Don't know of a single magic cue, but Rippetoe's five step setup is probably a good starting point.

cock,

I've heard the fourth step is difficult to remember.

JT,

Does your innerspEVrging of rest periods also extend to the DL? Because 1 to 1.5 minutes rest between work sets likely isn't long enough, and is going to ingrain suboptimal form (as your form is likely to be when fatigued).

I'd just do a ton of sub-maximal reps purposefully, and slowly increase intensity and/or volume over time. A ****-ton of triples pulled quickly at 65-70% (or wherever your form looks good) wouldn't be a bad place to start.

I am attempting the 5 step set up and have it memorized. I actually am reciting it for my wife in between many of these sets as she sets up. I remember step four and feel like I exist inside of it when I get there, but for whatever reason what feels like lifting my chest is just not geling for me yet. Even when I see where I achieve a flat back before the pull it is not maintained a lot of the time so I was thinking it is a bracing issue or some other fundamental thing like mobility or imbalance. I just looked up the rippletoe set up again to double check myself and found a video where he is taking a half dozen different people through the set up and it is frustrating to see how easy it is for most people. My wife is another one. She can set up wrong but when I walk her through the steps she nails it.

I am resting probably 4-5minutes on the recent sets. It’s a bit easier to do because I am watching my previous set and changing weights for my wife in between and she is pulling her set. I should probably put a clock on it, though.

This is my plan. I’m going to do one more attempt at a real working weight using the bracing technique I saw in that one video. If there is not a marked improvement I’m scrapping and going to accept that I need to do what you suggest and spend as long as it takes doing light weight before I move anything serious. It is frustrating but I got to man up.

I actually think your back extension is mostly fine. However you're not getting your lats tight at the bottom which makes it look like you get more extension at the top.

Try squeezing the bar with your pinky or turning your elbows in.

Hard to tell but looks like you might not be lifting over mid foot.

Bar is way forward of mid foot during setup and shoulders are over the bar when they should be in front.

Setting up with shins ~1" from the bar should get you part of the way there. You appear to have an ideal body type for deadlifting so it would be exciting to see some triple bodyweight stuff from you down the road.

Ibavly & Renton,

I think you both are right about the bar being too far forward. After watching the rippltoe vid I realized I had somehow brainfarted the clear explanation of midfoot he gives and replaced it with the wrong one.

Thanks!

That's a misinterpretation of what I was saying. I do not think he needs to pay the price since I did, I am saying he has an opportunity right now to learn the lessons I learned the hard way. I am not lamenting my experience, I don't regret it but I had no Monte to surrogate dad me. Sure you all told him it was a bad deal, and now he will find out why. It is a pretty gross exaggeration (bolded below) to say that he will get his life ruined at this point over this $1300 and that is relatively cheap if it teaches him to think twice or ask for advice BEFORE he signs an ironclad MLM scheme some big tittied blonde pitches him on in the future.

Like, I am not even sure what you think I am representing here? I have not said what I would do or what I think should happen, or what I would do with my kids.

I would pay it. I may attempt to negotiate it down at my age now, knowing what I know about the world, but I would live up to what I agreed to. I would not lose my ability to eat or live based on it, but I would eventually pay my debt as agreed. I don't much care if others do or not. I understand that people breaking their word is a cost of business and I am sure the backers do too. AS I said, I am interested in where others draw the line for their choices and why. I am far, faaaaaar from a squeeky clean moralist and still think there are more important implications in this situation for hero than whether he is a good guy or a bad guy. It's not even about that judgment.

As far as how this situation fits my politics, which is not the same as my morals at all, the idea of entering an agreement, getting what you want out of it until it no longer suits you, then reneging on your end of it with a declaration that it was never fair to you after the fact is Trumpian af.

Lastly, I was not thinking you are deplorable. I honestly don't know where you stand on things and have not tried to peg you. I have noted you seem to be a bit over-sensitive to anything that seems SJWish, but that doesn't make you fall into the deplorable bucket by default AFAIK.

Another fact about this to add is I am as naive as N1 when it comes to backing agreements. The deal he got and the paying 50% of make-up, if you leave, doesn't seem that unfair to me without doing any research on what is standard. I don't really pretend that my hot take on that is valuable, though, because I am uninformed on the topic.

JT,

I'm more over-sensitive to SJWism as performance art/social signaling than the underlying points, but as you like. Chopping my legs away, bit by bit. Also, calling my position Trumpian is kind of ridiculous when, if you extend your position to society at large, debtor's prisons and/or indentured servitude would come back for real-real and not just effectively/for play-play, as they are now.

My position is simple: I don't think you get to a) have a business model that expressly targets the poor and/or desperate and b) get bent out of shape when the extraordinarily favorable terms of the deal (to you) increase your risk of having the debt defaulted on (indeed, how best to balance that downside risk with how much you're pulling out of your horse is probably the main decision to be made with that sort of business). This is putting aside the fact that the contract isn't even enforceable legally, so you can be damn sure my advice to someone like N1 that can't afford to pay (lest you forget, in addition to this debt, he's also got somewhere between 5 and 10k of credit card debt if memory serves).

Ultimately, maybe he'll luckbox out of this position, win 15 buyins, and actually quit, and all this will be moot. Regardless, saying actually paying this debt will lead to some real learning and growth is probably the most ridiculous part of this entire conversation.

Re: backing deals, an actual backer (ibavly, not sure if he still does it) explained in that very thread that such arrangements aren't typical, and why he feels they're bad business.

I mean, lol? I assume the first sentence is supposed to apply to my motivations? You are entitled to your guesses there, but I wouldn't stand too firm on them.
Dude, Seriously. I guess I can qualify this by saying I hardly disagree with your position as you have stated it and I understand it. I was more talking about the other people itt. I certainly am not saying that your position is Trumpian, I am saying the position I outlined is. I am not the one who extrapolated any of this out to broader political implications. The dude made a deal and now the question is should he live up to it or not. That's not all that deep.

K. I mean the minimum payment trap he is in on said CC debt is far worse than paying half of his make-up back IMO.

That is not what I am saying. What I am saying is that the focus shouldn't be how he doesn't need to pay it back instead of on hey, dude, don't be a ****ing mark in the future because you won't always get away with it. IF he has to pay it is not the end of the world and will be a painful, but important lesson. This dude, specifically, does not seem to hear things very well or learn things very easily until he experiences the good or bad consequences.

Really, dude, I am having trouble keeping up with when we are talking about my/your greater political leanings, moral obligation as a whole, society, N1, legality of poker backing, my hypocrisy, or what. I don't think we disagree as much as you seem to though, except maybe on how black and white a position need be.

Uh, no? You made a general comment about your perception of my reactions to certain issues, and I clarified my feelings. I dislike attention whoring; nowhere did I even hint or intimate I was referring to you. Put your dander back down, son.

I think this advice we can both take here. It really seems like you think I am attacking you when I am not, as well. I will take some responsibility for that based on bad posting maybe. FWIW you did kinda call me a bad liberal in an earlier post, emphasized my use of the word privilege etc, so it isn't that much of a stretch to misinterpret. Also FWIW, I am not heated at all. Like not even warm.

I didn't call you a bad liberal; I was expressing incredulity at the inconsistency, or my perception thereof, in your views. Most reasonable people agree that some of the more usurious forms of contractual debt should be dischargeable under bankruptcy protections; that (I'm assuming) you hold that position while simultaneously thinking he should just suck it up and pay (yet another) moron tax when he's quite literally been paying it however long this backing deal has been going on is just confusing me.

I'm perfectly capable of making that argument here, generally, while acknowledging that my personal code would cause me specifically to pay the debt in full under the terms of the contract as soon as possible. That doesn't mean I think generalizing my response to others is at all valuable or useful. I do recognize, however, that there are a number of aspects of my life that make such a position pretty easy/convenient to hold for the amount of money under discussion in this example. I'd like to think I'd act in a similar manner were I ever relatively leveraged to the extent he is, but ultimately, who can say - there but for the grace of PLOKJ and all that. Regardless, this leveraging of honor and personal responsibility that those in the industry have thrown around (including the mod forum, where someone wants me in MOD JAIL for even suggesting this debt isn't enforceable) is just manipulation by people that want their money from a rock (or goldfish, in this case); I have no sympathy for them. Reread ibav's posts over the last few days for an inside take.

I don't understand the advantage of playing under a stake in these scenarios. Win? Share half the profits. Lose? Share half the losses.

I thought the whole point was that the backer was entitled to half the labor of a winning player? If it doesn't work out, that's the trade-off considering all they're fronting is the capital.

Anything that isn't at least tilted in risk (say you pay ~20% of losses, i dunno) is a sham and akin to a payday lender.

Especially when you factor in that higher stakes, would normally mean higher skill levels (again, I don't know; but it stands to reason).

wat

Unsubscribed

loco,

It was all worth it to out you as a subscriptard.

That was slightly confusing. I thought I was in Johnny's thread and then was sure it was N1h but no it IS actually Johnnys

I don’t really have a strong argument against any of this and never did. I think I may have been lumped into an opposing side somehow, but to be honest with you you’re not going to find me spouting the gambler’s code stuff anywhere because I have always been a rec fish at best and don’t belong to the community that way. Some of it seems a bit over romantic from my POV. I have to assume you think I’m full of **** or back pedaling when I said that my motivation was I was really curious about where and why some other posters drew the line for when a deal needed to be upheld. Why? Because I am not one of the people who thinks they have everything figured out and I wrestle with personal morality questions nearly hourly. I realize I’m a hypocrite. Anyway, your position makes sense to me and I was never appalled by it even before I fully understood it. It’s pretty much where I landed already.

Yes this is kinda true, but like monte was saying regarding not viewin deals through the lens of our own situation...in a former job I sold reasonably large ticket items. We got one of those no credit check “finance” programs and the SJW in me was furious. It was same as cash if you paid in full within 90 days, but on the 91st day it went to the equivalent of 120% interest for the rest of the 12 month period. There was an early pay-off reduction but it was still nuts.

I hated it. It was taking advantage of people who needed help the most. As myself, I spent as long as it took with customers who used it to make sure I explained the way it worked, calculated their payment and helped them put it on their calendar in their phone, drew literal pictures if I had to to make sure they would not get hit with the predatory fee. I explained that they should do whatever they could to pay it off in 90 days. I told them what they would end up paying if they didn’t.

Anyway I had a woman come in one day and did my whole song and dance about not getting hit with their bull****. She was buying a $1000 item and she told me she was fine paying more to stretch it out over the year. I explained how she shouldn’t be fine...she’d end up paying $2200 for a $1000 item! She’d be better off saving the money for 6 months and coming back! I was ready to walk the deal over it. She looked at me and said, the program was great to her. She needed it now, her credit was ****ed and she has a good job now and she wants the item today, not in 6 months. She was happy to have the option because otherwise she would not be able to get what she needed.

What’s my damn point? That backing plan seems bad for me, and it didn’t work for hero, but it may be great for someone who used it to their advantage properly? Idk.

Yet another thing we agree on. I had the exact same reaction!

Dude, I am not really sure why I am squaring off with posters in other people’s logs this week, but I’m feel self-conscious about it. I may be due for a break.

Well I quite enjoyed the Johnny V Greg organic food off in my log. It's positive for me getting different perspectives from people I respect. Even if I don't always agree, it will often encourage me to do some more research on the point in question. Would be a boring place if everyone agreed on everything.

Yeah, I am not adverse to passionate disagreement or even conflict, but it gets exhausting sometimes. I am pointing at myself here as much as anyone else, but the default starting position online is often exposing the other person as a ****ing idiot. There are plenty of idiots around, but when you have thoughtful people involved it is a case of continuously extrapolating the other person's viewpoint or defending your own against the same. Things devolve to that point in person sometimes, obviously, but they don't usually start there.

That is only part of the reason I am thinking about taking a break, though. I am a ****ing addict, clearly, and my god damned drug is this site. It's only at the level of a functional alcoholic so far--I'm not missing my kid's birthday party yet, but I am speeding through their bedtime story so I can make sure to get to the liquor store before it closes. Obviously, I get some positive from this place--plenty. Hell, even the escape from the real world aspect has some merit, but it's a questionable formula and I know I have a problem. Getting worked up in even a mild way about whether someone I have never met thinks I'm an idiot for paying more for organic and giving it even a second of time that could be spent teaching my kid to play chess, playing blocks, being productive at work, reading a god damned book, cleaning the bathroom or even masturbating has got me scratching my head. Then there is the fight club in politics, the keeping up with every development that comes out of the cesspool admin...

The flip side as you are saying, not even counting the pure good interactions around here, is each of those things also has a benefit that is hard to quantify. I get to learn a lot from people who are smart, experienced, educated etc. I get to commiserate with other like-minded people and lash out at anonymous proxies for my real life agitators. I get challenged on things I have accepted and am forced to rethink certain ideas and positions and frequently change my mind or develop further.

Whatever. It is a crutch right now and there are underlying causes to why I am leaning too heavily on it. If anything I need to examine that, but it may be easier to examine by dropping the crutch for a while.

In that regard, I am going to add liquor consumption to my log.

Friday I did back and biceps. I had a bit of a strain in my right shoulder at extension when doing wide grip pull ups, so I cut it short, then tried parallel grip and I seemed fine but I only did a few sets.

Weight 157

Drinks
Friday-4 ounces of tequila in some already loaded margarita mix.
Saturday-none
Sunday-22ounce Sapporo

Back and biceps

Seated Row (60-90s rest)
175x10
220x5
220x5
205x6
205x5
220x4-190x4-160x5

Wide grip pull ups (FUBAR rest)
BWx7

Parallel grip pull ups
bwx12
bwx10

Straight arm pulldowns (60s rest)
4 sets

Jettison curls (90s rest)
50lbs, black band, fat gripsx5

spider/incline db curls (60-90s rest)
4 sets

Hammer curls (60s rest)
4 sets

Inspired by my own rant I decided to order a book on teaching chess to kids and will substitute some of my refreshing the news feed and subscription list time in the evening with teaching my 6 y/o to play.

The boys' school has a chess club that I was thinking of encouraging them to try.

I agree with a lot of what you said about 2p2 use as a crutch; my usage tends to fluctuate with how busy I am at work, but since that often means I'm out of the house, it's not as impactful. Still something I have to monitor when I'm at home, though.

Would it be helpful to get one of those apps that monitors how much time you spend on each app? Actually seeing a number might be the impetus to cut down. I've actually linked some goals to 2p2 usage, unfortunately I've missed them this week so my usage is limited to 30 minutes in the morning which I've now wasted at least 3 reading and replying your to your log I'm meant to be doing my food logs if I can get imgur working. Gl

Ha! I don't need an app to know that it is obscene. I will leave my response less windy than usual so as to not suck up your allotment of 2+2 time with my interesting musings.