Are any of the poker rooms non-smoking? (in the metro manila area, not Angeles)

Several have the policy of no smoking at the table, but at many places people seem to just turn around at their seat and have the ashtray at a small table behind them. Room 18 in Mabini have a smoking zone further away from the tables, so that would be closer to what you'd call a non smoking room, I think it's the same as the Metro cardclub, but I'm not sure? I've been to Room 18 quite a few times last month, it's only like a month old and seem to have 25/50 and 50/100 running every night.

Showers with no hot water, in a lot of places. Standard way of taking a bath in this country in a home is to fill a plastic drum with water and ladle water upon yourself. I've gotten used to it, but sometimes I need to have a kettle of water boiled and added so I can take a warm bath. I usually only get a warm shower in the Philippines when I stay in a hotel or go to a spa for a (legit) massage.

Yea, I know what you mean. A lot of places in SE Asia -- cheap hotels especially -- have an "open shower" (without curtains or enclosures), and hot water is hard to come by. I love scalding hot showers so I love my place in that regard.

Going off on a tangent. I wanna rant about the one thing I really don't like about Manila.

I hate it when people try to scam me, even if it's for a small amount. Foreigners have a target on their back for being naive, and some Filipinos have had success with scamming them in the past.. that's why they still do it. But we foreigners can stop this shady behavior. How? We need to refuse to give into their demands. THIS MEANS YOU YOYO.

The other day, yoyo and I took a cab home from Burgos. The cab driver asked for 80 pesos (with the meter, it would've cost 40-45). Jonny said OK, while I shook my head, and we were off. When we got to Jonny's place, the driver asked me where I was going and I told him Joya, right around the corner. He asked for 50 extra pesos. TO GO AROUND THE CORNER. WTF. I know it's only $1 USD we're talking about but I truly hate **** like that. This happened because he thought I would agree to whatever he asked for. But no, I threw 80 pesos at him and walked home.

The moral of the story is: STOP ENABLING THESE SCUMBAGS.

All that I have used have this annoying habit of occasionally spurting out scalding hot water.

Paul, I think you forfeited your right to complain when you agreed to get in a cab without a meter. You obviously know better and had a moment of weakness. The moral is to refuse to get into a cab without a meter, even if you have pass up four or five before you find one. Also, negotiate everything ahead of time.

And its not only foreigners who get scammed. There's an entire mentality that favors chasing short-term profits. The laws are so weakly enforced that it is practically an anarchic form of capitalism....(but that belongs in a different forum).

Just to clarify:
I was alright with paying the 80 pesos*. My problem was with the driver being greedy and thinking he could take advantage of me after we dropped Jonny off. My point was that we need to stop making ourselves victims. They scam you once, they think they can scam you again.. and this applies to foreigners as a group.

Also, I'm sure you are right about locals getting scammed too but they are not targeted as often or as extremely as foreigners are.

*because with Jonny I wasn't about to suggest that we find another taxi. But when I'm alone I always convince the driver to put the meter on. I am hardcore about this issue to the point where I am ready to report a taxi driver to the DOTC if he tries to scam me. I have not had any problems yet.

how's the weather?

I just don't think that taxi thing is a scam. You agreed to a deal then you tried to change the terms of the deal. True, it was a short distance, but it is still a change and I blame you for the mistake of thinking you could easily get away with that. So, it is greedy and short-sighted, but not a scam. Probably a lot of things that you view as scams are really foreigners just being horrible at bargaining.

hot. For Manila, forecasted lows are 78-ish, highs are 87-91 for the next few days.

As far as scams goes, people are gonna scam you no matter if you're a foreigner, local, black, white, Asian, Mexican, etc etc. If you make yourself to look like a mark, then by golly, people are gonna target you for ripe pickins.

FWIW, the BIGGEST taxi scam I've been a witness to was in New York City when I was a kid lol. The taxi driver was a big mean lookin dude.

Anyways, more importantly, how's the action at the girlie bars on Burgos St??

lolll - it's not about enabling. It's about it not being worth even 1 minute of my time talking to them about a dollar. If they want 20x the rate to drive me somewhere, it's not worth my time to negotiate or interact with them. Just drive already imo...

On a different note, if someone does exceptional work, they deserve exceptional pay. I don't care if market value for their work is 1000 peso, if I think it deserves 5000 or 10000 peso, that's what I'll give them - and you and the rest of the foreigners will have to live with that

Firstly, without trying to sound like a deuche, my time is valuable and whilst "principles" are all good and well, it's simply not worth my time to argue about cents and dollars.

Secondly, to the guy that said he walks away even when they're yelling at him, that shows incredible naivety about the dangers of the Philippines. A lot of people carry here - you should avoid conflict at ALL costs. Always. And that's not just in the Philippines, I've seen people get glassed at clubs in Australia which result in facial scars for the rest of their lives over the most ridiculously trivial things. Good luck with that attitude. It's not +EV. My friend's fiance got a bottle smashed on his face after he made an insulting comment to some random South African fans when they were watching an Aust/SA cricket match at the casino - he was in hospital for weeks, his face is horribly scarred, Australian Medicare pays for most of the hospital bills but he'll need to pay tens of thousands for plastic surgery to attempt to reduce the scarring. I call him Frankenstein and he's a f**king moron imo.

Thirdly, negotiating reasonable off-meter rates can be +EV - when I first got here 18 months ago, I would occasionally insist on the meter. Very often, one of two things would happen - I would be forced to wait ages for another cab (wasted valuable time and tilt) or the cab driver would sulkily put the meter on and then take you for a merry-go-round taxi ride all over the joke that is the Manila traffic system (wasted valuable time and tilt).

Fourthly, there are moral considerations. Whilst that specific taxi driver was a dick trying to charge you another dollar for a 100m drive, these taxi drivers run on incredibly low profit margins due to the very high price of fuel and ever-increasing daily rates for them to hire their taxis. If he wants $2 instead of $1 for a fare, I'm not going to argue with him. The poor guy is working hard for his family, when so many of his countrymen are slumming around being lazy and doing nothing.

--------

Yes, I splash money around here and I'm very generous with tipping and whatnot when the service is of a quality that deserves it. And yes, sometimes that generousity bites me in the ass occasionally, like when I gave this massage girl 5x what she asked for and she repays me by hanging onto me and screaming that I didn't pay her (she got bodyslammed into the floor by the security guard and fired on the spot - she was new and I was a regular there so she couldn't have picked a worse target), but I will continue to overpay for hard work as I'm happy to do it and I can afford it. If it slightly drives up the cost of living for other foreigners, I have no problem with that. Life is so cheap here anyway....

I'm with Paul B. on the taxi scam. I was in similar situations where they claimed they didn't have a meter on several occasions. I got out of the cab and found a new one with a meter every single time, except the last time, because i was in a hurry to get to the airport and i didn't wanna be late; but even then i talked him down to half his originally quoted price.

Using the "i'm worth X amount of dollars a minute justification is silly for so many reasons. Also, i would rather waste my valuable time, then let someone take advantage of me or think he took advantage of me, even for a tiny amount. I guess it's a pride/principle thing.

I'm all for rewarding people for doing a good job and giving money to people less fortunate then me, but i do it on my terms, not theirs. I would gladly give 5x the going rate to the someone doing a good job for an honest price, then the guy who does the same quality of work, but tries to take me for even slightly more then the job is worth.

My 2 cents.

My forum behaviour is generally pretty pristine, but your first comment makes you sound like a complete tool. imo. Driving 12-14 hr days through SE Asian traffic would be one of the hardest jobs in the world.

Your last comment is ******ed. And that's a millionaire telling you that.

Have you ever heard the saying, "Don't sweat the small stuff."

Arguing with a poor local over $1 with the possible end result of animosity and potential danger is ALWAYS ******ed.

You say "silly for so many reasons" yet you offer up only one: pride.

Pride is ******ed if it costs you money and tilt.

And let's use a hypothetical - if your hourly rate is $300/hr and you have to wait another 20 min for a cab who uses his meter, you've just paid $100 for your principles. Doesn't sound like a very smart line if you do this often. Actually, it sounds very very silly to me.

Well, it actually is +EV for yoyo to pay the extra money (game theory wise, an unfortunate win-win scenario for him and the scammer). By the way, I've already discussed this issue with him before. I understand his perspective and have told him that he makes too much money for his own good, but I wanted to rant about it here to hopefully get others to join the anti-scam crusade.

On to another topic: foreigners who are living in the Philippines, how are you cashing out? I cannot wire money out and am looking for another option.

As I understand it, a taxi driver in the Philippines will commonly work 12-15 hours per day for a take of something like P500-1000 on a good day. However, they have some days where they have a negative earn since what happens is the driver pays the company a set fee per day, pays for gas, and keeps the rest. My guess is that a single white male entering a cab will often be asked if he wants a girl because the taxi driver is looking for additional streams of revenue.

I don't have a problem if taxi drivers get fools to overpay. I play poker. I make money from people who are willing to overpay for draws. Why should I be upset if someone else is making other people overpay for things, so long as the terms of the deal are negotiated up front and it's not a case of price-gouging for life essential needs?

Personally, I would always wait for the metered taxi unless it was important, but I have frugal instincts. I also get the impression from relatives that there is a greater potential for other dangers if you use an unmetered taxi as you are more likely to be in an illegal, unlicensed cab.

Actually, i didn't offer any reasons. I only gave my opinion if i were to use that justification.

You do understand that it's okay for principles to cost yourself money? Ethics, honesty, and charity also often end up costing money. Should we do away with those to just because it would create a -EV situation?

That's a very good argument and I had to think awhile before responding to it. I guess that yes, sure, it's ok for your principles to cost you money and my principles often do. However, the pain and tilt and wasted time of insisting on meters to save a dollar here and there is simply not worth it for me and I won't ever be doing it...

What is worse for you, the tilt or the wasted time? If it caused you zero tilt (as it does for me), would you reconsider?

PokrLikeItsProse: I think the tilt is worse for me than the wasted time. But I am one of those people who cannot stand waiting for something. I cannot stand in lines for anything, ever. If there was no tilt, i.e. maybe I had a really interesting book I was in the middle of and could read whilst I wait for another taxi, I could *theoretically* reconsider. But really I don't think so - I'd just pay the dude what he wants and get on with my day at as fast a speed as possible.

vieuxfromage: I didn't mean my previous post to sound as harsh as it did. I tried to edit it not long after posting it but it was too late. I don't really think I have much of an ego, no. I have never been in a physical fight in my life, but I lose my temper in frustration all the time and often yell at incompetent people when I should be more zen.

I do agree that just because you may have an hourly rate of $300/hr doesn't mean every hour is worth that, I accept your point. But as I work so hard, I consider time not working to be extremely valuable and will never waste it in the hot sun or waste it arguing with a poor taxi driver over pennies. I'd much rather overpay huge if there is even a small chance that I get to my destination faster due to the driver being more motivated and/or less likely to take a long route out of spite.

lol I like you man! Sound like paul is a cheap bastard. 80 pesos to get a cab? I mean wtf you honeslt think you should have payed 50 pesos when the meter start at 40? LOLOLOOL. Dude I suggest giving them those 1 dollar tip before ypou get shanked. I would rather live than be frugal ! Those ****ing drivers make so little. Gas is still 40 pesos a liter and the traffic in manila is so bad. Where do you think they get their profit from? Yes from begging passengers to givem them 20 pesos.


I dont like how they operate but they gotta do what they got to do to make some money.

I'm a utilitarian. I oftentimes go out of my way to try to make things right, to better society. I can't stand shadiness, bad service, mistreatment, etc, and have spent a lot of time fighting these things so that others don't go through what I did. So when individuals or establishments try to scam me or treat me like dirt, I do my best to stop their behavior. This means not giving in no matter how small the cost, informing others, etc. Yes, sometimes it makes me look nitty but I do it knowing that I am contributing to correcting these problems, and if you think I'm cheap because of that, so be it.

I also completely disagree with your last statement re: they gotta do what they gotta do. I don't approve of dishonesty in any form and I'm surprised that you do. People can make a living the honest way imo.

There was this time I was in Bangkok and after hitting the clubs at RCA, cab drivers would ask me for 3-5x the going taxi rate. I understand their situation because it's late at night and you want to go home and they're the only mode of transportation at that time so I'm left with no choice, i'd be glad to pay them that just as long as they get me to where I need to be and that is back to my hotel where I'm safe. I consider safety first so it doesn't matter if I'm paying more for the chance to live again another day.

As for Filipino taxi drivers, yeah they have a ****ty job like all the other Filipino blue-collared workers, third world country man. I have nothing against correcting these scammers but let's not generalize every taxi driver or any worker for that matter. There are some workers who are very principled until a certain scenario which leads them to stray away from their principles and act upon an urgent matter, which is to get more money. I mean this guy might be scamming you for like 100pesos ($2 and change) he knows that foreigners can afford it, it will help him buy more medicine for his dying mom. Life is hard here in the Philippines and at the same time and it is true that these taxi drivers are the breadwinners of their family, try to put yourself in their situation what would you do?