my steal from small blind success is 54% so against the villains I'm stealing against it's immediately profitable with any two cards even if I open fold the flop

Dint, you want to entice people to fold, which is why you 4x. I honestly lol when i see people with high steals from the sb. It is one of the dumbest things you can ever do, steal against someone with a huge positional advantage.

But do you open fold the flop(what is your cbet success). All you are doing is adding unneeded variance to your game.

a lot of people dont do anything about it, esp at micros

you just gave reasoning for why 4x is better.

it increases fold equity, and means people have to 3bet bluff larger and hence discourages it

I disagree gooner, I don't think 4xing increases fold equity by 25%

Like I said I'm getting a 54% success rate stealing from the small blind, if I don't think that would increase to 68% if I 4x...

----------------------------------

Also wizard I'd argue that making a move that has been proven to be profitable is the opposite of adding uneeded variance to your game.

I'm not playing crazy from the small blind at all, I'm not stealing against people that don't fold to steals, and I'm not running multiple street bluffs unnecessarily if my steal doesn't work..

like how is it high variance if I know i'm making .7bbs everytime I steal (and this is true for my sample where villains are folding to 54% of my steals)

its not like it isn't totally easy to evaluate whether you should steal wide from sb vs. most ppl

^this

if you see someone is folding to 80% of small blind steals (which is not at all uncommon) you're burning money if you ever fold

I dont understand how you are making .7bbs, when you are risking 3bbs for a gain of 1bb.

lol'd

Unless the bb is folding to a ridiculous amount to sb steals( not bb steals in general), and unless you think you have a significant post flop advantage(ie, bb is a 90 10 fish) it is very easy to deduce that stealing from the sb will be -ev.

cheeze and rice. 6max is so ******ed.


Hand #1
Poker Stars $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em - 3 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

BB: $30.26
BTN: $42.27
Hero (SB): $25.10

Pre Flop: ($0.35) Hero is SB with Q Q
BTN raises to $0.75, Hero raises to $2.65, 1 fold, BTN calls $1.90

Flop: ($5.55) K Q A (2 players)
Hero bets $3.75, BTN calls $3.75

Turn: ($13.05) 4 (2 players)
Hero bets $7, BTN calls $7

River: ($27.05) 2 (2 players)
Hero bets $11.70 all in, BTN calls $11.70

Final Pot: $50.45
BTN shows J T (a straight, Ten to Ace)
Hero shows Q Q (three of a kind, Queens)
BTN wins $49.45
(Rake: $1.00)

Hand #2
Poker Stars $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

Hero (UTG): $28.64
MP: $47.75
CO: $44.32
BTN: $24.90
SB: $27.29
BB: $27.22

Pre Flop: ($0.35) Hero is UTG with Q Q
Hero raises to $0.75, 1 fold, CO raises to $2.35, BTN calls $2.35, 2 folds, Hero raises to $7.05, 1 fold, BTN calls $4.70

Flop: ($16.80) 6 7 8 (2 players)
Hero bets $20.80, BTN calls $17.85 all in

Turn: ($52.50) 8 (2 players - 1 is all in)

River: ($52.50) 2 (2 players - 1 is all in)

Final Pot: $52.50
Hero shows Q Q (two pair, Queens and Eights)
BTN shows T 9 (a straight, Six to Ten)
BTN wins $50.50
(Rake: $2.00)

they dont have to fold a ridiculous ammount, and a lot of people do anyway. i guess it depends on what you consider ridiculous though. a pretty high % of non-donk micro players only defend with like a 25% range vs. small blind steal.

fwiw you also dont risk 3bb to win 1bb when you raise to 3x from the sb. you risk 2.5 to win 1.5.

75% is a ridiculous amount to fold to a sb to steal and lol math is idiotic obv

and even higher % of non-donk players play like 90/10 fish bvb. A high is oftentimes good for two streets of value, noone ever folds second pair etc

but a lot do. its a dumb argument too, bc if we were looking at any specific person's stats, it would be totally easy to figure out and everyone would agree. if someone folds enough that its profitable to steal really wide, then its a leak not to steal really wide. if they defend a ton, then its a leak to steal a ton. not tricky.

edit: slow z0mgtiltz is slow.

dint success rate is only 54% and dint obv doesnt open fold the flop. So i would want to see his cb success rate also.

too late

I'm too tired for this number crunching. You guys have fun playing.

this discussion is pretty pointless without knowing how we're gonna play postflop.

like, we're gonna have to have a pretty high cbet success rate because if we're being called 46% of the time....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTl3U...eature=popular

this is pretty amazing imo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tM_48UTwV3Y

I was in a big rush to get to train and fkd my maths. Hung pretty much said what I'm trying to say.

I'd be happy to find a leak in my game but I'm not convinced.