wrestlers can make mma so boring though.

i love grappling, but god i hate wrestling.

this

This is what happens when Rampage, King Mo, and Bobby Lashley all get into a van together. <--- NSFW language in vids

Best part is Bobby Lashley wants none of it. Much of it is just a waste of time. Some decent trash talk once it gets into the teens.

Do you have any links to interviews or articles I can read on the whole pride going under and what dana thought of the whole deal please? Playing catch up and just really interested in the whole thing.

I guarantee this is the best post in this thread.

Fedor -240 / Lesnar +190 on Bodog for any fight before Oct. 3, 2010.

Fairly good line imo. Maybe Fedor -180 Lesnar +120

WOW!! You might be right. And some people have a lot of time on their hands.

I think that line is quite a bargain. I never ever have done sports betting in my life, but that is tempting.

I really have no idea how a Fedor/Brock fight might go down. My best guess is like brock/couture but with fedor surviving a decision win 50%, 20% Fedor submits brock, 30% fedor getting GSP/Alves'd or even mir II'd

I'd have to do some digging for the exact issues of WON(and hope that those issues are still around as that was a move half way across teh country ago) as it was over the years when I subscribed to meltzer's WON. this was from when he used a hard copy as opposed to it being electronically like it is now

I would say it would be more like 10% Fedor decision 80% different flavors of Fedor submitting and knocking him out, and 10% Lesnar by ground and pound. FWIW

well if you really think Lesnar wins only 10% of the time you should pound that Fedor -240 line.

I refuse to let myself get excited about Fedor/Lesnar until the day the contract is signed until then im assuming its never happening.

I'm as much as a Fedor nuthugger as the next guy but I think hes gonna have alot more trouble with Brock then even the biggest fans will admit come on now.

lol @ Fedor winning by decision...wtf. That's almost as likely as Brock winning by submission

That was what I was thinking when I mentioned in the post above. It is really tempting. I hate the idea of Sports Betting in general, and Lesnar is a very talented wrestler and a very coordinated guy to be sure. I am just positive that unless he can establish the jab and box like Arlovski did (and Lesnar has shown no ability/need to do this so far) I just think it is extremely unlikely he can win. The only thing that might stop me is that I guess I just think investing that money in poker is probably a better return for me at the moment than I would get on Fedor.

I thought about going far less than 10% there. I agree that is too much. Brock winning by submission I would put at extremely remote. LOL Nice post!

We will never know. When they do fight, they will only do it once. If they ran that Arlovski fight a hundred times, how many does Andre win as they were that night???? The flying knee was a bone head move, if he stuck to his plan how many times does he win? Can't know.

Who else did it kind of monkeytilt that Andre went straight back against Brett Rodgers? I thought Andre was supposed to be doing some serious boxing. How you get past the first day in the boxing gym without a trainer doing the old chestnut that "if you got a train coming at you, you get the f*ck off the tracks, you never ever go straight back".
Too bad again about the whole thing about Americans having little tolerance for losses, because Andre was making real progress. He has all the physical gifts, he just has to get wounded critter serious about the fundamentals. imo


Anyway, whoever wins we will always have incomplete information. I absolutely agree that Fedor can be hit and Lesnar hits like a truck. No question. Lesnar also has sick wrestling skills, no doubt. I just think if he does get Fedor down, most of the time Fedor gets out of it and when he does Brock is most vulnerable on the transitions. Fedor sees where an opponent is vulnerable far better than Brock, and will likely take advantage of it.

It would be a 5 round fight afterall. I see it around 40% chance of submission, 40% tko/ko, (virtually 0 chance of Fedor decision), 20% actually losing the fight not being able to handle brock's strength and size. If they fought right now at least. The longer Fedor waits, the more in favor of Lesnar the fight becomes. It's amazing because, just after the Lesnar/Couture fight, I would've given brock almost no chance at Fedor.

Interesting take. You count it a zero percent chance that when Brock's chin gets tested for the first time by a guy that also has HUGE power that he will fail. I don't know. I think it is hard to know unless a guy has had to weather punches to see how he will do. I am curious why you think Fedor has a rapidly diminishing chance of winning. Do you reckon Brock is learning that quickly? He did seem a bit more sophisticated in the second Mir fight, but not THAT much. I would guess the chance to be the same then and now pretty much. Brock can hit him very early and sting him, and follow up, but that part hasn't changed. He isn't going to get stronger. He isn't ever going to get to the point he can have a high probability of submitting Fedor. What am I missing?

hmm I don't know what you mean by that first line. I said that I see no chance of Fedor winning a decision. He rarely goes to decisions in any fight. And after a long 5 rounds, he would definitely out-cardio Brock and be able to finish by then.

I think that Brock has such a ridiculous advantage in size that he doesn't need to get his skills anywhere near where Fedor is at in order to beat him. There was about 17 months between Lesnar's 2 fights with Mir. In the first fight, he was submitted in just 1:30. In the second fight, Mir didn't come anywhere close to getting a submission. He also doesn't bullrush across the cage anymore. If he keeps improving his submission defense, he will have a very good chance of beating Fedor as I'm sure he will be able to take Fedor down.

Fedor has done so well against wrestlers in the past because they would take him down, and then Fedor would submit them from any position. All Brock needs to beat Fedor is really solid submission defense, his physique will handle the rest.

I was just going by the percentages you listed none that Fedor would knock Lesnar out. Agreed cardio probably goes to Fedor, but Brock clearly does a lot of sophisticated interval training and is no joke in that aspect.

He has a 3" 30lb size advantage over Fedor, and each have extremely good practical strength. By which I mean, that they do a lot of non-traditional lifting and strength training that is far more useful that analog weight lifting. I think Brock has a strength advantage to be sure but I don't think it is THAT broad a chasm. I definitely don't think there is a difference in punching power, in that there will not be a contest to see if one can punch a heavy bag the hardest. They are congruently capable of knocking the other out if they have the temerity to stand right in front of the other one. Either can hurt the other badly with even a glancing blow. Full Stop. So, I think punching power is a chop for any practical purpose.
The wrestling I think is an advantage for Brock clearly, but I suspect there is a broad chasm between what Fedor can do when you take him to the ground and what Mir can do. I don't think his submission defense is up to that level at all. In fact if I were in Brock's camp, I would say that it would be a huge mistake to take Fedor to the ground at all. I would tell him his best chance is to take the Arlovski gambit. I could be wrong, and maybe he can ground and pound him, but I seriously doubt it. (I say this tongue in cheek) To say that all he has to do is have the submission defense to cope with Fedor is I think the same as saying for me to be considered smarter than Ed Whitten, all I would have to do is be better in Physics and Mathematics than him. (The difference in our skills in this lane is roughly the difference between a kid that had to be cut from a T-ball team because he sucked THAT bad and Albert Pujols)
So, I think they have a roughly congruent chance of winning by knockout on the feet. But any other form of victory I think Brock is a HUGE dog. Just my informed guess.

FYP

Not according to the most recent weights listed for their fights as listed on sherdog. Where did you get your numbers?

265 Brock
233 Fedor I rounded down.

Brock enters the cage at ~280.

Fedor was 230 against Arlovski