So basically, if you are the kind of guy, to piss of the wrong people, you better not stay in a place higher than second floor, gotcha......

Serious question, once you pay for protection in a third world country, what guarantee do you really have that you will not get fuked by your protectors (and their associates)? I mean, they could easily blackmail you with false charge of drugs trafficking/drug possession... So easy to get fuked by the locals once your business is really printing money.

This is basically why even a lot of thais stay away from getting too cozy with gangsters and the police.

The upper class knows how to play multiple people at once or play respectable middleman for others to stay in control but this level of maneuvering is not for the faint of heart.

From my perception how things mostly work: Business owner brings in upper class person as partner - upper class person is the go to guy for sorting out the paperwork, taxes, taking care of troubles and getting people new jobs if the place closes. They have relations with police and maybe gangsters but they only use those sparingly as favors are costly and need to be paid / repaid.

I'm pretty sure most of the establishments on khao san road were once in private hand but now it's all police owned. People paid them off and they took over...

pretty sure if you put your balls on the counter in starbucks they'd feel slighted as well

It's why you need to have a connected local as a partner.
Ilia is right about one thing for sure.
If you're shot in the head right outside of your gogo bar and not caught on CCTV, it's probably <1% chance your killer is convicted.

The kind of *** discussed here can happen to you in most 3rd world countries, it's not any specific to Thailand, actually many countries are worse in that, and sometimes can happen in other countries too, especially those with high crime such as the US. But yeah, rama is spot on about ILIA

But it feels super safe

Which countries are worse?

African countries mainly I guess. I dont think it is correct to qualify Thailand as a third world country though

Low salaries (to our standards) do not always equal low quality of life.

Thailand is all about face but what goes on in the background is really ugly stuff...

I believe predatory behavior will severely increase when people can't make their payments anymore to keep the lease of fancy cars due to the stagnating thai economy (nobody wants to go to a third world city where service sector staff are mouthy disrespectful brats to foreigners and hotels are way overpriced).

Just like a drug addict wants drugs by any means, so does the thai when it comes to face. Face costs money and no tourists means no money.

Outside of tourism and everything attached to it the economy is still largely agriculturally focused. (when was the last time you dealt with a thai company for you corporate guys out there?)

https://thethaiger.com/hot-news/econ...baht-per-house

That was before corona mind you. Half a year to a year of no tourists and thais will start to turn on any remaining "rich" foreigner unless he is well integrated, widely respected and can keep the predators at bay.

Would imagine any country in the Americas south of US has to be 10x more dangerous to set up a business in than Thailand as a whitey.

makes me laugh thinking about some hi-so thai opening a cafe with daddy's money so he can stand around in a barista apron making latte art all day while his s500 sits out front.

wouldn't last a day competing in a real economy with his own money.

next time i go to thailand i'm going to go to coffee shops and go out of my way to make the manager/owner lose face in front of his staff for laughs.

yeah guys, basically most of the world is like this, it's actually a major reason why the third world is the third world - it's just really difficult to develop and prosper when the deck is rigged for a few elites

in response to Diamond's predestination oriented Guns, Germs, & Steel was Acemoglu & Robinson's Why Nations Fail which posits

i think it's the mix of the two, perhaps geography has a lot to do with creating such circumstances, but social institutions are the backbone of modern economic development

spent entire life as an expat - there's a reason why most expat businessmen in the third world just run hobbyist type businesses, the shakedown is real

this is why morocco has some of the finest leather culture in the world and yet you'd be hard pressed to find any moroccan products in shops in the west - spent a lot of time there and kept trying to set up an export thing and got laughed at a bunch and told it was impossible - the general consensus was once i began gathering shipping containers worth of leather handbags various government officials would magically appear and i'd need all kinds of licenses etc and before i knew it was no longer a feasible business - apparently they've dealt with enough guys over the years who have attempted that and failed that they just tell someone who says they want to buy in bulk to f off because they know the trouble that awaits

likewise, when i was in ecuador, the wealthiest man in the country at the time was the person who was in charge of customs - which is apparently pretty common in latin america - pablo escobar started not as a drug smuggler getting drugs out of colombia but as a smuggler of tvs and radios into colombia because it was impossible to bring them into the country without getting shaken down by the elites

I think it's the unofficial meeting place for the owner, his followers (any wealthy thai always has an entourage) and anyone who might want something from him. They're also probably laundering money that his family gets from corruption and whatnot.

The problem for foreigners is though that we don't know we aren't supposed to be there and it's not a normal business in the developed world sense.

I think that's a bit arrogant to say. Their parents had the brains so chances are they have as well. They're not forced to compete though for what it's worth.

I don't think you're going to live long friendo. Everything I have written about is just to show you that thais are easily triggered into murdering people and not safe people to live around.

they have something like this in beijing but they are private clubs

you'll occasionally see buildings with discreet entrances and no signs and very nice cars parked immediately outside - they wouldn't do it publicly

remember when i lived in seattle there was a vietnamese cafe downstairs that was always full of vietnamese, had all these souped up sportscars parked outside at all times and once or twice i attempted to go in and check it out and they didn't have any english menus and gave me a clear - dude you don't belong here look - like you know in those movies when someone enters the room and everyone hushes and stares - literally that - never a more awkward moment in my life the two times i walked in

Let them do their Vietnamese kitchen business alone fgs

Really? Wild West same same? Share stories SA brahs plz, don't be shy.

Fkn lol at thinking Thailand is not a third world country.

Africa? Which countries are the worst?

Nigeria for sure, Nigerian Mafia, number 1, Nigeria>Thailand, would not want to make business there. South Africa too, but not for the same reason

No food, no drinkable water, no school, no home... in some parts of the continent?

Unless you meant third world only for the business topic, in this case yes I agree that TH is at the bottom of the bottom (of the countries I know enough to comment about)

I've lived in Thailand for 12 years, married a Thai, have a family, lived in a few different cities, when I give advice to people new to Thailand rule number 1 is, keep your head down, don't go around playing the big shot, it will get you killed.

I was talking about corruption/doing business. No one talked about drinkable water or school...

Yes I edited and added the bottom part, I thought you meant third world in general.

Since everyone agrees, let s proceed to the next topic : having unprotected paid sex during quarantine

Not much experience, never tried to start a business in either, and very likely wouldnt attempt to, I do think ILIA is overly paranoid about the whole thing but do believe his words have some truths. Hes probably half way between reality and that poster who used to get into fights with taxi drivers or start law suits over attempted murder on the daily(spiral something).

I've driven the length of central/SA and its just a different animal in terms safety. How often you'll see someone dodgy, Watching your back at night, or not going out after dark at all. Asia is just incredibly tame vrs C/SA. Havent checked but its likely almost a lock that crime statistics back up that claim. I cant imagine a scenario where a country that is 10x more dangerous in day to day life would somehow become safer as you move up the business/status hierarchy.

Even in a scenario where everything ILIA says is absolute truth, gotta be 100x as tough to set up a successful business as a gringo in SA.

"Playing the big shot" is already being a confident aggressive business guy attitude that you'd need to succeed in London and the like in mid level positions.

If you don't adjust down to peasant servant level attitude / humble grandpa really quick, dress down and keep very little money in your pockets people will start preying on you or getting offended by your attitude, given that you're a nobody locally.

Everything is largely geared towards old retired guys that take care of people financially for little tangible reward and don't threaten anyone status wise.

It would be interesting to see stats about foreigners murdered/suicides SA vs SEA. Or even better Colombia vs Thailand.

SA is probably ruled by cartels so politically stable, local mafia/street gangs under control, military hierarchy style. TBH I have no clue, but I would imagine that they have better things to do that murdering/extorting foreigners for money. Now compare that with countries who have a coup d'état every 10 years. Not as structured as SA, much more predatory, Wild West style.

Long-term, as a foreigner (business talking, bars, nightclubs, restaurants, etc), no one is safe here (unless you are REALLY connected/part of an organized crime group).


Ask Tim Sharky