240 entrants

1st-10th = good money
11th-20th = $6800
21st-30th = $3400

22 left. Blinds 2000-4000(400)
My table is 7 handed.
I have 80,000 exactly.

Hero has KQo in the CO
Fold, Villain opens to 10,500, Fold, Hero ??

Villain is middle-aged to old. Claims to have won an EPT event 2 years ago. Plays mildly aggressive. He was short earlier but shoved 2 hands in a row, picked up the blinds both of them. He then shoved for a 3rd time in a row with J8hh UTG and like 9-10BBs. He tripled up after beating KK and 99 in a 3-way allin. So I mean hes not a nit.

My image is supertight.



My initial thoughts were that all 3 options had merit (fold, shove, call).

Not sure whats best though.

Does he cover you?

I'm a nit: you have plenty of chips to play so why make a move with a hand where you are likely to be dominated. Wait for a better spot.

yes he has like 100-150k

does he seem like the type of player to call with AJs here or 99? I think this is reallty close, but I would fold. Calling sucks imo. You have a workable stack and can put yourself in better spots to take jabs at the blinds/get it all in rather than shove your whole stack in a marginal spot.


The more I think about it though, shoving may be best. tough spot.

definitely wait for a better spot...calling that much of your stack is pretty bad, and shoving you don't get called by too many worse hands and it's not worth a flip when you're not losing that much equity by waiting for a good spot

I think I fold here usually. I dunno maybe I play too tight with 20 bbs tho.

i fold and then reshove something pretty against an mp/lp opener with 17bb an orbit or two later

haven't done math in years but I'd shove this
someone ambitious wanna post math?

This seems like a pretty obvious shove to me, but I could def be way off.

I don't think calling has any merit here Adam, but shoving certainly does.

Oh folding is fine too.

(4:24:42 PM) ASPoker8: i told you i think its marginal
(4:24:48 PM) ASPoker8: and that all 3 options have merit
(4:24:52 PM) ASPoker8: call with the least merit imo
(4:24:55 PM) Thay3r: i agree
(4:25:02 PM) ASPoker8: meh
(4:25:34 PM) ASPoker8: maybe i should just fold
(4:25:39 PM) ASPoker8: fold > shove >>> call
(4:25:40 PM) ASPoker8: or something
(4:26:05 PM) Thay3r: prossibly

prossible imo

you aren't way off

everyone else is just afraid of ever looking foolish

shove >>>>>>>>>>> call and shove all flops > fold >>>> calling with no plan

Nath,
Call and shove all flops is so much worfse than call with no plan. The plan when we call pf is too evaluate everyone's actions and our hand based on the board and than making a good decision. Calling pf and shoving all flops is just ******ed and by far the worst option IMO.

thayers a nit easy shove IMO

image supertight = shovus

I call and eval flop... you have position. No use spewing chips away if you don't need to...

Meh I fold here a lot as a default, but I like a shove fine if he's the typical live type who may fold AQ here but is opening semi-wide as it seems he is.

shovelcake

is that like crumcake

oh yea and shove it in

How can the math be done? We have no idea whatsoever how wide he is opening (now) and cannot be certain whether he calls 88+, AQ or TT+, AK.

We don't know anything about the blinds and stacks he's raising into etc.

I'd suspect he's opening tighter than you might think and will then call wider but that's just total guesswork.

pretty much my thoughts exactly on this hand

Shove, there are very few possible scenarios where I would not shove this. You having a tight image and Villain having a loose image is definitely not one of those scenarios.

Oh yeah I thought about this more how to explain what I meant better. If I shove here it doesn't have a lot to do with the fact that we have KQ, other than that it gives us a few extra ticks of equity when called against his range. I like shoving KQ here about as much as I like shoving 67s (though obv it's a bit better to have KQ, and this is assuming his calling range is the typically tight one of a live player which seems reasonable given the reads we have/our table image). My point is that if I shove here it's mostly for a bunch of other situational reasons, not because "omg we has KQ". It sounds like this may be a good spot and shoving is better than folding, but without the all the additional reads and situational info provided this should default to a fold.