villain shoved 280BB OTR - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

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villain shoved 280BB OTR

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11-02-2019 , 10:02 AM

Raddad101213

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2019 Posts: 111

250BB effective. what range do you think he is doing this with? fwiw if i was 100 BB deep i might have considered a call

Hand History driven straight to this forum with DriveHUD Poker HUD and Database Software

NL Holdem $0.1(BB)
BTN ($10) [VPIP: 17.5% | PFR: 15.5% | AGG: 30% | 3-Bet: 8.6% | Hands: 104]
SB ($19.61) [VPIP: 28.5% | PFR: 22.2% | AGG: 38.2% | 3-Bet: 10% | Hands: 1858]
BB ($11.97) [VPIP: 20.5% | PFR: 18% | AGG: 20.8% | 3-Bet: 8.5% | Hands: 747]
HERO ($27.9) [VPIP: 22.1% | PFR: 17% | AGG: 24.5% | 3-Bet: 6.8% | Hands: 21538]
HJ ($4.65) [VPIP: 26.1% | PFR: 8.7% | AGG: 10% | 3-Bet: 0% | Hands: 24]
CO ($30.15) [VPIP: 28.8% | PFR: 4.9% | AGG: 37.3% | 3-Bet: 1.8% | Hands: 320]

Dealt to Hero: Q

HERO Raises To $0.30, HJ Folds, CO Calls $0.30, BTN Folds, SB Folds, BB Folds

Hero SPR on Flop: [36.8 effective]
Flop ($0.75): T

HERO Bets $0.41 (Rem. Stack: 27.19), CO Calls $0.41 (Rem. Stack: 29.44)

Turn ($1.57): T

HERO Bets $0.74 (Rem. Stack: 26.45), CO Calls $0.74 (Rem. Stack: 28.70)

River ($3.05): T

HERO Bets $1.39 (Rem. Stack: 25.06), CO Raises To $28.70 (allin), HERO Folds

Spoiler:

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11-02-2019 , 10:08 AM

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,323

TT/66

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11-02-2019 , 10:40 AM

Ojune

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Feb 2017 Posts: 5,171

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raddad101213

fwiw if i was 100 BB deep i might have considered a call

No, this is low in your range and you have no blockers to villain's value range

Doodoo, if you stumble upon this thread, this is exactly what I'm talking about regarding massive ovb, people don't understand how tight they need to defend

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11-02-2019 , 10:44 AM

Raddad101213

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2019 Posts: 111

so you guys are basically saying they only do this with the nuts?

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11-02-2019 , 10:48 AM

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,323

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raddad101213

so you guys are basically saying they only do this with the nuts?

To be blunt it doesn't matter, because of the size of the bet you can call with only the nuts and be ok.

That being said--yes.

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11-02-2019 , 11:05 AM

Raddad101213

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2019 Posts: 111

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brokenstars

To be blunt it doesn't matter, because of the size of the bet you can call with only the nuts and be ok.

That being said--yes.

i think i got it. so i have to call 27.31 to win 31.75. divide 31.75 by 27.31 and the minimum defense frequency is slightly over 1%

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11-02-2019 , 11:09 AM

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,323

Your calculation isn't correct.

Anyways, mdf doesn't matter here.

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11-02-2019 , 11:10 AM

Raddad101213

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2019 Posts: 111

not sure if this hand i comparable because it is a donk lead overshove, but i looked him up because he bought in shallow and just sat down.

Hand History driven straight to this forum with DriveHUD Poker HUD and Database Software

NL Holdem $0.1(BB)
BB ($4.05) [VPIP: 32.4% | PFR: 22.1% | AGG: 37.1% | 3-Bet: 0% | Hands: 68]
UTG ($6.61) [VPIP: 13.3% | PFR: 0% | AGG: 0% | 3-Bet: 0% | Hands: 16]
HJ ($3.7) [VPIP: 70% | PFR: 40% | AGG: 37.5% | 3-Bet: 0% | Hands: 20]
HERO ($12.5) [VPIP: 22.1% | PFR: 17% | AGG: 24.5% | 3-Bet: 6.8% | Hands: 21538]
BTN ($21.16) [VPIP: 28.8% | PFR: 4.9% | AGG: 37.3% | 3-Bet: 1.8% | Hands: 320]
SB ($70.7) [VPIP: 28.5% | PFR: 22.2% | AGG: 38.2% | 3-Bet: 10% | Hands: 1858]

Dealt to Hero: J

UTG Folds, HJ Calls $0.10, HERO Raises To $0.40, BTN Folds, SB Calls $0.35, BB Folds, HJ Calls $0.30

Hero SPR on Flop: [2.54 effective]
Flop ($1.30): J

SB Checks, HJ Bets $3.30 (allin), HERO Calls $3.30 (Rem. Stack: 8.8), SB Folds

Turn ($7.90): J

River ($7.90): J

Spoiler:

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11-02-2019 , 11:11 AM

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,323

Definitely not the same thing.

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11-02-2019 , 11:11 AM

#10

Raddad101213

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2019 Posts: 111

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brokenstars

Your calculation isn't correct.

Anyways, mdf doesn't matter here.

poker is hard.

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11-02-2019 , 11:14 AM

#11

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,323

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raddad101213

poker is hard.

Indeed.

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11-02-2019 , 11:20 AM

#12

dubakkur2

veteran

Join Date: Jul 2019 Posts: 3,111

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raddad101213

poker is hard.

actually it is simple

YOU make it hard for yourself.

Spoiler:

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11-02-2019 , 11:22 AM

#13

Raddad101213

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2019 Posts: 111

Quote:

Originally Posted by dubakkur2

actually it is simple

YOU make it hard for yourself.

Spoiler:

thanks for the clarification

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11-02-2019 , 11:23 AM

#14

Raddad101213

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2019 Posts: 111

im not afraid to admit im an idiot with no ego, and thats why im here to learn

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11-02-2019 , 11:27 AM

#15

Raddad101213

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2019 Posts: 111

ok, call 27.31 to win 31.75. divide 27.31 by 31.75 and i have to be good 86% of the time....maybe?

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11-02-2019 , 11:38 AM

#16

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,323

That is also incorrect.

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11-02-2019 , 12:03 PM

#17

Raddad101213

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2019 Posts: 111

Ok overbet shove+ no nuts =no call. Got it

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11-02-2019 , 12:11 PM

#18

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,323

That is a pretty good start actually, yeah.

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11-03-2019 , 08:35 AM

#19

Iblis

veteran

Join Date: May 2016 Posts: 3,360

Nobody's talking about hero's triple barrell/sizings? it looks kinda bad.

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11-03-2019 , 09:03 AM

#20

Zuko

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2015 Posts: 2,356

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raddad101213

ok, call 27.31 to win 31.75. divide 27.31 by 31.75 and i have to be good 86% of the time....maybe?

Villain all in / Villain all in + Pot = how much you need to fold so Villain breaks even on his bluff.

so in theory you can almost fold 90% of your range here. but in practice you can probably fold more because Villain is mostly not bluffing.

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11-03-2019 , 09:51 AM

#21

291

adept

Join Date: Feb 2017 Posts: 897

Think river plays better as a check call, flop can be checked too.

Very easy fold on the river, would fold all my backdoor flushes too. Would also fold this combo at 100bb deep.

People tend to bluff a lot less frequently when deep by the way, so not only do you get to fold pretty often from a maths standpoint you can fold even more than the maths suggests just because of the lack of bluffs.

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