Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!)

08-03-2011 , 04:39 PM
perhaps i'm reading too much into things, but i'm pretty sure the best starcraft ive played came after i got promoted... my confidence level went through the roof as i sort of got validation that i really can play at a high level and my level of play seems to have increased. i never really put much thought into the whole positive mindset thing, but looking at my replays i dont sit on larva long (cause im scared of **** killing me), i dont hesitate to attack, i go with my reads and dont get over paranoid (such as building 4 spores after i count 6 sentries or something) and my game play has gotten so much better as a result.

i dunno it feels like night and day with me.

i hope this doesnt read like one of those ******ed TL posts (such as the one breaking down why gold league is the best league on ladder and doing an in depth analysis of it - but i replied to it anyways)
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 04:59 PM
Originally Posted by Karak
posting this here cause i want some toss player help too

plus ti's sort of BBV since i attack with a 75+ supply advantage like 3 times and lose

can anyone help me understand why i lost this game? at one point i was up 100 supply, but he FF'd me out of my 3rd... i stepped back, waited for reinforcements... attacked up 75 supply or so and got raped. and then repeated that over and over (i was in julyzerg attack til he dies mode) until his superior probe count overcame me.

villain is like 250 pt masters

alkso the random 4 pack of l ings after i took my 3rd was total spaz mistake i know that was wrong
That first set of lings...To the mainnnnn!

Gas finished @ 25 food, you didn't start mining it 'til 40.

A ling sitting at his third would have been nice.

You know his army is sitting at the third...attacking into it is a round peg (zerg army) into a square hole (ramp). Hit the nat and force him onto the low ground.

Towards the end of the game you fall behind in upgrades as he finishes at (iirc) 3/1/3. You also never made it to hive tech, so no 3/3, cracklings, ultras or BLs.
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 05:04 PM
Yeah for sure. BTW the decision to not mine the gas was a conscious decision. I grabbed the gas planning to go speedlings cause for some reason I thought he wouldn't forge FE (I don't remember why, but I think maybe I played him before on this map and he had done something tricky), but when I saw he forge FE'd I decided to not mine it and just grab my 3rd quicker.
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 05:41 PM
brag: received protoss rage
"Cool story bro, bg"
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 05:44 PM
ive been making the terran haters REAL mad in the last week. i dunno what i do to make them rage or if they just "expect" to beat zerg, but they get pretty darn upset with me very often. prob cause i use infestors i guess?

12-3 in my last 15 ZvTs *yawn* ez

Last edited by Karak; 08-03-2011 at 05:47 PM. Reason: in before i start playing real good terrans and get raped hard
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 05:48 PM
i rarely receive terran rage because i almost always lose to terran
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 05:53 PM
i do +1 carapace followed by +1 melee followed by lair and infestors and mass expanding. i open with 3-4 queens and as many spines/spores as i think are necessary to be safe without choking my eco. usually drop a macro hatch slightly before my 3rd, sometimes after.

if they do blue flame, i go roach to defend it when it's time to take a 3rd obv. im usually fine warding it off with 4 queens and spines tho when on 2 base. if they stop making blue flames (which they almost always do), i go back to ling/infestor. if they dont, it's just roach/infestor into brood lords. sometimes mutas if they arent making thors for some weird reason.

if they are doing a 1 base or really tight/quick 2 base tank timing (usually follows a 2rax and i think is the best terran strat in zvt) i use roaches (sometimes with burrow move if i have time/depending on how much damage the 2rax did) to defend it, then expand behind them and tech towards infestor/BL (i keep mashing out those ling upgrades which i think is essential). on a map with more open space i find that the 1/1 lings are usually enough to defend it and infestors start to pop just as they'd be pushing into my nat anyways.

**** banelings btw i think they are worthless (prob cause i suck at controlling them). altho very late game ultra/bane is a REALLY nice tech switch after a terran makes vikings to deal with BLs. ultras and banes move at the exact same speed off creep and are amazing at dealing with the diminished tank #s (due to the vikes) and marines.

edit - it's important to leave spines and sometimes a spore at your expos cause you won't have mutas. i use lots of spines to defend my expos when i go my no muta strat, but im usually fine. they are just there to buy time so you gotta have excellent OL spread and mini-map awareness. also catching 2 full dropships when they are over empty map space (and thus cant unload) with fungals is so trololol.
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 05:56 PM
hmm thx, i'll try some roaches and infestors, I only go ling baneling and mutas now

I'm the weakest in slow pushes with tanks, I never know when and how i should engage
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 05:58 PM
im also sort of at an advantage cause i played terran for 6 months and am pretty darn good at reading unit comps at the front of their base and knowing what it means.

note: i pretty rarely use roaches and only like to when i have to, but ive been incorporating them more and more lately as mass blue flame is gaining popularity. i have dealt with blue flames with pure upgraded ling/infestor before, but i'd prefer not to do that if at all possible.

slow pushes are the worst, but my general strategy is to counter attack constantly, cut off reinforcements with lings and constantly spew infested terrans on their tanks with infestors. plus if your lings have 2/2 and the terran is only on 1/1 you'll be pretty amazed at how hearty and cost effective your lings will be. also sending in 6-8 roaches all spread out (make sure they arent clumped) and instantly sending your lings in behind them is quite effective. the roaches will all take at least 2 rounds of tank shots assuming you micro'd it properly and it gives your lings time to get on the tanks and infestors to drop fungals on marines. with a slow push they have to skirt forward with marines and if you make them feel nervous by lurking infestors (2 fungals = 25 dead marines and that will end a push REAL fast), they move so slow that it takes them an eternity to get to your base and by that time you are so far ahead it doesnt matter what unit you make.
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 06:03 PM
this is great stuff, thx

I played terran for a few weeks at launch, 3 raxing all the way, doesn't really help me gain any real sense of terran :P
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 06:09 PM
i mean it's possible my strats are bogus at the higher levels, but im playing Ts now who were 1400-1700 last season and the games feel easy. the upgrade advantage on lings makes them so cost effective.

i usually open 15h (im very confident vs a 2rax) 15p into spanishiwa. some maps i feel forced to open 14p, but im getting bolder with my 15h lately as hellion play has become popular (you've got more than enough time to secure yourself vs hellions with a 15h... but gas first reactor hellions do still give me nightmares as they do to all zergs). 4 Qs with spines as needed. the longer he's sitting on 1 base and not expanding, the more spines i make. also need to scout gas timings, sac OLs and keep an eye on unit comp in case you suspect banshees. you only need spores to provide vision as 4 queens will handle banshee harass ezpz. if they are going 2 port, you need more, but that's pretty much an all-in from the terran.

i wall at the front of my nat with evos, a roach warren, spines and queens, so i generally suspect drop play. if it's blue flame, a spine in your main can't hurt. spines can always be moved to expos later and with your extra queens you'll have excellent creep spread everywhere. also need OLs spotting at all the edges of your base and in drop zones on the way in.

people make fun of spines, but when you are going gasless the build is so high economy that the extra spines are a) needed and b) don't set you that far behind. spines cant really be reactive... they have to be ready before the T moves out on MOST maps as they take a long time to build.

take all gasses at 40, first 100 gas goes where you think you need it. if a push is imminent, ling speed, if not, lair. sometimes ill even start +1 before ling speed if it's pretty obv the terran aint coming anytime soon (he's building bunkers at his nat or something) with stuff on the ground.

this, of course, assumes no hitches. if he's going mass blue flame or some sort of weird cheese, you'll need to adapt, but you'll have a hell of an economy.
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 06:13 PM
If Karak is a GM, I'll probably quit 2+2.
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 06:16 PM
i experimented with pwny's burrow move open vs a terran yesterday and it worked pretty well and i got far ahead (after initially being behind due to an effective bunker rush), but i didnt really know how to transition out of it effectively. i also somehow completely missed a drop that cleared out one of my expos. then i got manner muled.
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 06:23 PM
Has any Terrans muled on top of a retracted supply depot from it raising? That'd be awesome IMO.
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 06:23 PM
Originally Posted by Cueballmania
If Karak is a GM, I'll probably quit 2+2.
lol dont worry im still pretty terrible, ive just started playing only when im not tilted/tired. im really good at zvt, i have 2 good 1 base all-ins in zvz and im horrible (but still somehow breakeven) at zvp.

meching terrans give me fits tho.
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 06:24 PM
I'm only slightly worried because you're at the top of my friends rankings.
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 06:29 PM
quick! remind gospy he's on your friends list
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-03-2011 , 08:58 PM

I tried to look real quick to find a replay against a good T of my opener to show to you. Most of the recent replays I had were either against Ts who did weird cheesy **** and I had to adapt likewise or were games where I made the decision to go into muta/ling/bling.

However, I found this one from a couple days ago where I spawned close position and went into the ling/infestor style. Couple notes:

-Note the sim city. I was expecting hellions for some reason. I forget why.
-I cut drones about 5-7 too early off 2 base, but that's due to it being close position and me feeling uncomfortable.
-My 3rd was really late (but was a gold so that sort of made up for it)
-The above 2 are pretty much a result of me not knowing this map at all... prob the 2nd or 3rd time I had ever played it and 1st time ever in close position vs. a T (not that close pos here is all that awful).
-I make one really, really horrible engagement decision but get away with it cause lol infestors
-My BL/infestor control late game is pretty lol
-My overall macro is pretty bad, but again it's just too close of a position for me to ever feel comfortable mashing out heavy drones as I'd usually do plus infestor play lets you get away with low economy ****.
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-04-2011 , 01:27 AM
holy **** my MMR is slipping

Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-04-2011 , 04:25 AM
post replay for analysis imo
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-04-2011 , 05:36 AM
no u
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-04-2011 , 01:19 PM
**** random and **** scouting them last and **** 6 pools
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-04-2011 , 02:59 PM
couple days grind +a little more all inning than usual =...

Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-04-2011 , 03:16 PM
toss ez

Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote
08-04-2011 , 03:25 PM
Lol, after all the time it took Karak to attain master league, I would have thought that it would've taken a bit longer.
Starcraft 2 (GAME IS NOW FREE!) Quote