You realise that nothing has been announced yet, right?

Sure, and I reserve the right to laugh at Dana for whatever other dumb thing he does if this fight doesn't materialize, but it seems from what guys like Ariel are saying that the fight will happen, which is LOL enough, but it also seems likely, given what we've seen in the past, that Conor would headline.

I mean, Conor headlined over 170 @ 189 and 185 @ 194. This can't surprise anybody now.

RT,

I think top billing matters in all manner of entertainment for a reason, even if I personally think it's stupid. I also think it's a bit of a relic from the boxing model, whose fights are often singularly promoted. UFC's model was built to emphasize the brand over the fighter, so they can get away with leaving the more hyped fight off the top, but I still think the status of it has some negligible impact. When Dana came up with his reason, most fans knew it was just a promoter BSing. So, him reneging on that rule was merely an inevitability.

Nate on UFC on Fox:

Some Guy on Twitter-"After you beat Conor, will you take him under your wing and teach him the way of the American Ninja?

Nate: Hey, he shoulda joined a long time ago.

Please don't change Nate

I'm legitimately surprised at how Nate's been taking this new-found fame. I've never seen him this open, and loose. It's quite nice.

Yeah, Nate's definitely gained some new fans, me included, with the way he's been dealing with the whole Conor situation. I used to view him and his brother as a couple of whiny little douchebags, but now every time I see him interviewed it seems like he's a pretty straightforward dude who just wants to fight.

WAT?

I'll just chalk that up to not looking hard or long enough to understand what they were really about.

theyre pretty huge whiny douchebags when they lose

Anything doesn't go their way, everybody is at fault except themselves. They have a finely tuned "woe is me" attitude, and never take responsibility for any failures, or faults.

However, these things are oddly endearing at the same time, because among a host of crafted personalities in professional sports, the Diaz brothers are who they are, dammit. It also means it's probably impossible to get in their heads, which makes Conor's mind-games pointless as far as gamesmanship. If they lose, it's bull****. If they win, they're not surprised, mother****ers.

If they lose its because of poor judging, cheating, steroids, etc. They never believe that they actually lost.

LOL you guys. Except after their lip service which is all it is, they don't dwell on it or make it more than it is, they just go back in the gym and outwork and out learn their opponents. Neither are what you would call particularly gifted athletes but they have certainly maxed out their potential far beyond 99.9% of fighters. They have their own beliefs and pride set and for that they are loved and admittedly hated but most of that is because people can't get over their rough edges. Which is really their problem not the Diaz brothers and if it's one thing they have exactly figured out, it's that.

youre dancing around the fact that theyre huge whiners unless they just won a million dollars or two, everyone knows this watch any of their losing interviews.

heres the first one i found after searching for 5 seconds

theyre super delusional when losing and have 2-3 excuses ready in the bank. have you ever heard one of them say the other fighter was better and deserved to win? me neither, and ive watched all their fights

heres another tidbit


Yeah they work hard in the gym and in the octagon no one disagreed with that but thats not the discussion. They are whiny. thats part of their personality and if you dont know that you dont know them


found a bit more about nate more specifically

I agree it's whiny in presentation, but I think it is commonly thought and just not usually said. That goes back to the endearing "realness" that was talked about earlier. Lots of people thought gsp cheated. Lots suspect him of juicing. Lots thought he would stall fighters and eek out wins.

Conor may give back handed compliments at the presser like "he was more efficient with his energy" but the underscript is clear as hell. He thinks he is a better fighter than Nate. He thinks he was beating him and he wants another shot to prove it. And he is holding up a title as he gets exactly what he wants. If he wasn't going to get that he would likely be whining about it too.

The thing is the Diaz bros really may be the best pure fighters under different or old rules. They come forward, they take damage without fear, and they out last most other fighters. Lots of their losses are because they get out pointed, but had plenty more left at the end of the fight. This is legit frustrating to them and they both considered quitting over it. They don't like the ufc rules but there is nothing else. Yeah they complain, but it's mostly legit.

plus what are you gonna do if your stomach hurts or you dont have a coach to tell you to go to sleep

keepin it realz yo

ps: I actually like them especially as fighters. Still think huge whiners. Theyre not tito ortiz level but their in the top tier of excuse makers fosho

Even the coach/sleep thing is rooted in truth though. I remember when nick was complaining he didn't know how to pay his taxes and had nobody to help him and it all felt like just not taking responsibility for yourself. The thing is there is a point behind it. You look at what a gsp with the support he got at home as a child and through his career, or more recently what the ufc has given to Conor, the Diaz brothers did not get a lot of those things and they are competing at a top level with these guys. I think that is the ineloquently put point. They are two dudes who know how to scrap and nothing else. They don't know how to play the other games. They don't know how to navigate successs. They have nobody looking out for them. If Nate did not win this fight he likely would fade away as a mid tier fighter after doing everything he knew how to do in they ufc--fight his ass off every time. The thing about Conor making fun of the Ju Jitsu classes to make ends meet...what if he said the same thing? "I have been fighting the best for years, dedicated my life to this and I still can't afford to live on what they pay me, I'm unappreciated." It's true no matter who says it. They have legit complaints and no filter. They don't have the advantages others are given. Plus, you ever had a tummy ache?

Faber vs Barao headlined over Aldo vs Lamas.

The rule means nothing.

Kirby is right here. Diaz bros are the worst losers ever. But I'm going to try to focus on the positive and enjoy post Conor beating Nate.

Looks like Ariel was fired from Fox, possibly for breaking the UFC 200 story early.

I thought it was particularly amusing that Nick was complaining about lack of pay even though he was pulling something like half a million dollars to win on top of PPV points.

Johnny's point is valid, though. Their background and upbringing play a huge role in so many of the negative qualities people see in them. Not that it's an excuse, but it is an explanation, and most judgement is based on people saying "I wouldn't say/do that". Well no ****. You were given a completely different set of genetics and grew up in a different environment. Of course you'd have acted differently.

But that IS the point, learning these things is THEIR responsibility. Conor comes from a working class background, he had a job as a plumber. Where do you think he learned it? He doesn't have some crazy support system, his coach has no experience at this level, either fighting or coaching. You have to step up and take control of these decisions, or hire people who can do it effectively.

I used to think this too, that he was broke, and his whole "i don't know how to buy a house, i didn't go to school for that" thing seemed tragic, then i listen to the Chael interview and the first thing he talks about is having a 50k triathlon bike stolen....

See I agree to a point, but there is more than just saying one guy can do it so everyone can. And honestly, if Conor was treated the way they were for a decade instead of given more than any fighter in ufc history, regardless of why, do you think he'd be quiet about it?

This is a much bigger topic than this thread should support. I'll give you this anecdote though. I was part of a team of hiring managers in the east Bay Area for a few years. One of the eye opening experiences was the difference in the advantages/lack thereof were distributed. I had a candidate come in one day, 18, from San Leandro, young black woman, wearing club clothes, shy, first interview ever. Dressed inappropriately, other managers rolled eyes. I interviewed her and found out she didn't know what to wear to the interview. She was embarrassed. Her parents did not drive her to the interview. She was like a deer in the headlights. I couldn't hire her for customer facing position. The next dude was a white male, wearing a suit his dad bought him and clearly an underachiever. Dad waiting in the waiting area. Probably coached him what to say. He got the job because he met the minimum requirement, washed out in training because he showed late three times the first few weeks. Without putting too fine a point on it, the girl put in twice as much effort, heart and had much more drive but was lacking information and other things afforded the slapdick kid. This was years ago and he probably has a good job now and she likely doesn't. This is a real ****ing thing. You can point to exceptions because they exist, but bringing it back to Diaz vs say GSP, the support from everywhere or lack of is an important part of the equation. If Diaz bros had coaches and promotion and everything else how much better would they be? If these golden boys didn't would they get as far as the Diaz bros did? We'll never know for sure, but it is not just victim talk.

On a much broader level, nature is a factor too. The Diaz bros are not that bright. They are gifted in some areas, not others. Conor is pretty damn smart, much smarter than the average. To say an athlete should have any other quality in abundance is one of the downfalls of sports fandom. Why the hell would someone who is good at fighting, running, jumping or anything else also be a good/smart/likable person? It's clearly bs anyway. The Diaz bros have been slammed for being abrasive and not being sportsmanlike for years, then Conor comes in and is given the keys to the exec bathroom for doing the same ****, but in a more entertaining way. All these dudes who did what they were "supposed" to do according the the "rules" are not even back burner at this point. Suddenly Diaz **** talking is great fun where before it wasn't.

The changing rules may make sense, but come on now. You have two ways to really get support: be a white, marketable, English speaking fighter or be dominant and never lose. You lose even once and don't tick any of those other boxes you are nobody overnight. The double standard is so clear that ignoring it is disingenuous.

Great post JT, although I disagree that Conor is terribly bright. Most of his trash talk seems rehearsed and he doesn't seem to give off signs of being overly intelligent. I don't think he's dumb certainly, but I think the gulf between Conor and Nate isn't as big as you might think. Nick on the other hand...

Weidman and Kimbo disagree

Good point. The Diaz bros are two people but they often are viewed as a unit. Nick seems as a dumb as a sack of hair a lot of the time bringing down the average. Some of my admiration for Conor's smarts is how he has built his brand and world his leverage, and his trash talk while rehearsed and fluid is usually on point enough to be relevant.