***The Official 2010 FTP Micro FR Regulars Thread (NSFW)*** - Page 25 - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit - Micro Stakes Poker Forum

Login

Register

Two Plus Two Forums Poker Strategy Online No-Limit Hold’em Cash

***The Official 2010 FTP Micro FR Regulars Thread (NSFW)***

Closed Subscribe

...

Page 25 of 917

5 15 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 35 45 75 125 225 525

Page 25 of 917

5 15 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 35 45 75 125 225 525

01-09-2010 , 06:52 AM

#601

Flippn Corner

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 4,783

do a search for folding KK pre and you will understand

01-09-2010 , 08:32 AM

#602

McAvoy

banned

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 46,476

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flippn Corner

anyone else would get a horrible treatment from posters if this was made a thread

got some hypocrites in this thread

lol funny cuz its true, when I said it, I got bashed

Quote:

Originally Posted by McAvoy

The game is constantly evolving, even the fish are evolving, they're not putting it in with JJ and QQ, so its time for you to adjust.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chriswitteman

Wat?

Quote:

Originally Posted by EN09

My thoughts exactly when I get it AIPF with AA/KK and watch some moron hit his JJ for a set, 99 for the straight, or even TT for the runner flush... If fish aren't getting it in with hands like these, we wouldn't be seeing -EV swong garfs like we do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoAheadPutMeOnAK

AA accounts for a smaller % of villain AIPF situations than you'd think. There are spots for a KK pre fold, but not many. Villain has to be a SUPER nit and/or the stacks have to be SUPER deep, for me to consider folding KK preflop.

Its the long run my friends.

"Its only 100BB." See enough spots where villains spew with TP and AK, and you should be able to put 100BB in the middle without blinking.

Quote:

Originally Posted by slowcheetah1

If someone ever hears of me folding KK pre for 100bb -- please come to my home and kick me in the vag.

If villain is a 3/3 w/ a 4b % of .000001% over 10k hands from South Korea I will still be fistpumping into the middle. That being said nearing 150+ bbs I think there are several different options as a means of balancing if nothing else (but i'll still be getting it in nearly every time, so feel free to exploit me).

Also, I just got my first rakeback payment and i'm officially in love w/ cash.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDAWD

It just depends on how sure you are that you're beat. Folding KK is correct only if you're at least 80% sure that he's got the rockets. You might have to actually up the threshold if there's already a lot of money in the pot. Remember that Ks aren't drawing dead against As.

FWIW, I still get it in PF against a lot of worse hands than KK. I've seen villains show up with QQ all the way down to 8s.

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnMyBike

I agree with this if you're calling an AI. But won't shoving vs nits fold out most weaker hands? Is flatting to induce a flop shove from AK/QQ common?

(All very villain-specific, of course.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpethybridge

____________________________________

On the shipping KK preflop issue:

In the last few stats analyses I have done for people, EVERYBODY has been negative AIPF with KK. All of them have been indiscriminately shipping KK.

It is a leak, pure and simple, and there really is no debating the subject anymore, as far as I am concerned..

thanks mpethy for stepping in on the issue. I knew I wasn't wrong.

01-09-2010 , 11:47 AM

#603

pele02

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,531

Continuing on the KK pre discussion.

50NL: I have been all in with KK against full stacks 4 times, 3 of those times villain had AA and one time QQ.
Looking over the hands I could have folded all of them.

-2bi with KK aipf.

25NL: All in with KK 6 times against full stacks, 5 times villain had AA and one time AK.
Could have folded at least 4 of them

-2bi with KK aipf here too.

I'll stop autoshipping KK pre from now on, I'm a ****ing idiot.

KK post saver

Spoiler:

01-09-2010 , 01:18 PM

#604

KurtSF

Lucky Number Seven

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 16,471

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDAWD

So this is what it's like to run bad...

Not to mention that the EV differential doesn't include gems like...

It is my understanding that this sort of this is new to you...?

01-09-2010 , 01:42 PM

#605

lien

adept

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 917

did all of you really use the following rule when setmining:
"effective stacks = at least 20 x (amount invested in the pot preflop)"
or it is just a myth... ?

01-09-2010 , 02:05 PM

#606

HappyPixel

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 5,586

Quote:

Originally Posted by Equus asinus

When I folded KK not one but two villains flipped AA. Rigged imo. Just to taunt me for making the fold the RNG tossed out a K on the river. Just a note. I was over 200 bb deep. Would have insta shipped for 100bb.

Full Tilt Poker $0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

MP1: $208.90
MP2: $212.05
CO: $216.15
BTN: $254.00
SB: $125.00
BB: $189.00
UTG: $107.00
Hero (UTG+1): $204.55

Pre Flop: ($1.50) Hero is UTG+1 with K

K

UTG raises to $3.50, Hero raises to $11, MP1 calls $11, 2 folds, BTN raises to $40, 3 folds, Hero raises to $204.55 all in, MP1 raises to $208.90 all in, BTN calls $168.90

Flop: ($627.35) Q

Q

8

Turn: ($627.35) 3

River: ($627.35) K

Final Pot: $627.35
MP1 shows A

A

(two pair, Aces and Queens)
BTN shows A

A

(two pair, Aces and Queens)
Hero shows K

K

(a full house, Kings full of Queens)
MP1 wins $0.00
BTN wins $0.00
Hero wins $615.65
(Rake: $11.70)

01-09-2010 , 02:36 PM

#607

Tbirdx24

old hand

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 1,630

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDAWD

So this is what it's like to run bad...

Not to mention that the EV differential doesn't include gems like...

Full Tilt Poker $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

BB: $4.00
UTG: $14.79
UTG+1: $1.25
UTG+2: $4.90
MP1: $4.33
MP2: $1.85
Hero (CO): $17.98
BTN: $14.36
SB: $6.90

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is CO with A

7

5 folds, Hero raises to $0.30, 2 folds, BB calls $0.20

Flop: ($0.65) 5

J

4

(2 players)
BB bets $0.10, Hero raises to $0.60, BB calls $0.50

Turn: ($1.85) T

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $1.10, BB calls $1.10

River: ($4.05) T

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero requests TIME, Hero bets $2, BB calls $2 all in

Final Pot: $8.05
BB shows 5

5

(a full house, Fives full of Tens)
Hero shows A

7

(a flush, Ace high)
BB wins $7.52
(Rake: $0.53)

Full Tilt Poker $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

BTN: $17.88
SB: $13.01
BB: $10.00
UTG: $10.00
UTG+1: $4.45
UTG+2: $11.75
MP1: $47.35
Hero (MP2): $28.58
CO: $8.96

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is MP2 with Q

Q

UTG raises to $0.30, UTG+1 calls $0.30, 2 folds, Hero raises to $1.60, 4 folds, UTG calls $1.30, 1 fold

Flop: ($3.65) 8

T

7

(2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $3.65, UTG calls $3.65

Turn: ($10.95) 9

(2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $5, UTG calls $4.75 all in

River: ($20.45) 5

(2 players - 1 is all in)

Final Pot: $20.45
UTG shows J

J

(a straight, Jack high)
Hero shows Q

Q

(a pair of Queens)
UTG wins $19.09
(Rake: $1.36)

But I did get this nice little hand...
Full Tilt Poker $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

BB: $19.18
UTG: $9.70
UTG+1: $10.55
UTG+2: $10.09
MP1: $5.20
MP2: $10.00
CO: $46.58
Hero (BTN): $22.94
SB: $9.80

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is BTN with a monster hand
2 folds, UTG+2 raises to $0.30, 3 folds, Hero raises to $1, 2 folds, UTG+2 calls $0.70

Flop: ($2.15) 3

6

T

(2 players)
UTG+2 checks, Hero bets $2, UTG+2 calls $2

Turn: ($6.15) 6

(2 players)
UTG+2 checks, Hero bets $4, UTG+2 raises to $7.09 all in, Hero calls $3.09

River: ($20.33) 3

(2 players - 1 is all in)

Spoiler:

LOL

running bad? Dude, youre running 4 BI's below EV at 10NL. You don't know what running bad is. And just for the sake of further pointing out how NOT running bad you are, the HH's you posted happen. frequently.

EDIT: uy, I didn't even SEE the hand sample.

01-09-2010 , 02:39 PM

#608

McAvoy

banned

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 46,476

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tbirdx24

LOL

running bad? Dude, youre running 4 BI's below EV at 10NL. You don't know what running bad is. .

lol running bad at 10nl. I should show this post to GetTheMath his 4k this week would make him punch a baby if he knew 10nl'ers were cryin about run bad.

01-09-2010 , 02:43 PM

#609

mao

adept

Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 986

Quote:

Originally Posted by McAvoy

lol running bad at 10nl. I should show this post to GetTheMath his 4k this week would make him punch a baby if he knew 10nl'ers were cryin about run bad.

gonz needs not motivation to punch babies.

01-09-2010 , 02:57 PM

#610

Perfection

veteran

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,349

Im still 40 BI below EV over my last 200k hands at 50NL. I made a thread about it and people just posted worse graphs. Theres always someone running worse than you.

Also, I dont like this KK discussion. I made a thread like 6 months ago asking for people to post their results of KK AIPF against full stacks (running < 20 VPIP I think I specified) and nobody listened. I dont want the regs to start folding KK to me when I go AIPF

01-09-2010 , 03:21 PM

#611

DDAWD

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 6,879

You guys are jerks, where's the luv?? haha

Yeah, I'm whining, but not really upset. I get more pissed when I play bad than when I run bad and I think I played reasonably well.

And yeah, I don't think I've ever run 4BI under EV over a session. But I was due. I think this brings me down to 16Bi over EV for my lifetime 10NL career. But it sure doesn't help my claw back to 25NL.

But what does bother me is I always run terrible on weekends. I don't remember the last time I had a winning weekend.

01-09-2010 , 03:22 PM

#612

Tbirdx24

old hand

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 1,630

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perfection

Im still 40 BI below EV over my last 200k hands at 50NL. I made a thread about it and people just posted worse graphs. Theres always someone running worse than you.

Please post this graph, I'm in shock. The worst I've run is 12 BI's below EV at 100NL over prob like 40k hands.

01-09-2010 , 03:57 PM

#613

Perfection

veteran

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,349

Its easier to show you this thread http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/54...-200-a-556304/

OP is down 100BI over 200k and then some guy posts a graph where he is 160BI below over 360k hands. Ive stopped whining about 40BI at 50NL.

01-09-2010 , 03:57 PM

#614

McAvoy

banned

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 46,476

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tbirdx24

Please post this graph, I'm in shock. The worst I've run is 12 BI's below EV at 100NL over prob like 40k hands.

click on his name, click view all threads started by XXXX

[x] profit

01-09-2010 , 04:19 PM

#615

Equus asinus

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,842

Quote:

Originally Posted by HappyPixel

Full Tilt Poker $0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

MP1: $208.90
MP2: $212.05
CO: $216.15
BTN: $254.00
SB: $125.00
BB: $189.00
UTG: $107.00
Hero (UTG+1): $204.55

Pre Flop: ($1.50) Hero is UTG+1 with K

K

UTG raises to $3.50, Hero raises to $11, MP1 calls $11, 2 folds, BTN raises to $40, 3 folds, Hero raises to $204.55 all in, MP1 raises to $208.90 all in, BTN calls $168.90

Flop: ($627.35) Q

Q

8

Turn: ($627.35) 3

River: ($627.35) K

Final Pot: $627.35
MP1 shows A

A

(two pair, Aces and Queens)
BTN shows A

A

(two pair, Aces and Queens)
Hero shows K

K

(a full house, Kings full of Queens)
MP1 wins $0.00
BTN wins $0.00
Hero wins $615.65
(Rake: $11.70)

LOL, I am definitely doing it wrong!

01-09-2010 , 04:59 PM

#616

strategywhat

adept

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,157

Tourneys tilt me more than anything, got 41st in the $11rebuy on Stars last night, too bad it's like nothing compared to the final table pay, QQ < KQ.

01-09-2010 , 05:07 PM

#617

nsoshnikov

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 4,986

Full Tilt Poker $50.00 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

SB: $72.15
BB: $61.45
UTG: $170.85
UTG+1: $75.00
Hero (MP1): $64.70
MP2: $74.75
CO: $50.00
BTN: $52.25

Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is MP1 with K

K

UTG raises to $1.75, 1 fold, Hero raises to $5, 1 fold, CO raises to $13.50, 5 folds

Final Pot: $12.50
CO wins $13.30
(Rake: $-0.80)

Full Tilt Poker $50.00 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

MP1: $57.60
MP2: $59.40
Hero (CO): $53.35
BTN: $75.80
SB: $101.10
BB: $53.40
UTG: $46.75
UTG+1: $69.80

Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is CO with K

K

UTG raises to $1.50, 1 fold, MP1 calls $1.50, 1 fold, Hero raises to $6, 3 folds, UTG raises to $21.50, 2 folds

Final Pot: $14.25
UTG wins $14.25

01-09-2010 , 05:11 PM

#618

Perfection

veteran

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,349

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsoshnikov

Final Pot: $12.50
CO wins $13.30
(Rake: $-0.80)

I like this rake structure. Please be telling me what level of Iron Man lets me acheive this?

01-09-2010 , 05:22 PM

#619

kevsaled3e

adept

Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 730

FACT!!

KK doesn't even win when you hit a set!

Im not in the hand but I couldnt help but think of this conversation.

Full Tilt Poker $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em - 7 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

UTG+1: $11.36
MP: $14.38
CO: $28.42
BTN: $25.20
Hero (SB): $30.08
BB: $4.30
UTG: $18.03

Pre Flop: ($0.35) Hero is SB with A

9

UTG raises to $0.50, 1 fold, MP raises to $0.75, CO raises to $1.75, 3 folds, UTG calls $1.25, MP raises to $5, CO calls $3.25, UTG calls $3.25

Flop: ($15.35) 4

5

K

(3 players)
UTG checks, MP bets $9.38 all in, CO calls $9.38, UTG folds

Turn: ($34.11) 2

(2 players - 1 is all in)

River: ($34.11) 3

(2 players - 1 is all in)

Final Pot: $34.11
MP shows A

A

(a straight, Five high)
CO shows K

K

(three of a kind, Kings)
MP wins $32.41
(Rake: $1.70)

01-09-2010 , 05:23 PM

#620

Tbirdx24

old hand

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 1,630

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perfection

Its easier to show you this thread http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/54...-200-a-556304/

OP is down 100BI over 200k and then some guy posts a graph where he is 160BI below over 360k hands. Ive stopped whining about 40BI at 50NL.

vommmmitttttt. I doubt this is at FR though. Must be like HU PLO

01-09-2010 , 06:49 PM

#621

HappyPixel

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 5,586

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsoshnikov

Full Tilt Poker $50.00 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

MP1: $57.60
MP2: $59.40
Hero (CO): $53.35
BTN: $75.80
SB: $101.10
BB: $53.40
UTG: $46.75
UTG+1: $69.80

Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is CO with K

K

UTG raises to $1.50, 1 fold, MP1 calls $1.50, 1 fold, Hero raises to $6, 3 folds, UTG raises to $21.50, 2 folds

Final Pot: $14.25
UTG wins $14.25

flat pre?

01-09-2010 , 06:57 PM

#622

nsoshnikov

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 4,986

Quote:

Originally Posted by HappyPixel

flat pre?

Hell No.

01-09-2010 , 07:09 PM

#623

Flippn Corner

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 4,783

Quote:

Originally Posted by HappyPixel

flat pre?

ahhhhhhh, good to laugh now and then

01-09-2010 , 07:14 PM

#624

Equus asinus

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,842

I don't even know wtf is going on anymore.

01-09-2010 , 07:51 PM

#625

HappyPixel

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 5,586

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsoshnikov

Hell No.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flippn Corner

ahhhhhhh, good to laugh now and then

barring some kind of read on UTG or MP it's either a pretty bad 3b or a pretty bad fold

Page 25 of 917

5 15 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 35 45 75 125 225 525

Closed Thread Subscribe

...

Page 25 of 917

5 15 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 35 45 75 125 225 525

m