I think there are a couple of elements that are new to the scene that we have to consider before we truly know the answer to this question. Although the management at Naga has now been there for some time, the new manager is still adding new elements to the room in terms of staffing and even game play that have not been fully realized yet. And while the Chinese have completely invaded Sihanoukville, their role here has been increasing here as well. I think these two elements will result in a low season that is different than ones past. Things will certainly be slower and the ratio of fish to regs may be a bit off, but I anticipate a busier low season than in recent memory. I always tells people these days, I've never seen this much poker in this town.

What a great question. Personally I haven't made a "living" from poker in a very long time. I was a moderate winner at the old Riverking's $1-$3 NLH game but that is difficult to judge due to the conditions under which I played. I really only played at the beginning to help start the game and at the end when it got short; hardly did I play the "meat" of the game when it was at its best. I was definitely a winner in $1-$2 and $1-$3 games in Vegas when I lived there, but I wouldn't call it enough for a living. I only played those games toward the end and during most of my tenure there I supplemented $2-$5 live games with online play and a really good rakeback deal. But the rake in both Vegas and the old Riverking game was 10%, capped at $5 so it might be difficult to compare. Not to mention in Vegas I tipped much more than I do here.

There are a few items of thought that should be noted. First is that I actually prefer a 10%, capped at $5 rake over the 5% higher caps we traditionally have in Cambodia and other parts of Asia. The reason for that is players subconsciously develop a style in which opens and sizing in general is larger. This is obviously done to overcome the nature of a rake structure in which smaller pots are taxed larger proportionally. In other words, it rewards those who make the game bigger and that usually means a better game. In these situations players are trying to overcome a rake that is topped out at $5. But in the situation here in Phnom Penh, players are trying to overcome a much larger cap. And while the percentage may be lower, this advantage only manifests itself if the pots are smaller and therefore the games worse.

The second thing I wanted to discuss is the fact that I actually loathe $1-$3 games and much prefer $1-$2 as the entry game in live NLH. In a $1-$3 game the tendency of most rooms is to cap the maximum buy in too high and this is especially the case in Phnom Penh and Cambodia in general As a room manager this makes running a $2-$5 game so much more difficult and even if you have enough foot traffic to run a $1-$3 with a high max and a $2-$5 game, the quality of games for the latter is most certainly affected by the former. The ideal situation would be to have a $1-$2 game in which the minimum is $100 with a maximum of $300. You cap the max buy in for this game low and set the minimum for the $2-$5 game also at $300 so that it not only encourages those who wish to play bigger to actually play a bigger game but also to entice enough players from the $1-$2 game to play $2-$5 from time to time.

But these are all related points to the main question of can players make a livable wage within the rake structures that exist here in Phnom Penh? The answer is obviously player dependent, but generally speaking I believe it is more possible at $2-$5 and above. For $1-$3 I think players can certainly beat it but not for anything one would consider a living. I do think it can be used to supplement someone who mostly plays $2-$5, but will occasionally play the smaller game when lineups dictate. In regards to the $1-$3 games in town, I think the rake is simply too high for them to be beatable in any meaningful fashion. Having come from a town where I am used to a cap of $5, I still can't wrap my head around the fact that rake for what should be the entry game is capped at $15+. And while some may still bring up the fact that $5 cap rakes utilize a higher percentage, once again I will state that players naturally adjust in how they buy in and also how they bet. And I use that term "entry game" because that is what it should be; a game for beginners, tourists and those that generally do not take it that seriously and are not trying to grind out a living. At the time of this writing, the $1-$3 games in town are too reg infested and this too affects the quality of the game and how beatable they are. Certainly there are those few who do beat the $1-$3 games for a livable wage. But in those cases I think they live a much more frugal life then what is often discussed on these pages. And if anyone did want to play $1-$3 as part of their monthly earnings, I do think it needs to be paired with a considerable amount of online volume. I am constantly surprised by how many players I still meet in Phnom Penh that have been here nearly as long as I have and yet have never met. The reason for this is simply that they exclusively play online. And while the sample size is small, these players seem to have lived here for a while and are doing very well. Perhaps there is something to that.

In regards to Phnom Penh vs the Philippines, I have to admit that I have never been to the latter but I think the better choice would still be here in Cambodia. From what I hear the rake in the Philippines is not ideal either and the games there too are reg infested. And from speaking with players who have been in both cities, it appears that the quality of life here is much better. And although what I just wrote may have not been the greatest of endorsements, I do think developments at Naga and the continuing arrival of the Chinese should be a source of hope for the games running better. You can also just play online, and all things poker related being equal I think Phnom Penh is a more desirable place to live.

For low stakes PP sucks, you can actually make decent money in Snooky playing 1/2, but then you actually have stay in Snooky which costs like twice as much as PP and sucks a lot more. Tradeoffs.

Thanks to everyone for their replies.

Ok good to know
Thank you

Thanks for your honest opinion


Looking forward to it now

I dunno man, in Manila you can find pretty soft 1/2 equivalent games with a 5% rake cap of $8 (400 pesos). Last time I played it was 6-8 way limped pots constantly. Now quality of life I haven't been to PP but can't imagine it could be worse. Manila is a dump.

Played in PP this past week and my thoughts: If i was a full time live grinder in PP I'd mostly play Naga but sometimes play RK and become friends with manager or a reg there who could let me know when game is great and you do the same for them at naga. Also have someone ready to buy action if not rolled for it when 5/10 does run as it will nearly always be better than 2/5. random korean or chinese whales arent ever gonna stumble into RK and thats where your income really comes from.

rake isnt unbeatable at any of the games because even the "pros" in those games are quite bad and underrolled it seemed like. but it isnt cheap either, take advantage of whatever RB or value you can. RK has free food thats pretty good make sure always eat there, naga gives people with a players card some credit for food etc.

Really really good to know

Realistic bankroll requirements for PP live scene in 2019? Does standard 40-50 buy-in rule apply or is more needed due to other factors such as super swingy games, higher rake, etc.

Also anyone know if poker room rates are still available?

people may suggest 40-50 buyins online because a good winrate may be something like 3-5bb/100, which would be about 1bb/hour live

I've never really played live but if it's true that winrates can be 5-10bb/hour, then the required bankroll is actually relatively small, but you also need to keep in mind you can't move down so you want risk of ruin to be basically 0%, and also need some savings aside for living expenses

10-15 buyins is probably fine if it doesnt include your liferoll as long as your income is higher than your expenses, but you would be ****ed if you're just a fish and trying to play with 10 buyins without a 20bb/100 winrate

Hi guys will be arriving in PP for some live poker action! 26M, been grinding in the phils for the past 2.5 months, doin a visa run to Cambodia and checking out the scene here. If anyone wants to meet up, feel free to DM or hit me up on instagram -badbeatwilly

Yeah... so some things to catch up on for sure. I actually didn't even want to make this post as I'm trying to not make a big deal out of it, but as some have stated that they are planning their trips around the Siem Reap opening I thought it appropriate to make an announcement. I and the Korean group that I am a part of are no longer a part of the Siem Reap project. The foreign shareholder that was in charge of the project has asked us to no longer participate so we happily obliged and left. I would suggest to those that were planning on being there in mid April to alter your plans. It does look as if they are going to face massive delays and I can't really comment on when it might open.

Onto better things hopefully so today I just arrived at Bavet, which is on the Vietnam border and about four hours outside of Phnom Penh. One of our Korean group members is opening up a new poker room here inside the Gwin casino so I've come down to help. I brought along a couple of former Riverking dealers and as of the time of this writing, we had just settled in the staff house. I have to admit it is kind of weird sleeping next door to my former employees.

I have my own unit in the complex and I have to admit it is better than what I was expecting. In fact this whole town has been a surprise. It reminds me so much of Sihanoukville, but not quite. It's almost as if Sihanoukville was a face hugger from the Alien franchise and Bavet it's host. The resulting offspring would be what this town is now. Everywhere you go is there are Chinese and casinos seems to be going up at a rapid pace with eighteen currently operating and three more to be razed soon. And while prices have gone up in the last couple of years, it hasn't been at nearly the same rate as Sihanoukville.

We got in about 9:00 PM and our Korean host was nice enough to treat us to dinner and a massage. It's about 2:00 AM now so hopefully we'll get an early start tomorrow and plan for this Saturday's grand opening. I'll be here until the 6th of April so if anyone wanted to make the trek that would be awesome. I know one player who said he would already come for a visit so I'm looking forward to that.

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that sashimi looks pretty solid

'new pokerroom'? First one in this town?

It actually was pretty solid although you could tell it had been frozen and thawed at some point. Not a huge surprise considering where we are but still pretty damn good. I'll try more of the local restaurants here over the next few days and try my best to report on it. I sense many photos of Chinese food coming on.

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Yes it is the first one as far as I know, but I admit I haven't done much research on it. I do know there are no other poker rooms at the moment. My coming down here was still in the discussion phase up until recently so I haven't really talked about it much. I really don't know what their marketing efforts have been up to this point so I'll be curious to see how it opens. I'm coming on much too late in the process to have a real effect by Saturday but I hope to help in other ways. There are a few tricks up my sleeve that I can employ so I think I'll be making my way around the other casinos this week and gain a few of what seems to be an endless see of Chinese people.

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From what I read in this thread Sihanoukville doesn’t seem like a viable option to grind live games anymore due to high cost of living now. Still worth a visit for a week or two?

No. Dusty, expensive, boring. Most nonpokerrelaeted foreigners I met went straight to the ferry. Or they hang around Otres smoking weed.

There are power cuts lasting up to 6 hours because there's not enough supply. It may last until June so make sure wherever you stay has a generator.

Losing power in here in PP too (if you were talking about Snooky) at BKK3 around Tuol Sleung, 2-4 hours a day at 12:30pm like clockwork... it's hell. One of the downsides of paying a cheaper rate a bit out of the way I suppose. I know nothing about electricity so what would be causing this and how would they fix it and in what sort of time frame?

The blame is on lack water for hydroelectricity. The power cuts are actually intentional. They're rotating around power cuts throughout the day because there isn't enough power for everyone.

So whats the long term solution?

I stay at Victoria SK apartment, have Generator here...basically power will go out around lunch time for like 2 minutes then come back. I keep reading on FB ppl losing there power everyday for like 6 hours lmao what a beat.

I ended up buying a UPS for like $40, but the internet connection still drops everytime the power cuts.

btw, any High/Mid stakes online guys grinding it out in PP?

So I have now been in Bavet for five days and it has been a challenge. Just a quick review, I came down to this town which is on the Vietnamese border to help out one of our Korean group members open a poker room. It turns out that it is not the first attempt at a poker room here and they even had an APT here. But anyone who is familiar with border towns like this one or Poipet, know what a challenge it is to start a poker room where the inhabitants are not familiar with the game. The most challenging part of all this has been the fact that the man heading this effort has never operated a poker room before; I suppose this is why he asked me to help. I have possibly never met a nicer man in my life and his character is only surpassed by his work ethic. I think he has stopped just about every Chinese person on the street to give them a business card. But opening and running a poker room takes structure and organization that is known only through experience so I've had to do a bit more than I originally anticipated.

I came down with two of my old dealers from old Riverking, including my former head dealer. All of this is old hat for them as they have done more travelling throughout the country than I have and one of them even worked in Poipet before. But it was a bit of a culture shock for me as while Bavet is reminiscent of Sihanoukville, they are distinctly different in many ways. The Chinese presence here is even more pervasive, if that's even possible. And while there are certainly Khmers here and also many Vietnamese considering how close we are to the border, I have yet to see a single white person in 5-6 days. There is not a business that is not Chinese in terms of restaurants, shops and markets. If I want to eat anything Western or Korean I basically have to go to restaurants inside the casinos. I suppose this pervasive presence of the Chinese is what prompted the Koreans to attempt a poker room here, hoping to get even a fraction of the population to spurn on a successful endeavor.

Much like in Sihanoukville, the Chinese here don't wake up until very late and most are involved in the online gambling business inside of casinos. You can walk out into mall areas that are completely empty even in the late afternoon. The life here centers around the casinos and the activities therein. There are plenty of restaurants and shops that are open late and strip mall type areas are open until the early hours of the morning. People do drink plenty here, but there aren't too many bars. There certainly aren't any girly bars and the nightlife centers mostly around the KTV's, both inside the casinos and the local ones outside. There are some massage parlors with extras and one club that reminded me a lot of the Chinese clubs I used to go to in Sihanoukville. The only difference here is that many of the girls are Vietnamese instead of Khmer. Still having gone to a few of these spots already, the nightlife here does seem to have potential and should only build out over time. I already have one Vietnamese dancer who won't stop texting me on WeChat.

Most of the casinos here have very nice restaurants contained therein with an eclectic menu that goes beyond Chinese food. In most places you can get very decent Korean fare and even sashimi and sushi. They are open late so we will usually end up their after the poker room has closed. Much of the fare outside is Chinese as I previously mentioned, but they are a bit easier to approach then places I remember in Sihanoukville. I've found one Western restaurant thus far but have yet to try it. I imagine I might do that today if the game ends early enough.

I've got a friend coming down tomorrow to hang out and play some poker. He'll be here through the week so it'll be nice to see a familiar face. Speaking of familiar faces, I completely forgot that a player that frequents Phnom Penh every few months actually lives here. He just showed up in our poker room the other night and it completely blew my mind that I actually knew someone here. He brought some of his friends to play on opening night so it does actually look as if we will have a base of local regulars here, which is an element that I initially thought might be lacking. I have a couple of more friends visiting the week after so that should be fun as well. I'll show them what I've found of the nightlife here thus far, then probably head back home to Phnom Penh at least for a few days. The Koreans here would like for me to stay on permanently, but I don't know if I can make that leap.

So opening night was yesterday and we did have a game. In fact we've had several this week as we did an impromptu soft opening a few days earlier. It's been mostly $1-$2 NLH thus far, although we did sneak in an omaha game a couple of nights ago. I'll write more about the grand opening and the first few games on my next post. For now I just wanted to give my initial impressions of this town that I have never been to.




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