He's not allowed to set goals, or does he have to get your permission first?

I'm jealous of Dan, but at least I can admit it, and not let my own envy wish anything but admiration.

--- People like Dan are why America's great.

Why do you care so much that he is benefiting a little bit from some media attention. It is perfectly fine that professional golf is his ultimate goal. Why does this anger you and make you act so negatively towards his plan?

Once again - I think we'd all love to hear their stories and how that 10K hours of dedicated practice worked out for them. Thanks in advance for the answers to that and the earlier unanswered questions!

Guy hates on people with goals on internet. Has no real story of his own, but only those he claims have failed - including himself. All others are attention-whores. Claims to be a "golfnutt"

Yep. that would have been much more compelling.

Post your plan - I'll start a thread about it on here - we'll all chime in - should be fun! Best of luck!

This is silly. Virtually nobody is doing what he is doing. If you disagree, please find me someone who started out as a non-golfer who is now multiple years into their quest to becoe the best they can be, having quit their job and fully committed to nothing but golf. My guess is that there is not one other person on Earth doing this, and for you to say that is clear evidence that you don't 'get it' at all.

There's nothing wrong with that, but I don't really understand why you and others who share your POV on this ever read this thread, or bother to post in it.

I actually think he is shooting too low. Why stop at just making a living? Sounds very mediocre. He should be shooting for Ryder Cup, majors and eventually being inducted into the Golf Hall of Fame.

This is all a publicity stunt. And it is obviously working. That a 5.9 index is getting free rounds and talk of an exemption into a Web.com event clearly demonstrates that he is good at marketing himself.

I personally don't find it that admirable to quit a job to work on getting a ball into a hole. Some people are very impressed by that obviously, just not me. Seems rather self-serving...and delusional on top of it.

Phelps didn't cure cancer. Instead he swims fast. Seems rather self-serving.

You don't know how good you are at something until you try. Phelps and TW and Bubba and Derek Jeter and Liberace turned out to be great at what they decided to do. Why can't this guy give it a shot. As far as media attention, etc., the media holds the spotlight and shines it where something interesting is happening, just like you hold the mouse and you click it where you see something you think is interesting. Unless you just click wherever you think you can dispense haterade. If the latter, congrats, you're excelling! Now publicize your efforts so you can be famous.

I think the issue that some take with the "plan" is related mostly to the idea of him becoming a professional. I think these people are basically "offended" or feel that it's somewhat disgraceful to golf and it's professionals in general.

Quoted from the danplan website: I think that most people who understand just how good PGA Tour pros are think that the "plan" and this specific part of his "goals" is unrealistic.

Also from the site: Again, I think most people who've been around golf long enough know that wrt to golf, this is probably not true.

I don't really understand the "haters" getting "mad" at the "supporters" and vice versa.

I personally think it's kind of cool that Dan has run hot enough in life that he has the opportunity. I'm interested to see where he's at after 10k hours. Not totally sure if this is what he is doing, but I think that using only one coach is a big mistake. He should have spent the first X hours trying on multiple coaches and should potentially have more than one coach in general.

All that said, conducting an experiment based on a theory about 10,000 hours of deliberate practice and "talent has little to do with success" in any physical activity, especially a sport, especially golf seems pretty silly to me. Talent is paramount in golf. I'm assuming those doctors who did the study weren't golfers.

Shark has been jumped.

People need to get the sticks out of their asses.


Quick notes because I really don't have much to contribute:

With respect to "it's about the journey" vs "it's about becoming a professional golfer", it's semantics. At some point this becomes some sort of philosophical debate just like the debate about altruism and whether or not being selfless is truly possible because really it comes down to the fact that doing selfless things makes oneself feel good (so then, is it really selfless???)

I'm not saying that's how I feel about altruism. I'm just saying that the last bulk of this thread seems to be arguing about **** that doesn't matter and cannot be proved.

I just can't comprehend why there is so much hate for this guy. It's not like Dan came in here and started some thread about how he was going to go from being a 20hcp to making 50-60K a year "playing tournaments" because he feels he's athletic and that anyone can do it. He set a goal and he's trying to do it. Big ****ing deal. You can say "I told you so" afterwards but I'm sure Dan isn't going to give two ****s because he is mostly doing this for himself. It's dishonest to say that he doesn't want the world to know, but he's not doing this so at the end he can say "OMG I'm so great". "It's about the journey", but of course he's going to take advantage of the media attention. I would imagine that almost every bit of free stuff he's getting is being given to him without him asking for it. I highly doubt he's making phone calls going "Hey, I'm Dan. Can I come play your course for free?"

Like doc said, it's about being held accountable. Maybe that's how he's motivating himself. It would take some serious gumption to make it through 2000 hours of putting if no one knew he was doing this experiment.

I think what bothers people who find this journey stupid is that they think he is actually delusional about becoming a professional golfer. I haven't read enough about it to make a judgment either way, but if he really believes that any inherent athletic shortcoming can be overcome with enough time/dedication, then that's just silly/delusional/stupid. If he has the mind set and awareness that it's astronomically impossible for him to become a professional and is just doing it for the journey/life experience, then good for him.

The problem is this whole project wouldn't be as hyped or recognized if he made it clear he believes the latter.

What is the difference between this thread and the thousands of "Quitting job to play poker for a living"?

What makes golf that unique?

The only thing that stood out (for me) was the comedy of making a living playing professional golf. And only someone who has never played the game would make such a ridiculous statement because they have no idea the difference between a unbelievably great golfer (expert) and one who can make a living at it.

That is why it is marketing. Becoming an expert golfer doesn't have the same panache. I don't fault the guy at all. God bless him. He gets free golf.

+1

I actually give him props for the marketing hype of this project. He took a rather mundane endeavor of getting better at golf and developed a following. He parlayed that further into free golf and potential sponsor exemptions.

when me and dan are in the final pairing of the 2021 masters, golfnutt is gonna be so mad.

ahahaha

He actually seems like a nice guy. And obviously very charismatic or he wouldn't be able to generate the interest he has...including this thread.

My only issue is that unbelievable CURRENT great golfers aren't getting exemptions into events and free merch while someone makes a statement they want to be play on the PGA Tour is getting stuff. And, yes, it feels disrespectful for a non-golfer (at the time Dan started this plan) to make such an incredibly bold statement without knowing how brutally difficult it is for even the best golfers to make a living. How many Walker Cuppers and US Am winners have never made it? Every college golf team is loaded with the best amateur talent and only a handful will even play one tour event, let alone make a living.

Yes, it doesn't mean it is absolutely impossible and I am sorry if it came off like I was making fun of someone dreams. It just appeared it was made with not really appreciating how damn good the players that do make it out there are and even the ones that CAN'T make a living. And I happen to know my fair share of 'failed' pros and their golf games are out of this world.

Apologies to all. I would be more than happy to even host him at my club. I can then say I beat Tiger Woods AND Dan

This thread has been quiet for a bit but I just read the whole thing and wanted to post some points that I don't really think have been discussed.

The thing that's most unique about The Dan Plan is his thorough documentation of his process. As others have stated, yes--there are many people in this world who work extremely hard on their golf game. And yes, there are people loads more talented than Dan who have also worked just as hard as him at the game.

So why should Dan get special treatment simply for being "a good self-promotor?"

My contention is that he is doing this experiment in full view of the public, and he is documenting it step by step, and for that he does deserve a lot of credit. His goal is to put to the test just what can be done by a "regular" guy in 10,000 hours of focused, dedicated practice.

So he is actually doing something really cool and rather funny--it's like he read one of those goofy Two Plus Two thought experiment threads in OOT and then decided to go out and live it for real. What would happen to a regular guy, 30 years old with no athletic talent, if he put 10k hours into practicing golf?

That could easily have been a fun thread (and probably has) on this forum. Now most of us would just blabber on about our dumb (and uninformed) opinions on the subject. Dan is actually LIVING this. He has been for two ****ing years!! That is hilarious, it's insane, and it's also inspiring.

You can say "shameless self-promoter." But the fact is, when he started this plan he had absolutely no guarantees. He's not being supported by mommy and daddy, he's supporting himself from his own saved cash from working at a job. He wasn't making a living (and still isn't) off of sponsorships and donations. If he eventually does make some career out of this gig, it will be through his own efforts and hard work. In which case, he's proving yet another point that I find particularly intriguing.

The point is that with a lot of hard work and passion, a very "average" guy can actually live his dreams, make the kind of life for himself that he is happy living.

Most people are far too frightened of failure, far too negative and angry and undisciplined to do what Dan is doing. He's basically laying down a roadmap for other likeminded souls who want to do something difficult and showing that it doesn't in fact take "extraordinary talent" to live your dreams. What it takes is intense focus, hard work, and absolute determination.

Being a "natural" is overrated in all aspects of life. Do naturals exist? Hell yes. We know that golfers like Tiger or cellists like Yo Yo Ma are light years beyond most ordinary folks in their chosen fields.

But that doesn't mean that a regular, average person isn't capable of absolutely startling achievements.

I guarantee you one other thing, which is that some naysayers will never admit they're wrong on this. Mark my words, if Dan does happen to do the nearly impossible and play tour level golf--there will be many people who say he must have just been "a natural" the whole time and never knew it...

It would be the first one to admit that I was wrong.

Also, it is interesting that he is putting everything down, but that is just good business management. He has many investors and he is rightfully doing a fantastic job of keeping them informed. And it also ensures new investors would feel comfortable giving him money knowing it is going to good use.

Dan is a fantastic marketer/business guy. Give him a lot of props for that.

Whether he gets to scratch or not has a large part to do with his coach.. im not sure his coach taught him a swing capable of getting him to scratch.. espically after hearing about all those hooks and blocks he's getting..

I honestly think Dan is going to be stuck at like a 5 handicap for quite a while and is going to have to change some stuff up to go past that barrier (like getting a new coach)

I mean if you look at the video titled "Swing analysis, May 2012", his coach is basically advocating him to stall and flip the club to square it up.

I agree its overrated, but whats the tour top 120 players in the world? I don't think practice alone gets you to that point - you need natural skill.....its awesome though to see someone go for their dream - too many people are so scared like you said and miss out on taking shots in life.....we only live once

Take an average tour player who has worked his ass off to get there. Let's say you take someone with the same athletic talent as the tour guy but who has never picked up a golf club. Is the 10,000 hours that Dan is putting into this enough to make the tour?

I guess a simpler way to ask is how much practice time does it take for someone with enough talent to make it on tour?

I commend the guy for having the balls to even attempt this. He had a great idea for an experiment that very few people would have the opportunity, patience and commitment for.

However, with all they help he has, full time coaching, swing analysis etc, to only be at a 6.1 handicap after 3,600 hours is pretty poor in my opinion.

I know a couple of guys who were less athletic than him, took up the game older than him, had very little coaching, and could play to a 12-13 handicap in 2 years sporadic play (maybe 400-600 hours).

He most likely will make scratch so he could earn a living as a club pro or whatever but as for Q school? No chance...

I agree, if he had much natural talent his handicap would be lower by now.

He won't make the tour or anything, but I hope he gets good enough that they could have him on the Big Break. Worst case he will have set himself up for some sort of career in golf, whether that's as a club pro or whatever.

This is silly. Two years of sporadic play is not 400-600 hours. On top of that, it is ridiculous to suggest that two peopel you know personally both play to a 12 in 2 years w. almost no coaching and "sporadic" play.

Please.

beats me, I probably put in at least 2500 hours in to golf over the last 2 years and im a 30 handicap. And I have had 3 different coaches (2 highly recommended) and a zillion lessons.

Either im the most untalented golfer on earth, or my coaches were all terrible, or both..

i think age has alot to do with it

if your older, its more difficult to learn new things right?