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How do people like that make it to diamond? If I played ranked I'd def be in the Wood Division which is 2 levels below bronze and I know not to do that...wtf.

That's because you do not play Protoss.

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05-05-2014 , 10:54 AM

#19552

bsball8806

bff with birdman

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 47,301

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ra_Z_Boy

Back on Diamond both servers, finally.

I want to start offracing or even switching to random eventually if I get good enough with offraces. Simply because my interest is waning and I think it will be a new challenge. However, despite unranked supposedly having a separate MMR, I tried a few games and get matched with diamonds or plats and obv my T and P is not that standard. So other than buying a new account, playing with huge lag to Korea or something, or tanking my unranked MMR for ages, what options are there? I need an MMR reset.

Just tank your unranked MMR. It's what I did when I learned Terran.

Quote:

Originally Posted by killer_kill

How do people like that make it to diamond? If I played ranked I'd def be in the Wood Division which is 2 levels below bronze and I know not to do that...wtf.

Because most people (including me) react so poorly to cheese that they get wins against people far more skilled than they are

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05-05-2014 , 01:25 PM

#19553

Kowalski

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 5,338

Co-confirming unranked definitely has a separate mmr.

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05-05-2014 , 05:20 PM

#19554

Ra_Z_Boy

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 36,966

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kowalski

Co-confirming unranked definitely has a separate mmr.

Somehow mine is not at 0 though. Even though I can't remember playing unranked since HoTs came out.

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05-05-2014 , 06:08 PM

#19555

bsball8806

bff with birdman

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 47,301

it probably starts off at your ranked mmr

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05-05-2014 , 06:17 PM

#19556

Eifersuchtig

grinder

Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 578

Hmmm I do like the idea of unranked. I played a bunch of games on it a while ago and found that I was matched against a much wider range of leagues, rather than just my own league. Is this normal? I didn't like having to play vs people two or three leagues lower.

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05-05-2014 , 06:21 PM

#19557

goofyballer

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 70,719

Yeah, I've had some pretty bizarre behavior on my unranked MMR in the past. I used to quit every ZvZ when playing unranked, which tanked my MMR pretty hard, but instead of only playing people in lower leagues, I wound up playing people anywhere from silver to diamond (like, diamonds that were playing ladder games, and thus clearly didn't have super-tanked MMRs).

So yeah, I'd imagine it's "normal", even though it makes very little sense.

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05-05-2014 , 07:04 PM

#19558

goofyballer

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 70,719

I've gotten okay at dealing with mech against bad players with a fairly simple gameplan:
- make swarm hosts to siege their 3rd
- get creep out as far as possible asap
- surround swarm hosts with some spores + spines so they can't just hit you with banshees
- make vipers to blinding cloud siege tanks (abducting is a little clumsier/harder to pull off correctly, I think)
- follow up with infestors and corruptors to deal with vikings/ravens

I've won a couple games against gold Terrans fairly easily on my smurf doing this. I haven't really faced mech against a good player in awhile though. Anyone have other thoughts on how to deal with it?

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05-05-2014 , 07:07 PM

#19559

Ra_Z_Boy

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 36,966

SH's are an absolute must vs mech so what you described is basically the go to on how to crush mech. Only other option is mass corruptor/broodlord, infestor with mass static defense but its not as efficient. Other alternative is mass mass mass muta and just don't let them ever expand. But that requires a lot more skill. Ooooor you could hit a big roach, hydra, viper timing with an early hive, have seen some players do that. Again you can easily get crushed and hard to transition out, if you don't do mass damage you have lost.

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05-05-2014 , 07:14 PM

#19560

Kowalski

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 5,338

Just roach drop them, gg.

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05-05-2014 , 07:15 PM

#19561

Ra_Z_Boy

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 36,966

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kowalski

Just roach drop them, gg.

The WoL flashbacks. Then they have 5 turrets and a couple of thors firing at them. Oh gawd....

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05-05-2014 , 09:42 PM

#19562

Kowalski

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 5,338

Just normandy beach that ****.

They shouldn't have many turrets or thors if they don't scout a spire. You should be able to get to about 180 supply of roaches with drops and speed researched fairly quickly. If they do have a lot of turrets, lead with empty overlords or just double down on less defended areas. Even if it doesn't kill the turtling bastard, it should do enough damage for you to secure yourself map control, take like 5 bases and just make infinite zerg **** to win the game.

Oh, and get burrow as well. So much fun.

I think I'm like 9/10 at high diamond level when I remember to do it.

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05-05-2014 , 09:49 PM

#19563

Ra_Z_Boy

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 36,966

Another old style build with a twist I tried is the good old roach max, except with burrow and burrow speed. If you practice it a bit you should be able to max out with roach speed, burrow and tunneling claws just before 13 mins. And no Protoss should be able to hold it....

I haven't done this on ladder yet, but I saw someone do it on stream at GM and it crushed and they attacked maxed at like 15-16 mins. So a diamond has no chance if you hit before then probably.

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05-05-2014 , 09:58 PM

#19564

bsball8806

bff with birdman

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 47,301

just played a diamond that goes random. he went 2 gate stargate with a 2 void ray 6 zealot expand build into colossus void ray which i beat with a roach hydra timing. just for the lulz, i spent about 15 minutes looking into his build orders. no joke, this is what he does in every matchup:

-PvT: 1 base immortal all in
-TvZ: 2 port banshee
-ZvT: 2 base (really just one) roach all in
-TvT: marine tank raven all in
-PvP: 1 base void ray all in
-ZvP: 1 base roach zergling all in
-ZvZ: 1 base roach all in
-TvP: marine widow mine cloaked banshee all in

Last edited by bsball8806; 05-05-2014 at 09:58 PM. Reason: oops lol his game vs me was a PvZ

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05-05-2014 , 10:00 PM

#19565

bsball8806

bff with birdman

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 47,301

with the exception of the TvT build (which is actually rather common), every other build he has is just god awful and it is amazing he has even a 40% win rate

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05-05-2014 , 10:03 PM

#19566

goofyballer

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 70,719

Wow. That is dedication on your part to research all that.

Playing random just to learn 9 different all in builds seems boring as **** though. When I played R it was nice to get some variation in the style of game you played. If he just wants to all-in every game why doesn't he just play Protoss permanently?

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05-05-2014 , 10:07 PM

#19567

bsball8806

bff with birdman

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 47,301

Quote:

Originally Posted by goofyballer

If he just wants to all-in every game why doesn't he just play Protoss permanently?

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05-05-2014 , 10:15 PM

#19568

bsball8806

bff with birdman

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 47,301

so in terms of how good each build is

i'm gonna say

TvT

(end viable builds)

PvP
PvT

(end lol protoss cheeses that work way more than they should)

ZvT
TvP

(everything after this is not a build)

(sigh)

his PvZ build. He got me to build spores in each main (thought it was an oracle opening, nothing was making when i scouted him

). Hilariously though, I had 3 hatcheries and didn't even come close to losing one

TvZ (i'll admit that I think I lost to this a few years ago)

ZvZ

(end builds that beat anyone above gold level except naniwa at MLG providence)

ZvP

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05-05-2014 , 10:22 PM

#19569

goofyballer

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 70,719

I don't even know how it's possible for Protoss to lose to a one base Zerg all-in that doesn't involve making a pool before overlord. The Protoss build order to beat that is like

FFE version:
1. scout
2. mothership core
3. moar cannons

Gateway expand version:
1. scout
2. mothership core
3. build a wall and sentries

Congrats, you held with flying colors!!

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05-05-2014 , 10:38 PM

#19570

Kowalski

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 5,338

I don't think I've beat a Protoss doing a 1 base all-in since WOL season 2...

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05-06-2014 , 12:17 AM

#19571

gamboneee

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 9,163

that seems a little rich coming from the race that can expo first vs anything and feel ok

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05-06-2014 , 02:19 AM

#19572

goofyballer

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 70,719

Well, he also plays the race that can't actually make units that don't blow unless he expands several times, while you're playing a race that can go 1-1-1 and make his life miserable and still be economically ahead because you just build four CCs on the high ground behind whatever bull**** you open with.

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05-06-2014 , 05:10 AM

#19573

Kowalski

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 5,338

Quote:

Originally Posted by gamboneee

that seems a little rich coming from the race that can expo first vs anything and feel ok

I also don't think I've ever won a game where I went hatch first vs protoss who was proxy 2-gating me

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05-06-2014 , 07:45 AM

#19574

bsball8806

bff with birdman

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 47,301

On a side note, does anyone remember when 2 gate Stargate was considered one of the only two viable Protoss expo builds (along with 3 gate sentries)?

Man, if my micro were just a bit better, I could have been in GSL.