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Old 08-02-2008, 12:19 PM   #1
-VINNY-
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200nl Video!!

Also posted in SMFR for but for those of you that don't frequent both forums.

Ok well I posted about making a video a while back and I finally made it. Unfortunately I played like total ass but since I still made the video I'm going to post it anyway. There are definitely A LOT more interesting spots in here then previous videos. I played a 23/20 for a profit of -450....go me!

I debated about putting a video out of me sucking but MEH we all don't always play our A game perfect poker and the majority of videos of people playing is just that, their A game. I redid the audio because of the lag and also to explain why I suck so maybe you'll learn something, maybe you won't.

So click HERE

I had so many problems with it that there is no live video player this time unfortunately so sorry about that.
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Old 08-02-2008, 12:23 PM   #2
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Re: 200nl Video!!

Downloading now, first strategy video I watch so feel honored
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Old 08-02-2008, 12:25 PM   #3
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Re: 200nl Video!!

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Downloading now, first strategy video I watch so feel honored
LOL I did add a "SUCKING" disclaimer tho
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Old 08-02-2008, 12:33 PM   #4
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Re: 200nl Video!!

Thank you so much for doing these VINNY. I'm gonna watch it right now and comment asap.
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Old 08-02-2008, 01:14 PM   #5
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Re: 200nl Video!!

Should be fun, d/l ing now
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Old 08-02-2008, 03:05 PM   #6
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Re: 200nl Video!!

It's almost downloaded now after a lot of grueling hours staring at the screen seeing numbers like 20kbs instead of the much more I'm used to.

I play NL25 though, and moving up to NL50 soon if shottaking goes well. Do you think much of your strategy applies to those stakes? Will answer more specific questions/comments etc later when I actually watched the video.
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Old 08-02-2008, 05:38 PM   #7
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Re: 200nl Video!!

Sorry for the doublepost, but the edit button is nowhere to be found.

Ok, so I had my little college block with me so I could write things down while watching the video. Actually had to pause the video somewhere halfway to regain focus, made coffee, rolled a cig and noticed I lose focus after 30 minutes (I normally have 1 hour sessions with 5 minute breaks) so I have to work on my focus

That aside, typing out the things I noticed. The timing is roughly because I cba looking up the exact timings but it's about right most of the time and you'll get what I'm talking about

2.20: AKo: I noticed you didn't cbet with AKo. Do you think you can't get them to fold something like mid pairs?

5.20: AQs: What's the range of shortie here? Is he abusing fold equity? I put his range on 77+ and AQ+ but that might be a little loose?

7.00: 76s: Minraising in EP. Do you minraise with other hands as well or did you forget to pot?

10.00: 99: Standard fold there? $8 to call, might be profitable vs limper if he comes along (probably a stupid idea)

12.30: AKs: Does your metagame make him do this with hands like AQ? AJ? What's his range here?

16.30: ATo: You folded this in the BB. Not a great hand but I've seen you play worse. Reasoning for fold is that you're out of position and not the agressor?

18.50: AK h's: All d's board, is $38 too much of a bet here? I like something like $32 here more (pot is around $50) but maybe that's too weak?

25.15: ATo: Oooh suck it like a *****! He didn't even have the Kh Also, correct 4betsize here would be $75? Also, lol @ chat.

27.00: AQo: Nice omaha play here with the naked nut ace, but the nit donked it like a nit always does (I put him on KQ c's though). Is the turn bet too much? The pot is roughly $80 and you bet $78 iirc, I would bet like $50-60 and see what happens from there. Also, you wouldn't pot it with the nuts I think.

30.00: AKo: Again, a big bet on the flop. Please explain the reasoning of these potsized bets. They just seem to big to me.

34.20: Board: Bluffing into a station is the biggest -ev move you can ever make imo.

37.30: TTo : He makes it $7, that makes me worry a bit but I still can't help myself there either. When he flatcalls your bet I check/fold unless I hit a ten.

39:00: Woohoo, I was right about above hand

40.30: You say you are tilting now. What tilts you so bad about this session? Was it some of the stupid moves?

45.30: Flatting with 55 vs shorty seems -ev.

51.20: Nice pot. Standard

55.40: Notice how you would flop the nuts with that hand on 2 other tables. That would tilt me for sure.

63.20: This is just donking it, vs the nit. I fold to the 3bet.

Would like to get explanation on some (or all (L)) moves here, if you have the time.

Overall, the play seems more agressive than NL25 and NL50 (with my -very- limited experience). Still the same amount of nits (is this actually profitable at this level?) and it looks like there are still donkeys. 60/5s? I considered myself lucky if I met those at NL10, never mind at NL25. You have a solid game, but I think you need to work a bit on slowing down at times. You have a pretty loose image, you should play a bit more nitty when you've build up that image and play better hands. That's what I'd do, at least

Nice video, nice commentary, nice suckout with ATo, overall a good job
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Old 08-02-2008, 06:17 PM   #8
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Re: 200nl Video!!

thanks for not using a viddler stream. dling now!
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Old 08-02-2008, 06:31 PM   #9
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Re: 200nl Video!!

Thanks! Great vid. Good decision to just take the first session as opposed to waiting for a session where you ran well. I enjoyed it.

Top quality audio & video, only slow d/l speed sucked.
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Old 08-02-2008, 08:10 PM   #10
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Re: 200nl Video!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elvenkind View Post
Sorry for the doublepost, but the edit button is nowhere to be found.

Ok, so I had my little college block with me so I could write things down while watching the video. Actually had to pause the video somewhere halfway to regain focus, made coffee, rolled a cig and noticed I lose focus after 30 minutes (I normally have 1 hour sessions with 5 minute breaks) so I have to work on my focus

That aside, typing out the things I noticed. The timing is roughly because I cba looking up the exact timings but it's about right most of the time and you'll get what I'm talking about

2.20: AKo: I noticed you didn't cbet with AKo. Do you think you can't get them to fold something like mid pairs?

5.20: AQs: What's the range of shortie here? Is he abusing fold equity? I put his range on 77+ and AQ+ but that might be a little loose?

7.00: 76s: Minraising in EP. Do you minraise with other hands as well or did you forget to pot?

10.00: 99: Standard fold there? $8 to call, might be profitable vs limper if he comes along (probably a stupid idea)

12.30: AKs: Does your metagame make him do this with hands like AQ? AJ? What's his range here?

16.30: ATo: You folded this in the BB. Not a great hand but I've seen you play worse. Reasoning for fold is that you're out of position and not the agressor?

18.50: AK h's: All d's board, is $38 too much of a bet here? I like something like $32 here more (pot is around $50) but maybe that's too weak?

25.15: ATo: Oooh suck it like a *****! He didn't even have the Kh Also, correct 4betsize here would be $75? Also, lol @ chat.

27.00: AQo: Nice omaha play here with the naked nut ace, but the nit donked it like a nit always does (I put him on KQ c's though). Is the turn bet too much? The pot is roughly $80 and you bet $78 iirc, I would bet like $50-60 and see what happens from there. Also, you wouldn't pot it with the nuts I think.

30.00: AKo: Again, a big bet on the flop. Please explain the reasoning of these potsized bets. They just seem to big to me.

34.20: Board: Bluffing into a station is the biggest -ev move you can ever make imo.

37.30: TTo : He makes it $7, that makes me worry a bit but I still can't help myself there either. When he flatcalls your bet I check/fold unless I hit a ten.

39:00: Woohoo, I was right about above hand

40.30: You say you are tilting now. What tilts you so bad about this session? Was it some of the stupid moves?

45.30: Flatting with 55 vs shorty seems -ev.

51.20: Nice pot. Standard

55.40: Notice how you would flop the nuts with that hand on 2 other tables. That would tilt me for sure.

63.20: This is just donking it, vs the nit. I fold to the 3bet.

Would like to get explanation on some (or all (L)) moves here, if you have the time.

Overall, the play seems more agressive than NL25 and NL50 (with my -very- limited experience). Still the same amount of nits (is this actually profitable at this level?) and it looks like there are still donkeys. 60/5s? I considered myself lucky if I met those at NL10, never mind at NL25. You have a solid game, but I think you need to work a bit on slowing down at times. You have a pretty loose image, you should play a bit more nitty when you've build up that image and play better hands. That's what I'd do, at least

Nice video, nice commentary, nice suckout with ATo, overall a good job
Oh boy this is going to take a while I'll preface with saying normally I'm playing around a 16/13 TAG style for the video I really loosened it up a bit. I'm gonna have to go through the vid again because I don't remember all the specific hands.
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Old 08-02-2008, 11:14 PM   #11
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Re: 200nl Video!!

A few for right now..

Min raising is just opening the game up a bit and mixing it up.

ATo I'm pretty tight oop and this is a hand (like KJ) that you get into a TON of trouble with. You're right that it's a decent hand but it is very tough to play oop etc

Bluffing into that station. Well honestly I wasn't going to win w/o betting, and he insta checked so fast I felt like he just had nada so wtf toss one out there lol

I was tilting because I hate making mistakes that cost me money. All those hands my gut was telling me one thing and I did the other. It's not suckouts that piss me off, it's my own mistakes.
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Old 08-03-2008, 01:44 AM   #12
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Re: 200nl Video!!

omg awesome a new vinny vid! 6:45am and I haven't slept yet but must watch now
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Old 08-03-2008, 07:13 AM   #13
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Re: 200nl Video!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by VINNY VT View Post
A few for right now..

Min raising is just opening the game up a bit and mixing it up.

ATo I'm pretty tight oop and this is a hand (like KJ) that you get into a TON of trouble with. You're right that it's a decent hand but it is very tough to play oop etc

Bluffing into that station. Well honestly I wasn't going to win w/o betting, and he insta checked so fast I felt like he just had nada so wtf toss one out there lol

I was tilting because I hate making mistakes that cost me money. All those hands my gut was telling me one thing and I did the other. It's not suckouts that piss me off, it's my own mistakes.
Ah, those were the questions I wondered the most.

Most of my questions are too standard, nvm them unless you (or someone else) wants to start a discussion about it. If anything, I'm still wondering why your betsizes are so big all the time

Imma shark, leeching from the videoz
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Old 08-03-2008, 11:21 AM   #14
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Re: 200nl Video!!

I've been examining my betting sizes lately and it's funny people have mentioned that. Normally I do bet very big as I do this with made hands and unmade hands. It puts a lot of pressure on people and makes them make tougher decisions. I was doing a sweat last night where we discussed either going for the kill in pots or taking the opponent more to value town with a smaller bet. It's been my normal approach to go for the kill but I have been realizing sometimes smaller bets are called for.

Also, weird/smaller size bets can be used to manipulate your opponent into doing dumb mistakes/bluffs (inducing). I've been doing that lately and it's a great feeling having people shove in on you with 0 outs.
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Old 08-03-2008, 01:47 PM   #15
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Re: 200nl Video!!

Thx for the vid Vinny. I watched a bit and will watch the rest later and comment. I'm glad to know you're capable of donking it up too. Sometimes after watching all these vids of people playing their A game -- it makes the viewers feel like we're the only ones that slip up occassionally.

One other thing that I've been quiet about for a while. Has anyone else noticed that:

Kelisitaan (the player you reference) is an anagram for I like Satan...

That coupled with the fact that almost every post I've ever read from the guy has been garbage makes me wonder why he hasn't been banned from 2p2 yet. I'm sure he's a great poker player and all, but I haven't seen him contribute much here in the way of useful advice (just lots of sarcasm, flames, and 1 word responses). But I digress...
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Old 08-03-2008, 05:08 PM   #16
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Re: 200nl Video!!

VT,

One of the more uncomfortable spots we micro-players who are moving up through encounter is how to handle the higher frequency of 3-bettors when we're OOP. Are you ever planning to 4-bet fold (say with a 87s) against a player who's been likely 3-betting light? And what general % would you say that's the case?
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Old 08-03-2008, 07:57 PM   #17
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Re: 200nl Video!!

Berge always with the good Q's

It depends on the player, regularity of 3bettor, position of the 3bettor etc. Now, no one ever really likes to 4bet fold but in the right spots you have to put 4bets in to stop the abuse and to balance your range. If you only 4bet QQ+ you're going to be very easy to abuse of course. Balancing this range against regular 3bettors is going to be important especially when OOP. In pos you'll be able to call with speculative holdings, but this will only be profitable if you're making plays on a few flops, otherwise you'll more than likely be leaking money.

I'm sure this question comes from my 4bet of T9dd. His stats had just popped up and I really really felt like this was just a play on me. He was a 14/10 and I don't think he necessarily has to have a hand there. The smaller size of the 3bet lead me to 4bet him based on stats/feel. Meh prolly not that great vs a relatively unknown.

As far as 4bet % I have no idea what the likely hood of my 4bets would be as it would depend on the player/situation (like everything in poker).

And after everything is said and done you don't have to start getting fancy vs 3bettors in full ring. Only against regs who may try to abuse you in pos. It's ok to just fold and wait for hands as it is full ring.
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Old 08-03-2008, 11:38 PM   #18
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Re: 200nl Video!!

I take back what I said... I just posted a hand in the SSFR forum and got a lot of good responses from Kelisitaan...
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