practice facility?

was a 5.7 and haven't played in 4 months. Anyone here from SoCal?

My end of the season hcp came out. I ended at 17.5 (Started at 17.6, moved to 18.0). But my next 3 scores to be bumped are 3 decent scoring rounds. Of course all that shouldn't matter if I can consistently keep my game in the mid to low 80's. Hope global warming helps keeps the Northeast warm this winter.

2.8 - Shoot59
+2.4 - JTrout
+2.0 - K-Slay
+1.4 - LimitGod
+1.1 - westhoff
+0.9 - stadler
0.1 - black knight
1.0 - dzh90
1.5 - Butcho22
1.5 - bigsoonerfan
1.7 - tuq
1.7 - duvvard
1.9 - DrVanNostrin
2.1 - mediaslut
2.9 - dug
3.1 - ghostface
3.2 - sonartec23b
3.2 - fullstop
3.3 - Nick B.
3.7 - donkontilt
4.2 - Low_Card2
4.7 - Number7
6.0 - WLVRYN
6.2 - TripleH68
6.7 - BuckTeeth
7.0 - 41eater
7.8 - bonds
8.0 - fatshaft
8.5 - brick
9.0 - Brocktoon
9.1 - Here2gamble
9.7 - ArcticKnight
9.8 - larrylegend
10.2 - dcasper70
10.6 - tdrot
12.5 - Hey_Porter
13.0 - RainbowWarrior
13.2 - roy_miami
14.9 - offTopic
15.0 - BrunoThePug
15.8 - brettbrettr
16.4 - mvoss
17.0 - Ballzack
17.1 - Cornboy
17.5 - Troll_Inc
18.0 - AndysDaddy
18.1 - john kane
18.2 - gharp
18.7 - dizong
20.0 - CalledDownLight
20.+ - JackInDaCrak
20.+ - 4Tay
21.9 - EDonk
22.8 - crosse91
25.0 - surfinillini
26.1 - yellowdoyle
29.1 - Wrym2
32.0 - Clarkmeister
33.0 - mad_hatter

This was at the 9 hole course where I grew up.
It had a practice area where you could hit your own balls.
It was about 150 yards from my back door.

I spent countless hours hitting my old Titleist shags in this area.
Typical routine:
empty shag bag (maybe 75 balls), walk 125 yds and sit the shag bag down for a target. I'd also take my two headcovers. I'd lay them 15 ft. left/right or short/long of the bag. Pace the yardage back to the bag to double check yardage. (you take longer steps going uphill than you do downhill)
Hit several shots trying to make a tight pattern. When focus dropped off, I'd pick up 5 or so and move up 5 yards to 120 and hit at target; then take 5 balls to 130 and repeat.
Hit all the balls. Go pick them up and observe where most stopped.
Repeat at a new yardage.

The area wasn't anything special, except that I almost always had it to myself, and it was so close to home.

I went to the Pelz shortgame school around '93, which inspired me to spend a lot of time working on specific yardages less than full.
The old PVC circular pipe just happen to be a convenient and useful target.

I do think that this type of practice is much more rewarding than the typical driving range practice.

went way down this month, +2.4

you are leading the hsbc champions, good job.

2.8 - Shoot59
+2.4 - JTrout
+2.0 - K-Slay
+1.4 - LimitGod
+1.1 - westhoff
+0.9 - stadler
0.1 - black knight
1.0 - dzh90
1.5 - Butcho22
1.5 - bigsoonerfan
1.7 - tuq
1.7 - duvvard
1.9 - DrVanNostrin
2.1 - mediaslut
2.9 - dug
3.1 - ghostface
3.2 - sonartec23b
3.2 - fullstop
3.3 - Nick B.
3.7 - donkontilt
4.2 - Low_Card2
4.7 - Number7
6.0 - WLVRYN
6.2 - TripleH68
6.7 - BuckTeeth
7.0 - 41eater
7.8 - bonds
8.0 - fatshaft
8.5 - brick
9.0 - Brocktoon
9.1 - Here2gamble
9.7 - ArcticKnight
9.8 - larrylegend
9.8 - dcasper70 <------ Whoooooohooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!
10.6 - tdrot
12.5 - Hey_Porter
13.0 - RainbowWarrior
13.2 - roy_miami
14.9 - offTopic
15.0 - BrunoThePug
15.8 - brettbrettr
16.4 - mvoss
17.0 - Ballzack
17.1 - Cornboy
17.5 - Troll_Inc
18.0 - AndysDaddy
18.1 - john kane
18.2 - gharp
18.7 - dizong
20.0 - CalledDownLight
20.+ - JackInDaCrak
20.+ - 4Tay
21.9 - EDonk
22.8 - crosse91
25.0 - surfinillini
26.1 - yellowdoyle
29.1 - Wrym2
32.0 - Clarkmeister
33.0 - mad_hatter

Just looking back through the thread, I saw JTrout's post. Thanks for the response. For some reason I must have missed that earlier.

The goal is going to be much tougher with my new job/promotion (working nights 1/3 of the year and 1/3 of the weekends). Hours will be about the same amount, but it's tough enough to play this game with regular sleep!

I may have to modify my goal to just slip below scratch. That should be easy enough?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigSoonerFan
Hmm, that's a tough goal. I need to take 4.3 shots of my handicap. Everyone's needs a challenge! (to get to the top of the handicap list)


I don't want to discourage you at all, but to give you a point of reference:

When I arrived at college, I was probably about a 1 handicap.
I spent the next 4 years working extremely hard every day on my game.
I would guess I averaged 5 hours a day, every day, of practice.
I estimate I played at least 250 rounds of golf each of those years, almost all in some competive situation. If they weren't tournament rounds, they were either qualifying rounds, or (small stakes) gambling games with teammates.
I received lessons for the first time in my life. I had the opportunity to compete daily with players better than me that showed me my weaknesses and pushed me to improve. You get the picture!

At the end of my 4 year college career, I was probably a +2 handicap.

But I'm a slow learner!
Good luck in your goal But don't get too frustrated if it is tougher than you imagine.

Back in the mid-70’s, I asked occasional Kansan pro tourist and now long-time Las Vegas area teacher, Jimmy Bullard, how low myself, or any other reasonably coordinated human being, might work his handicap down to. (This was well before indexing and a comprehensive course rating system.)

I was probably around a 14-handicap at the time. Although I’d knocked the ball around as a youth and caddied as early as age 12, I had never had the time, or the opportunity, or the money to play on a regular basis. Although I had never had lessons as an adult, the man who first put a club in my hand was a celebrated old teaching professional so, thank God, I always had a proper grip. I also had the natural advantages of a multi-sport, skill position athlete; as a kid, I could hit it a very long way, indeed.

Jimmy said he believed the cut-off was seven. After that, he thought, lower took some talent.

After a very long illness and a death in the family, I took a time-out for about a year on the course. I played as often as four times a week, and practiced as often as three, with a purpose.

And the end of the year, at about age 50, I was down to an index of 7.1. Possibly more instructive, I was universally recognized as the best player at my very active club in that handicap range and certainly one of the best in town (I was a member of the second-place inaugural Kansas City Cup team.) I played in a regular group, for money that was meaningful to me, and my handicap was about the middle of the pack. I was always in the money; my scores did not vary much, and when they did, I went lower.

Here’s what I learned from that experience:

How do you get to Carnegie Hall? Practice, practice, practice.

How do you get it in the hole? Short game. Practice this, while the rest of the lads bang balls.

How do you get it to the hole? Course management. Most of your rounds are played on your home course. Plot a game plan with a goal to avoid disaster, not to go low. Establish a personal par. It is ten times easier to save a stroke than to get one back. And course management starts in the bag. With today’s technology, there is no excuse for carrying a stick you don’t hit great. Remember the Grampy Smith Rule (great amateur and patriot, lived to 100, born on the 4th of July): “Never give up more than a stroke. Take your medicine.”

Fundamentals: Grip, set-up, alignment. They’ve never changed. Never will. Even the best players screw up their alignment. There’s a reason those LPGA caddies stand behind their player – annoying as it looks.

When all else fails: tempo, tempo, tempo.

No secrets here. But here are two less-discussed items:

Start trying to make makeable puts. I was always a good lag putter, from any distance. I bought wholeheartedly into the theory that distance was more important than direction and I drew that imaginary bigger circle around the hole. I seldom three-putted. But I did not make putts. And the guys that made the money did make putts. So I refocused and started consciously trying to make putts. Technically, I had to put a better roll on the ball. Presto… (This is even more important in match play, where most of us spend our time.)

Compete. I had always been aggressively anti-competitive on the golf course. It was a walk in the park for me, relaxation; I was perfectly happy to play alone, often happiest alone. Or with my late wife, who was hopeless as a player, but a great companion, nevertheless. Then I started to compete, home and away. It is not the same game. The pressure is magnified exponentially. And, once you have conquered it, your game has arrived at a new level.

There is a corollary to all this. We tend to define ourselves as 100’s players, or 90’s players, or 80’s players, and refine this to a handicap range, and haul it around as a self-limiting, self-image. While I shot the occasional round in the 70’s, it was not until I thought of myself as a 70’s player that I began to shoot the majority of my rounds in the 70’s.

Well, if you did it in five years, one year should be a piece of cake for me!

14... i can't putt.

Probably a 19 now - was 16 - maybe 15 or so at my best.