** Official August uBBV Thread ** - Page 140 - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

I agree with this, the only thing is for me to do things like that i want to have quite a lot of reads before i start flatting pre more. And also doesn't that become a problem at 100nl because regs just squeeze like **** and are 3bing like crazy. So say TAG that you have reads on opens CO and you flat OTB w 78s, SB and BB have a good situation to squeeze, which obviously isn't a problem at 25nl, but as you move up the stakes it becomes more of a problem.

in my last 20k hands at 100nl, i have a 3b % of 6.3 % and 7.2% on the btn. I flat almost 8 % on the btn also. People overestimate how often people squeeze but obv if their is a habitual squeezer than you cant do this. I have had tons of success flatting the btn w hands like 86o to a co open and just raising their cbets or floating them a ton(generally just trying to be annoying to play against)

08-10-2010 , 07:16 PM

#3477

ayuken

adept

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 763

Quote:

Originally Posted by EATITPAL

adding to that, if the regs are unknown, by 3betting early in a session you buy yourself an aggro image for ~100 hands. Some people will just see the high 3bet% and go crazy

for me, i 3bet or fold these hands because it is much easier to just cbet and give up vs unknown than to play a turn and river, but i see your point wizard.

08-10-2010 , 07:18 PM

#3478

cheryltweedy

adept

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 1,035

Quote:

Originally Posted by EATITPAL

Fair enough, i went through a period of trying to be a little more loose and aggressive. However i felt it was a lot more variance and im actually probably not a good enough hand reader to do this well enough.

Did exactly the same, decided that I was spewing money in 3bet pots way too much, cut my 3bet % down and I started crushing.

Btw, 13bb/100 @ 25NL is standard for a decent player, right? I don't really have a clue what's considered a good WR @ 25NL and what isn't, I went through my whole "career" without really taking much notice of this.

08-10-2010 , 07:18 PM

#3479

EATITPAL

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 5,047

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheWizardOfOddz

It's definitely annoying to play against people that play like this, and i think it's especially good at 25nl because people just don't care, they won't play back hardly at all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayuken

Maybe 3b'ing gives a bit of an image, but i honestly believe 25nl regs don't give a toss about image, and they just play the 2 cards infront of them.

08-10-2010 , 07:26 PM

#3480

ayuken

adept

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 763

afaik, flatting hands like 78o (or even stronger) IP is definitely -ev for me atm, but I should start doing it for learning purposes

08-10-2010 , 07:32 PM

#3481

TheWizardOfOddz

banned

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 2,180

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayuken

afaik, flatting hands like 78o (or even stronger) IP is definitely -ev for me atm, but I should start doing it for learning purposes

if the money is not life changing, i would defiantly recommend playing a hyper aggressive style and gradually move down from there.

08-10-2010 , 07:34 PM

#3482

Insta-4Bet

banned

Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 2,150

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOONERCAM

i don't really get your line here, but whatever.

the troll line?

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOONERCAM

she's not leaving me, don't be an assclown, find yourself a friend

orly?

08-10-2010 , 07:35 PM

#3483

Fredron

old hand

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 1,469

Of course you can beat NL10 and NL25 or whatever stake without 3betting light/bluff.
But that's just stupid, it's like folding every button. You can still beat the game but it's not as easy/profitable.

08-10-2010 , 07:35 PM

#3484

verneer

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 6,971

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian J

5% does include light 3b's

QFT. It doesn't mean you have to go nuts, but you start thinking in terms of picking up dead $ preflop.

08-10-2010 , 07:36 PM

#3485

GOONERCAM

Resident Rollbuster

Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 7,994

Quote:

Originally Posted by Insta-4Bet

the troll line?

orly?

lol, oh dear

08-10-2010 , 07:36 PM

#3486

ayuken

adept

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 763

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheWizardOfOddz

if the money is not life changing, i would defiantly recommend playing a hyper aggressive style and gradually move down from there.

i totally agree. I play a 25/22 game w/ 5.6% 3bet and 3.25 aggr , but i always feel like i should be more annoying postflop. A bit more flatting preflop IP sounds like a good first step (and not folding on the flop the second ;p )

08-10-2010 , 07:36 PM

#3487

Fredron

old hand

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 1,469

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheryltweedy

If you have more than 10bb/100 after, let's say at least 30k hands at NL25 then you're doing a very good job.

08-10-2010 , 07:37 PM

#3488

TheWizardOfOddz

banned

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 2,180

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fredron

i would bet that you or anyone cannot beat 25nl by not playing any btn.

08-10-2010 , 07:40 PM

#3489

Fredron

old hand

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 1,469

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayuken

You should have a tactic like this, instead;
Look at your hand, your hand _might_ matter, see who opens from where, think about their range, think about what boards their range will miss most of the time. Then when that's the board you attack them. It's hard to flop good so just attack them everytime it's likely they're weak.
That my friend is profit.
Don't just say "ok this time I will call EP open and rep a set on turn"

08-10-2010 , 07:42 PM

#3490

Comstizzle

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,298

cannot win by folding every button

08-10-2010 , 07:43 PM

#3491

ayuken

adept

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 763

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fredron

of course. The main idea is to change your intentions when flatting. It's another thing to call w/ 33 IP vs a wide range and be prepared to fold when not hit, and another thing to be prepared to do exactly what you said, attack when shown weakness or his range missed etc.

08-10-2010 , 07:48 PM

#3492

aesthetics

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 5,514

Grabbed by Holdem Manager
NL Holdem $0.25(BB) Full Tilt
SB ($48.05)
Hero ($29.77)
UTG ($9.35)
CO ($53.51)
BTN ($29.35)

Dealt to Hero A

UTG calls $0.25, CO raises to $1.10, fold, fold, Hero calls $0.85, fold

FLOP ($2.55) K

Hero checks, CO bets $2, Hero raises to $5.50, CO raises to $10.25, Hero raises to $28.67 (AI), CO calls $18.42

TURN ($59.89) K

RIVER ($59.89) K

Hero shows A

(Pre 46%, Flop 28.7%, Turn 15.9%)

CO shows J

(Pre 54%, Flop 71.3%, Turn 84.1%)

Hero wins $56.90

no strat in bbv

08-10-2010 , 07:49 PM

#3493

Dumuzi

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 3,621

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheWizardOfOddz

i would bet that you or anyone cannot beat 25nl by not playing any btn.

how much u wanna bet?

08-10-2010 , 07:49 PM

#3494

Insta-4Bet

banned

Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 2,150

lol dintamentz

08-10-2010 , 07:49 PM

#3495

z0mgtiltz

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 10,944

dint: you're a lucky potato head.

08-10-2010 , 07:50 PM

#3496

TheWizardOfOddz

banned

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 2,180

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dint

Grabbed by Holdem Manager
NL Holdem $0.25(BB) Full Tilt
SB ($48.05)
Hero ($29.77)
UTG ($9.35)
CO ($53.51)
BTN ($29.35)

Dealt to Hero A

UTG calls $0.25, CO raises to $1.10, fold, fold, Hero calls $0.85, fold

FLOP ($2.55) K

Hero checks, CO bets $2, Hero raises to $5.50, CO raises to $10.25, Hero raises to $28.67 (AI), CO calls $18.42

TURN ($59.89) K

RIVER ($59.89) K

Hero shows A

(Pre 46%, Flop 28.7%, Turn 15.9%)

CO shows J

(Pre 54%, Flop 71.3%, Turn 84.1%)

Hero wins $56.90

no strat in bbv

fish on a downswing imo

08-10-2010 , 07:50 PM

#3497

Insta-4Bet

banned

Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 2,150

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dumuzi

how much u wanna bet?

Put me down for $20 if the sample is at least 50K.

08-10-2010 , 07:50 PM

#3498

Fredron

old hand

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 1,469

Total winnings - button winnings = profit?

08-10-2010 , 07:50 PM

#3499

kidacao

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 5,578

^^^wtf u winning on the SB

----------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by verneer

QFT. It doesn't mean you have to go nuts, but you start thinking in terms of picking up dead $ preflop.

I wondered about this but im not sure what u guys call 3bet light. Bluff? 3bet for value without premiums?

started stoving a bit.

AJs+ AKo 77+ according to the soft is 5%, but thats not the range is use.

Lets say ATs+ AJo+ 99+ and KQo as a bluff, thats 7,5% , but i wont be 3betting this hands allways (KQo AJo ATs like 25-40% of the time and so on)... so that should be a little bit less , like 6.5%

Most of the time i 3bet the bottom of that range is for value not bluff,, would u consider that light?