i would game snipe her all day if that were the case...

was gonna say how happy i was that demuslim lost like every game i've seen him play vs byun/polt over the last few days (90% watch from their pov cause i cant stand demuslim talking about how well he plays) just watch them match up again, byun crushes him and apparently manages to lose via ping rape in the 2 mins or so it takes to grab a beer

He just played 3 nice games against him and won 2, I like him. I mean yeah he is talking about how well he plays but well he really plays well .


Just visited her website and was instantly looking for porn of her but doesn`t seem like she has done any porn :/ . Instead of going shopping with your girlfriend playing 2on2 with her, would be paradise

needs to do it off ladder iyam. and im a big prime fan so a little bias for the puppyking

Can someone plz teach me how to play economically defensive ZvZ? I'm so ****ing sick of losing to ling all ins that the same terrible zergs do every game

The new go to seems to be 15 pool 16 hatch. Thats about as much as I know.

I don't even think that part matters so much. I've tried going early baneling nest and forgoing ling speed, but 6 banes don't kill 40 speedlings and then I'm dead. Spines don't kill mass speedlings. Queens don't kill mass speedlings. Only slightly less than mass speedlings with some combination of the above kills mass speedlings. And it's honestly so ****ing boring having to build that stuff in every single ZvZ. I can't stand playing that matchup right now.

Also terrible at: lategame ZvT army composition. I had ling/bling/ultra/swarm host against some guy with pure marine-tank and I got ****ing raped because he'd slowly push forward against the swarm hosts, set up his tanks, and eventually he gets close enough that I have to engage and as soon as I push forward with my army he stims all his marines and just sprints back as fast as he can. Lings/blings get raped by the tanks and can't connect with his bio. :/ :/ :/

I was maxed with like a 15k/10k bank and lost the game.

Vipers bro. They're good unit.

As for ZvZ, scouting. Constantly send a ling or ovie in until you see what u want to. If u see lings start to like up then get banes and Ur own lings

Also create a choke at natural with 2 evo bays, spine, queens, banes and I asusme from there just rush muta. Lings can't do **** if they don't get surface area, in theory 2 queens + 3 bane + handful ling and a spine in a choke should be able to hold of 40 lings for quite a while allowing you to make lings and banes if required.

It's all about the scouting though, as you should be attacking in certain scenarios- if they are going to get muta before you... I think ZvZ may possibly be the highest skill matchup atm.

Also anybody want to practice with me? Next season I'm going to play 1s until hit masters with the aim of gm the following season and need practice.

If you drone scout, I think gas first usually signals a speedling all-in. Also, send one of your first two overlords behind his natural to see the mineral line. If you don't see drones going there, then it's an all-in. Also send in a ling or two a little bit before the timing (IDK what it is off-hand, but you can probably search TL and find it in 10 seconds) to confirm.

You should be able to get banelings in time even with speed first as long as you aren't too late on it. Meaning, you start speed at exactly 100 and your bane nest at about 50. I'm pretty sure I could have banelings in time with my build, which has both a later gas than normal and only 2 guys mining it.

If you get caught off guard, wall off your natural completely with evo chambers (also put your baneling nest up here to start a wall off). This is actually the reason that I start with a creep tumor instead of an inject at my natural, so I can have enough creep to do that. That will either completely deter him, or if he tries to bust, it's laughably slow, so you have a lot of time to make lings or banes and get queens in position. Between 2 queens and a spine, you can kill a lot of lings before he even breaks through.

Goofy sounds like you are just overdroning in zvz. If you have 6 banes and he has 40 lings then you must have a hella lot more drones than he has. Always have an OL behind his minerals checking. You want at most one more round of drones than him, probably less than that. One spine is mandatory but if it looks like he is all in drop 1-2 more be sure to spread them so banes dont hit multiple spines. Also when you fight off one wave and he stops sending reinforcements- go counter with speedlings and punish him if he went straight drones with his last inject.

I would comment about ZvT but it is my worst matchup so I wont. My winrates in zvt is 48% while zvz is 65%. This is high diamond. BRAG.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/view...opic_id=407681

There is a recent detailed guide on this stuff here

goofy, can you post that replay?

Which one? I can post when I get home from work.

The ZvT contains a lot of anger in chat because I was MAD.

Wall with two evos and spine and queen deflects ling or ling/bane all ins really well. Scouting is obviously paramount but your scouting is notoriously bad so this is the best alternative.

the zvt, yes.

Baneling nest first is pretty good these days imo.

Its about micro. Ramp blocking with queens, well placed spine and good baneling control and you rape. You need to scout well also with a ling. Really easy to run round bases with lings constantly. Preferably have an OL checking natural mineral line as well as one outside queen range viewing the exit of their natural.

If they do a speedling rush with 16 drones baneling nest is usually not ready in time so its quite tricky to hold. However a very slightly late natural is such a cast iron guarantee of this you can just pump lings, spine and win.

When are you not mad?

Here's the zvt: http://drop.sc/325654

So, hypothetically, you're playing a TvX game (don't think other race really matters), you take a lot of damage from early harassment, you're def behind, you have a big mineral bank, you need to get an army. You put 4 rax down, and they finish. You have two options:

- put reactors on all 4 raxes, costs 200/200 (your bank right now is like 1200/250). For 50 seconds you can't build anything, when they finish you can build 8 marines at a time. After 1:40 passes, you have 16 marines.
- build 4 more raxes, costs 600/0. You can build 8 marines in the time it takes for the new raxes to finish, and then are making 8 marines at a time when they do finish. After 1:40 passes, you have 24 marines.

Which is better?

I know I should learn to properly take 3 quick bases against FFE...but jesus, it's just so easy to 2 base mass roach all in against Toss and win. HotS has made them so uncreative - well, they've always been uncreative, but at least in WoL they were kind of good and uncreative. When they all started copying Parting's immortal all in, that's actually a really tough build to beat (even when the ****ty players in Plat would arrive 2 minutes late), and it STILL IS a really good build in HotS...but I haven't seen it in literally months. Every Toss just goes stargate now and builds phoenixes or oracles or something and loses because they have a bunch of garbage specialized units that are also kind of expensive and no real army.

Toss, stop sucking, because you're impeding my ability to actually learn how to play this game well. Thanks.

It takes 1:40 for building a reactor to break even with not building the reactor, so obviously if you need units in that window, don't build the reactor.

If you're behind from harassment, you probably should drop the reactors and another CC.

Vs Zerg I always go double stargate into voids and it seems to work.

I guess you could roach all in if you don't get that scouted but like 2 cannons and 2 sentries would hold that **** off easy. And mothership core obv.

Just gonna jot some things down as I watch the replay goofy posted.

- I always drone scout in ZvT, mainly to see if he is going gasless or CC first which gives me the green light to play more greedy.

- Once you have the 100 gas for speed I move drones out of gas for a bit. If you rewatch you have gas piling up with nothing to spend it on.

- You 3rd at 7:00 is really late. 6:30 is the latest this should go down and if you scouted he went gasless at the start you can even drop it earlier around 6:00.

- 17:00 after winning that battle you should be taking your 5th and probably 6th bases at the northeast corner.

- Stopped watching at 30:00 cuz it was over. The biggest problem with that whole game is you never attacked, not once. You maxed out and turtled without expanding behind it and waited until he killed you. Even if you cant kill his whole army, you need to be slamming walls of units into him and remaxing to prevent him from putting pressure on you and taking the map behind that pressure. I also dont use swarms or broodlords against bio terran it just seems too immobile to me. I go ling/bane/muta/ultra the whole game.

I don't like your early gas. Against a 1 rax expo this is going to put you behind. For most of the early game you were behind on workers until you made a big round of drones 10 minutes into the game. I realize that getting quick gas can help deal with terran pressure and all ins, but you can shut down a lot of stuff with queens, a spine and scouting. If you are having trouble dealing with early terran aggression I would recommend drone scouting and only getting gas if the terran gets gas. Even then you should wait at least until your pool is done to get gas unless you think he is going proxy reaper.

Another thing you should always do is put a zergling outside their natural so you can tell if they move out. You should also put a ling or overlord at any base they might take as their third. I noticed late game you delayed his 5th forever with a burrowed ling.

The only time I like swarm hosts ZvT is against certain pure mech compositions. This is partly just my personal preference as I have seen them used in some pro games, and I'm sure you could make them work with good control and macro. You were getting melee upgrades which do not help swarm hosts. Also I feel like swarm hosts are best when you have 20+ of them. Late in the game your 7 SHs felt like useless supply.

Personally against marine tank or tankless bio I like to rely on ling bane early on and tech to ultras and 3-3 quickly. Sometimes I'll make about a dozen mutas to harrass a little, force turrets, and help with drops, although now I think I prefer skipping the spire until hive. I think vipers can be very good against terran but I have WOAT caster control so I never make them or infestors now. Keep scouting all game long so you don't get caught off guard by an air transition, which I love doing when I play terran.

also, he had zero pfs and left nothing at home besides his rally at his nat; runbys all day would prob just kill him on its own. def think more bases and macro hatches with all the mins are a must

i kinda agree the broods dont do much, esp in that number and without infestors. are new ones really that hard to land fungals? when he was attacking your 3rd and later your 4th, both times i think there was a good cliff for them to sit on, mostly they were just idle in the back. esp when hes breaking down your rocks, you can reign freely and get his tanks to kill stuff.

you crushed him once, he let banes get the marines away from tanks and they crushed him. last big fight you kinda engage after youve pulled back your broods, so like 30 supply of army not attacking anything.

lastly, is it that uncommon to sack works as zerg? 74 drones and 10k mins seems like a waste, esp as you end up with like 35/16 mining on 2 bases

oh, also not getting adrenal glands just seems bad