The only "true purpose" of this thread was that it was used as a not so hidden infomercial for Dr. Greger and his website/YouTube channel.

If you forced veganism on every organism on the planet, many would go extinct immediately due to inability to live on a plant-based diet. Others would survive but not thrive. And, many that do well on plant-based diets would, without predators to control their numbers, quickly expand beyond the capability of said plants to support their numbers.

Without predation, our planet would be a far worse place. The cycle of life if key to maintaining balance, health, and strength of all animals. "Flesh eating" drives this important cycle.

+∞

The practice of farming and eating animals "generates more greenhouse gases than all of transportation combined":

Source.

Humans eating meat is literally destroying this planet bro. The IPCC, "the United Nations body for assessing the science related to climate change", is telling us we need to eat less meat.

The Lancet, one of the most prestigious journals in the world is also telling us we need to eat less meat.

The best science we have is telling us humans eating meat is destroying the planet.

According to Oxford, "global land use would drop 75% if everyone ditched beef and went vegan That's a lot of potential land that could be converted back to forests/jungles creating the carbon sinks we desperately need to save this dying planet.

The best thing any of us can do right now to help save this planet is to go vegan.

Source.

At this possible terminal phase of human history, I can't even imagine how buried one's head must be in that proverbial sand to not know how badly animal farming is destroying the planet. And obviously it goes without saying, this dire reality is more important than the fact that an optimal diet for human health happens to be a plant based diet, and it's more important than the immeasurable suffering eating we cause to animals. That latter(s) ain't gonna matter if we continue on our current suicidal course and destroy the planet.

For those interested in this depressing subject, watch Cowspiracy and Seaspiracy. Both on Netflix last I checked.

Canned beans are super healthy so I would certainly recommend them. But are they optimal? No. Even BPA free canned beans have dubious chemicals in the lining of the cans. So an even healthier option would be to buy dried beans--which are super cheap--and cook your own beans in an instant pot or something. But still the difference between canned beans and dried beans is marginal at best. Same with organic vs non-organic. Yes organic plants are the optimal choice as they are marginally healthier than non-organic, but non-organic plants are still super healthy. A WFPB diet is what's optimal for humans but within that diet we can always optimize even further no doubt. But that said, I'm still gonna have some canned beans always on hand for the convenience of having beans already precooked, and if the grocery store I'm at are all out of organic oranges, I'll buy the non-organic becuz like the canned beans, it's still a healthy option.

As far as my recipes being suboptimal: that is true. My recipes do have some salt added to them. An optimal diet wouldn't include added salt given its disease causing nature since we can get all the sodium we need in the trace amounts found in plants. Anyone skeptical of this fact just remember that humans evolved without salt shakers and cheetos, and if one is still concerned about getting enough sodium the natural way, just add high sodium foods like celery and goji berries to your daily diet.

That said, I try to keep the sodium on the low side. My daily goal is to keep my sodium below 1000mgs. To put that in perspective, the 2nd healthiest/longest living population ever studied, the herbivorous 20th century Okinawans (96% plant-based/90% unprocessed plants) consumed around 1,100mgs of sodium a day. If you beat out the Okinawans you're doing good. Last I checked the average American consumed 3500mgs of sodium per day.

What's most important for my recipes is that they are health promoting, not that they are optimal. I do have a sweet tooth and I love making healthy, whole grain, high fiber, oil-free, refined sugar free, low sodium desserts. To do that I need to utilized whole grain flour which is healthy but not optimal. For example, oat flour is healthy but not as healthy as rolled oats, and that's not as healthy as steel cut oats, and they're not as healthy as oat groats and one can even optimize further eating sprouted oat groats.

To me, eating perfectly optimal is a cool idea to talk about, but it's gonna be an ideal that most of us can't reach as life will usually get in the way. Take any food you eat and there's probably a way you could level up and make it healthier. Once one makes the transition to a WFPB diet--eliminating the animal products and processed junk thats destroying their health--it's basically a choose your own adventure from there. This thread can certainly be a tool tho to help the more ambitious "level up".

I haven't blogged a video in a while. Let's do these ones:

One more thing. I didn't even address the most idiotic/ironic part of your post.

Source.

Imagine if we could rewild all the land used to grow crops solely to feed animals. That would go a long towards reversing "the 6th mass extinction" event we are causing.

Animal farming was the literal genesis of human civilization. Prior to that, we were hunter-gatherers. I get that you're arguing that veganism would be optimal now, but to argue that any consumption of any animal product is and always has been inherently unethical is not borne out by history -- human or that of the planet.

Do you support reintroduction of carnivores and omnivores? Is it unethical to actively bring in flesh-eating animals that kill and eat other animals? And, if it's ethical for humans to bring wolves into an area, knowing they will consume other animals, is it ethical for humans to hunt deer, for example, in areas where they are overpopulated?

I don't think the consumption of animal products is inherently unethical. For privileged people like you and me, who can easily survive and thrive without animal products, it is. If we have the privileged ability to dramatically minimize our contribution to the massive suffering of billions of animals and the destruction of the planet, then that's what we should do. This isn't complicated or deep.

Beyond the ethics, the best science we have indicates that a diet consisting of unprocessed/minimally processed plants is what's optimal for humans and the best science we have is telling us that animal farming is destroying the planet.

I support whatever is best for the planet. But this is all a red herring. Nothing can change the fact that it is unethical for privileged people like me and you to consume animals. This is a very basic argument. If you have the privilege and ability to not cause suffering to other sentient beings then that's what you should do. Translation: If you can help it, don't be a dick to others.

And by "not cause suffering to other sentient beings" that also means humans. The destruction of this fragile planet is going to cause tons of suffering to billions of humans. We don't need to speed this process up by consuming animal products.

The planet isn't fragile at all. The relative comfort of humans may or may not be "fragile" due to suggestions of changes to the planet's climate, but the planet itself will adapt just fine to whatever gets thrown at it.

So what if it was?

Tell us why you think wfpb isnt optimal?

Brand and source for EPA/DHA and D3?

Brand of shampoo?

Brand of soap?

Make and model of car?

Pants?

Shoes?

Belt?

Thanks in advance.

Peta says you dont need to pe perfect i kinda agree…

I still think true vegans understand the basic principle that voiceless victims need to be protected so we must speak up and spread the message.

Not sure why you are opposed to spreading veganism.

Wtf is a true vegan if it's not one that absolutely adheres to its core principles? Where did I say I'm opposed to spreading veganism?

So far, it seems like:

You about you: "I'm a true vegan because I proselytize to people about the ethics of veganism, but I don't need to be perfect, except for when it's about diet and especially when others are around, but vegan EPA/DHA is 3x the price of non-vegan EPA/DHA and vegan D3 is 10x the price, so I'm okay with not being perfect and so is my wallet. Don't judge or preach to me."

You about me: "Even though you haven't eaten meat in almost 35 years, did absolute raw with no processed foods (sugar, grains, frozen, etc.) for 3 years, do not eat or use animal products, you're not a true vegan like me because you do not proselytize to others."

Well, yes, I don't proselytize, and yes, that's the main reason why I'm a pure vegetarian and not a vegan.

This and the fact you refer to spreading veganism as proselytizing or preaching

By the above logic i could go around commiting all sorts of crimes and land o lakes wouldnt care.

I love poker is right.. this thread and site is full of “do you even lift” bros

Let me clarify my position.

Im not preaching about going vegan. Im literally saying the governments of the world need to make a law making it illegal to kill/exploit living things.

Extend human rights to animals that have sentience.

Im a total libertarian.. except for laws like you cant kill or steal or you have to wear a seat belt. Universal truths type stuff.

Its just mind boggling to me that animals arent extended the same basic rights as not being slaugthered.

We will probably look back at this time period as the dark ages of some sort. What kind of intellectual eats another sentient being.

Ill try and be less preschy but i have to stand up for injustice. It kind of puts me in a bad spot.

I guess you need to define what exactly "spreading" veganism means to you.



The principle of, "I let people live their lives as they see fit" you took to mean that I don't care if people steal, kill, and rape people? Really?



Do you even lift? More importantly, do you even run?


I see... so what do you do each day to spread veganism?

Also, why do you consume non-vegan D3 and EPA/DHA and have a philosophy of it's okay to not be perfect? The least you could do is be strict and not exploit animals... if such laws were made, you'd have to make some major adjustments.

You asked what brand my b12 was and i said walgreens.. i legit have no clue what youre talking about.

No. I never asked which brand your B12 is; I asked which brand your EPA/DHA and D3 is, to which you replied Walgreens. See my post below.

You said I should share my "gift" and spread awareness. Well, I'm sharing it right now with you.

Walgreens D3 is made from cholecalciferol which is derived from sheep. Worse more, the pills are gelcaps, which is gelatin, which is derived from the collagen in animal tissue, skin, and bones. Christ, no offense (in case you're not trolling), but at this point I wouldn't be surprised if you eat Jello and are oblivious as to where it comes from.

But, since you keep missing this question, I'll ask it again in bold:

How do you define spreading the ideology of veganism without preaching?

I read lables so dont buy stuff w gelatin obvi

I take vegan non capsul multivatmins .. have no clue what ur caught up on

I spread my messge by talking to people.. is that preachy to try and wake people up to animal exploitation.

If doing the right thing is preachy then you win.

Too many questions feel like im on trial.

—

What do you do to spread veganism?
What are the optimal vitamins? Brand abd type?
Do you own a dog?


Thx in advance