Some pretty decent lifters (Wendler maybe?) say it's the single best exercise for 1rm bench. Others say why bother, an OHP workout is just a missed bench workout.

Max OHP drills some techniques that are common deficiencies in mediocre benchers. Upper back and lat tightness, core tightness, grinding through reps, strength out of the bottom, etc. But the plane is so different that minimal carryover isn't surprising either.

Are you equally trained in both lifts? Is your OHP between 65% and 75% of your max bench?

Not equally trained at all. I haven't ohp in months and I bench 4 times a week When my bench was 275 my best ohp was 185x4 and that was training them equally. Now I don't train ohp at all really. I think i did 170x4 a couple months ago and my bench is probably 350 ish. That doesn't really help my argument at all though

Mine's like 80 lol. Hence dropping to press once a week.

If anything I think my bench gains drive press rather than vice versa.

I personally don't find thinking in terms of carry over is a very fruitful use of time.

Sweet, thanks for the replies guys.

I'll definitely try out the cycling next bench day, focus more on technique and try the heavy singles for OHP and db flyes. I'm not sure what happened in oct/nov, maybe because I usually don't have a spot when benching I was leaving more in the tank and actually was progressing, but I just didn't feel confident enough I could get more reps so I racked it. Could also be not eating enough and/or ****ty sleep. I've been taking this for preworkout-

Sat 12/6
Usual rolling and stretches

Warmup row- 500m 1:39
DL- 155x5 225x2 275x1 300x1 310x1x5 (60s)
Squat- 45x10 135x3 185x2 200x5x8 (90s)
Kb swings- 45x20x3 (2:30)
Hamstring curls- 110x 10 9 7 (90s)
Slgb- 15x3 (90s)

DLs felt ok, not great. Was deadlifting next to a guy doing triples at 515 so that was cool/humbling/inspiring.

Mon 12/8
Usual rolling and stretches

Warmup row- 500m 1:36
Ohp- 45x5x2 95x3 115x2 130x1 140x1x4 1xf (~2:00 rest)
6 rounds x5 90s rest-
Bench 165x5x6
Cable rows 175x5x6
5 rounds x12 60s rest-
Ez skull crushers 55x 12 12 11 9 9
Ez curls 55x 12 12 12 9 9

First time using a plate for ohp, 140 was a 10lb PR. First 3 reps felt good, although I could do a better job of keeping everything stable below the shoulders and not letting the bar path drift too far forward. 4th rep was a slight grind but I thought I would be able to get a 5th one up. I fought it for a while, but got stuck before clearing my head. Thoughts on trying 140x1x5 again next week or move up to 145?

Bench felt great. I really focused on keeping my back tight and I realized that I haven't been keeping it tight nearly as long as I could. Some sets when it would feel heavy I think I let the tightness go even before my first rep. Hopefully this revelation will lead to PRs and moving up to non jellydick weights.

Didn't have enough time to try out the db flyes or do abs, but I got a nice pump in...

There's no need to confine yourself to only one weight for worksets. Your goal is to do 5 successful heavy singles (no fails). If that looks like 140x1x2, 145x1x2, 140x1 then that's fine. Just start with a weight you know you'll be able to get for the first rep, then adjust upwards or downwards from there.

I see a pic but for some reason there are clothes hiding your massive pump. What is this, BtM pic cocktease day?

DF, ahh ok, I'll adjust next time.

Yugo, I'm only prepared to post a pic of a slight tear in my t-shirt, not ready for the full nude yet. Although I did explain to my gf that if she ever caught me taking a shirtless pic it would be for a bunch of dudes on the internet, not some girl, so there was no need to worry. So I'm taking the steps to full topless soon

Tue 12/9
Usual rolling and stretches

Warmup row- 500m 1:39
Squat- 45x5x2 135x3 185x2 225x2 250x1 305 (walkout) 265x5x3 (4:45, 5:30, 6:15)
Rdl- 95x5 135x3 160x5x5 (90s)
Hamstring curls- 110x 7 6 6 (90s)
Cable pull throughs- 165x10x3 (90s)
Slgb- 15x3 (90s)
Abs 3 rounds-
Rkc x30 x29 x25
L/R x70 x60 x55
Sb crunches x35 x30 x30

None of the squats felt super heavy, however I was pretty winded after the first two reps of each set and they ended up taking a while to complete. I was much closer to giving up in between reps while trying to catch my breath than I was after I went down.

Thu 12/11
Usual rolling and stretches

Warmup row- broken ~300m
Bench- 45x5x2 135x3 165x2 175x1 185x2 190x2 195x2x2 (1:30, 2:30, 3:30, 3:45)
6 rounds x5 90s rest-
Ohp 110x5x6
Chin-ups 5x6
5 rounds x12 60s rest-
Db skull crushers 17.5x 12 12 12 10 12
Db curls 22.5x12x5
Db flyes 17.5x12 22.5x10x3
Abs 3 rounds-
Rkc x31 x27 x25
L/R x70 x65 x55
Sb crunches x35 x30 x30

It's definitely a lot tougher to keep my back tight with heavier weight (lifting off seems like the worst part), but I think I did an ok job at it today. 185x2 was pretty easy, 190 was solid, the first 195 I decided to take a breath on each rep instead of doing both in one, wasn't too tough. Second 195 was a slight struggle but I think probably had 200x2 in me if I really wanted it.

Tried Db flyes for the first time, not sure I was doing them right. I felt a stretch way out to the side of my chest, close to my armpits. Good or bad?

Sat 12/13
Usual rolling and stretches

Warmup row- 500m 1:44
DL- 155x5 225x2 275x1 305x1 315x1x5 (60s)
Squat- 45x10 135x3 185x3 200x5x8 (90s)
Kb swings- 45x20x3 (2:30)
Hamstring curls- 110x 10 8 8 (90s)
Slgb- 15x3 (90s)
Abs 2 rounds-
Rkc x30 x27
L/R x45 x45
Sb crunches x30 x25

Felt sick right before my warmup row so wasn't sure how today was gonna be, but once I started deadlifting I felt fine. 315 was ok, I felt like I was rounding but I've felt that way before and when I saw video it was fine. Gonna record next week.

Mon 12/15
Usual rolling and stretches

Warmup row- 500m 1:37
Ohp- 45x5x2 95x3 115x2 125x1 135x1 140x1 145x1 140x1x3 (2-3:00 rest for all 140+ reps)
6 rounds x5 90s rest-
Bench 170x 5 4 4 4 4 4
Cable rows 175x5x6
5 rounds x12 60s rest-
Ez skull crushers 55x 12 12 12 10 10
Ez curls 55x 12 12 12 12 10
Db flyes- 20x 12 10 10 (2:00)
Abs 3 rounds-
Rkc x31 x28 x25
L/R x70 x65 x60
Sb crunches x35 x35 x30

First 140 for ohp felt pretty good so I went for 145 which was really tough so I dropped back to 140. The last 3 140s were all kinda easy so maybe I should have tried 145 again, but I really didn't think I had it again after that first rep, meh.

Tue 12/16
Usual rolling and stretches

Warmup row- ~300m
Squat- 45x5x2 135x3 185x2 225x2 255x1 315 walkout 270x5x2 4x1 (4:30, 6, 8)
Rdl- 95x5 135x3 160x5x5 (90s)
Hamstring curls- 110x 8 7 6 (90s)
Cable pull throughs- 170x10x3 (90s)
Slgb- 15x3 (90)
Abs 1 round-
Rkc x30
L/R x60
Sb crunches x30

Pretty sure 270 was a 1RM PR for me, so 270x5 was definitely a PR. Should have gotten the last rep on that last set but on my more fatigued reps I was getting too far forward and on my toes and I couldn't quite get it that time. Pretty sure that is my 2nd ever failed rep. Meh, should be able to get it next week I think.

I have a few small things nagging me (left wrist, left shoulder, and now somewhere around my right hip flexor) that could develop into real injuries if I push them too hard. Luckily none of them have hurt or limited me in any way while lifting, but I'm definitely doing extra stretching and will stop lifting if anything hurts while I'm doing it. I'm taking a trip back east for like 8 days starting the 26th so hopefully that time off gets me back close to 100%.

Lol. "Time off."

You're training strongman with me.

****. Well I'll have a few days down in ct first to rest before doing strongman I guess. Maybe I'll meet the sawman if I'm lucky. Wtf am I doing awake right now

Thu 12/18
Usual rolling and stretches

Bench- 45x5x2 135x3 165x2 185x1 200x1 205x1 210x2* 205x2* 205x3* 205x2* (2-3min rest)
6 rounds x5 90s rest-
Ohp 110x 5 5 5 5 4 4
Chin-ups 5x6
5 rounds x12 60s rest-
Db skull crushers 17.5x12x5
Db curls 25x 12 10 9 8 8
Db flyes 17.5x 12 10 10

Did the first two singles of 200 and 205 by myself but thought I might need a spot to go for 210. I asked this middle aged azn guy I see there all the time to spot... Big mistake. I told him I'm just going for one and to only help if the bar starts to go back down, so naturally he says "you got more than one" and proceeds to hold the bar the entire way and basically prevents me from stopping at one rep. Not only this but he keeps coming back even though I don't ask him and holds the bar on my last three sets as well. He didn't speak much english besides random gym bro encouragement bs I'm sure he's picked up along the way, so trying to explain how he was an idiot probably wouldn't have helped. Meh. I guess I'll go back to 3x3 next week and hope to find a competent and preferably english speaking spotter.

Sat 12/20
Usual rolling and stretches

Warmup row- 400m meh
DL- 155x5 225x2 275x1 305x1 320x1x5
Squat- 45x10 135x3 185x2 200x5x8 (90s)
Hamstring curls- 90x10x3 (90s)
Slgb- 15x3 (90s)
Abs 2 rounds-
Rkc x30 x28
L/R x60 x50
Sb crunches x35 x30
DL- 225x1x7

Deadlifts actually felt pretty good up until 305, then went to ****, imo. Did a bunch of 225 singles at the end to try and work on my form but idk if they were any better. My hips are definitely moving up first and I'm using too much back. I'll post the videos later.

Squats didn't really feel good after the first few sets. Tried to do a few kb swings and felt like **** so scratched those. Sessions like these make me want to quit going for heavier weights and just loco/EV it up and rep til I pass out for aesthetics.

Wrists also didn't feel great during a few DL reps and toward the end of squat sets. I think I need to do a better job of keeping them straight and also need to ice/stretch them more.

Mon 12/22
Usual rolling and stretches

Warmup row- 500m 1:39
Ohp- 45x5x2 95x3 115x2 130x1 140x1 145x1 *155xf 140x1 140x3
6 rounds x5 90s rest-
Bench 170x 5 5 5 4 4 4
Cable rows 175x5x6
5 rounds x12 60s rest-
Ez skull crushers 55x 12 10 10 10 9
Ez curls 55x 12 12 12 10 8
Db flyes 20x10x3
Abs 3 rounds-
Rkc x31 x30 x26
L/R x65 x55 x50
Sb crunches x30 x30 x30

Did more wrist/forearm stretching today and I think that helped. I noticed that on bench and ohp, the only time I felt anything in my wrists was when unracking and racking, so I made sure to keep everything really tight and straight the whole time.

I got 140 and 145 pretty easily so I gave 150 a shot and didn't move it more than a few inches. It was such a fail that I wasn't confident in the next 140, however that felt like I had another rep in it so went amrap on the last 140 and they were all easy.

Edit- just realized I put on two 10s and tried 155 instead of 150 lol, at least that means it's not just in my head, it actually is too heavy. Should be able to get 150 next time, imo.

Tue 12/23
Usual rolling and stretches

Warmup row- 500m 1:36
Squat- 45x5x2 135x3 185x2 225x2 260x1 315(walkout) 270x5x3 (5:30, 7:30, 8:30)
Rdl- 95x5 135x3 165x5x5 (90s)
Hamstring curls- 110x 10 7 5 (90s)
Cable pull throughs- 175x10x3 (90s)
Slgb- 15x3 (90s)
Abs 2 rounds-
Rkc x31 x31
L/R x65 x60
Sb crunches x35 x35

Took a lot of time in between squat sets but 3rd set>2>1 and I probably had another rep or two in the tank on the last set. When I walked out 3 plates part of me wanted to just go for it, maybe I'll try out 1RMs when I'm in Boston with DFII next week.

Well this is perfect. I have been meaning to ask this here for a while and have been to busy.

I remember, I think, reading earlier itt that it is better to go for a set with a shorter time between sets than it was to rest an extra 15-30secs or how many ever you need to feel better. As in its better to do a set, have a normal wait of 60secs and then go for it again even if your tired and end up not hitting your given rep count than it would be to do a set take 90secs and get the reps you want?


Maybe a better example would be do 8 bicep curls take 60 secs no matter what then do 6 curls rather than if you had taken 90secs to get another 8 in. Which would be better? Or does that just apply to when you are trying to gain muscle mass? Or am I way off?

It depends on your goals and your training history.

Muscle growth happens as a result of three distinct types of training; heavy loads, muscle damage, and metabolic waste. Most of us on this forum have spent a lot of time training in heavy sets of 5 and have experienced some muscle growth due predominantly to the loads that we used. The program that Dub and a couple other people are on maintains some degree of heavy loading, but for the most part it revolves around the latter two types of training; doing a lot of damage to the muscles by controlling the eccentric portion of the lifts and also building a lot of metabolic waste (burn, pump, fatigue) by mandating short rest intervals and a high overall level of volume.

In short if your goal is to gain muscle you should train in whichever of the three qualities you are most noobish at. If you have a long history of heavy sets of 5 then that probably means taking lighter weights, doing more overall work, and mandating short rest intervals. But of you already have a history of doing controlled sets of 10-15 to feel the burn and catch a pump then focusing on heavy sets of 5 and taking as long a rest as you need is probably a better short term plan, at least until yon've balanced out a bit.

If you goal is purely strength then the answer is a bit more complicated and depends on training age and recovery capabilities, but technique and quality of work are more important in strength work so I'd err on the side of resting enough so each set is sure to be good.

TY.

Yeah I basically do sets of 8-10 with as heavy weight as I can go take X# of secs rest to catch my breath and get ready for the next set. Though there often is another set for another body part in the middle. As in 8 curls then 9 pull ups then 8 curls then 9 chin ups, kinda ect. The exact moves change the part of the body they directly work out do not.

I wouldn't mind some more strength I would basically just like a more defined shoulder going into your tricep and bicep area/ bigger bi's but only by a little. I think my main problems are amount of food that I eat and how much protein I take in. As in I lack in both of those areas. I hate the taste of protein mix, I mean hate it, but I take a scoop before and after a given workout though it says one should take a scoop 5 times a day, which I think would kill me.

It'd be fun to come up and work out with you all at some point in life, obv do other fun things as well.


Also as a random side note I have a note in my PC that tomorrow is dubbys birthday, IDK how it's in there but if its true happy birthday bud.

It is my bday, thanks!

I'd suggest starting a log in h&f and state your goals and your current routine. Obv asking questions in here is perfectly fine, however starting your own thread will get more views and you might get more responses/advice to your specific questions. It's also good for accountability as well as tracking your progress, imo.