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Full house on paired flop with 3bet Full house on paired flop with 3bet

03-11-2018 , 04:29 PM
With nothing on the villain. somebody tell me if I got this completely right or completely wrong and explain to me why....

PokerStars - $0.05 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 97.2 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: -, Hands: 1)
Hero (SB): 142.8 BB
BB: 100 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 2)
UTG: 177 BB (VPIP: 33.33, PFR: 33.33, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 4)
MP: 101.4 BB
CO: 121.4 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: -, Hands: 1)

Hero posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has J J

UTG raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 10 BB, fold, UTG calls 7 BB

Flop: (21 BB, 2 players) 5 5 9
Hero bets 12 BB, UTG calls 12 BB

Turn: (45 BB, 2 players) 5
Hero bets 25 BB, UTG calls 25 BB

River: (95 BB, 2 players) 6
Hero bets 95.8 BB and is all-in,
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-11-2018 , 05:56 PM
AA/KK should of 4bet. QQ might of too.
QQ is just a cooler, cant avoid it. I think its all good as played. SPR after the turn is too low not to shove river, so i like that.

In my opinion:
Opening range UTG: 22+, ATs+, ATo+, KJs+, KJo+, QJs, 56s, 67s, 78s.
UTG 3bet flatting range: 88-JJ, AJs, AQs, AK, KQs

As played Flop: 88-JJ, AQ/AK
As played Turn: 88,TT,JJ
River: 88,TT,JJ

I feel 99 is raising the turn 100% of the time for your range is capped to over pairs & AK

This is my range analysis for a player with no previous information. Please critique my ranges if you feel differently. Im open for constructive criticism.
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-11-2018 , 07:53 PM
Really comes down to what UTG does with QQ pre. If he flats pre then you can't shove river for value. I expect his calling range would be QQ-99. I would flat pre as UTG but I'm not sure what the population does.
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-12-2018 , 08:17 AM
river shove is too optimistic imo
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-12-2018 , 10:15 AM
I'd flat pre vs unknown utg this deep.

I think 77-88,TT,A9,T9,98 are still likely to be in V's range otr still and are probably checking behind if we x. I also don't know if they call a shove, so I might pick another size. Shove can't be terrible if the population is sticky though which they can be at times. Also, do you have any bluffs otr?

@ bag of chips, why would you raise turn with 99? I would not in V's seat.
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-12-2018 , 11:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flpmethntsdlr
I'd flat pre vs unknown utg this deep.

I think 77-88,TT,A9,T9,98 are still likely to be in V's range otr
This is sorta contradictory because 3betting JJ is good if he is flatting that wide pre. Are most UTG actually opening T9s,98s though?
Yeah I think majority of players are gonna slowplay 99.
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-12-2018 , 01:26 PM
3-bet PF seems fine OOP. I'm more inclined to flat on the button but that seems like it can go either way, too.

I'm not really sure what my range looks like here. Still trying to think it out. I guess I barrel A5s, 99, and some amount of overpairs for value and use some range of overcards for bluffs. I'd c/f TT and worse to a shove and c/c some better overpairs so I'm not c/f'ing 100% of my checking range.

My first thought is to shove (lose to 99 and A5s but beat TT), but that falls apart if villain either doesn't call TT or doesn't 4-bet QQ PF.

Maybe we can bet smaller, planning to b/f? I don't think anyone ever bluffraises river in practice, especially not at 5NL. We get less value against TT but potentially get calls from a wider range (88-77) and save half a buy-in when behind. Just feel like it's hard to balance because our nutted hands really want to shove, but again, kinda doubt anyone's going to exploit it.

Also don't think c/c is a terrible option based on what I wrote above, but bluffcatching on a board with no draws for the purpose of defending a checking range is weird and still feels awkward to me.

I think I like betting smaller.
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-12-2018 , 02:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renekton
This is sorta contradictory because 3betting JJ is good if he is flatting that wide pre. Are most UTG actually opening T9s,98s though?
Yeah I think majority of players are gonna slowplay 99.
I suppose. I would think they open, some maybe not necessarily defend. I know I do for that size being IP.

Can we agree on 88,TT&T9s are likely still there otr?
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-12-2018 , 02:15 PM
I would just call vs UTG only have 4 hands on him
He may show up w QQ a lot of the time, 99 the other times ,and JJ which you tie and probably folds TT, to river shove
sometimes he may even have AA but they usually 4 bet this aling w KK
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-12-2018 , 08:03 PM
i cant see T9 calling pre.
I would think a turn raise with 99 would be optimal because are we really folding an over pair here? There is only 3 combos of 99 and alot more of 8's & T's.
Thinking in the villians perspective do we really wanna slowplay our 99 to have a 10 through Ace come on the board? Our heros range is capped at an overpair.
I also believe we committed ourselves with the turn bet and that a river shove is the necessary move.

But then again, it could be all player dependent.
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-12-2018 , 11:33 PM
Thinking check call otr. Give him a chance to get those ace highs... not sure if he's calling a shove with 7788orTT. Maybe if he thinks we're getting frisky with AK... meh still like a check call.

And like the 3b pre.
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-12-2018 , 11:41 PM
This should be quite low down in your distribution by the time you get to the river. Check and reevaluate.

Villain has some trapped 99, QQ, KK, some AA maybe and I really doubt much worse will ever call given positions and stack depth. He might even show up with A5s and 65s from time to time.

I think jamming QQ is fine here as now he also has JJ that he might call.

Your preflop sizing OOP should be at least 4x as well
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-12-2018 , 11:41 PM
Agree with handing him the rope otr.
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-13-2018 , 04:13 PM
Thanks everyone. I think if I was going to play the hand again I would check call the river. Question now though. I know this is a tricky one because you know my cards but what would you have done if you had been the villain, I had played the same and (i) you called with, say AKs or (ii) you had called with QQ or (iii) you had called with KK.

Thank you
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote
03-13-2018 , 04:26 PM
I misread the hand, I thought we were ip

As played shoving river is probably best oop since we don't need 50% when called. I'd check the turn though, villain doesn't have much to bluff with otr.
Full house on paired flop with 3bet Quote

      
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