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Old 11-06-2009, 11:36 AM   #7476
imfromsweden
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

Baaah, dropped another 1.4k right now
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Old 11-06-2009, 11:45 AM   #7477
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

Quote:
Originally Posted by imfromsweden View Post
Don't ever say anything to offend the Poker Gods. They will punish you.



God I'm stupid
in before Brock

you're still winning at 5 ptbb/100, so perhaps your bed of money will help you sleep at night :P
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Old 11-06-2009, 11:48 AM   #7478
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

Well that's mostly from winning at 30 ptbb/100 at 2NL so
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Old 11-06-2009, 11:50 AM   #7479
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

LOL, oh well then I rescind my consolation
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Old 11-06-2009, 12:03 PM   #7480
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joopjan View Post
try downloading pokerstove and looking at your equity vs the ranges that they are opening. If your equity > 50 you call other wise you fold. In general this is going to be 99+ aq+ vs most lp ss opens.
That is an oversimplification. The question was about a normal open by the short stack (I don't like the abbreviation), and what hands we can profitable push with. This depends on 4 things: their stack size, their bet size, their opening range, and their continuation range. On two of them we have perfect information, on the other two we need to make educated guesses.

Even if they open push we don't need 50% equity since there is dead money in the pot.

All in all I'm sure this has been discussed somewhere; otherwise we might move this to a dedicated thread.
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Old 11-06-2009, 12:26 PM   #7481
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

To beat the shortstacker, you must think like the short stacker.

Go live in Ukraine for 3 months. Eat nothing but potatoes and vodka. Discover the interwebs and figure out that you can make enough to be the wealthiest man in your town by becoming rat-holing scum.

Short stackers abuse fold equity.

You can do the same thing to them.

You should be shoving them all in with a wider (value) range than you are calling their all ins. <----- most important point.

To figure out the exact value range, you do need to play with Pokerstove as Joopjan said. It's going to be pretty stat dependent. There are some short stackers playing 3/3 and some playing 17/12 (very bad ones lol).
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Old 11-06-2009, 12:33 PM   #7482
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

....and don't forget to limp (or better 2X) your premiums from the button if an aggressive short is in your blinds.

{{2X is better cause that is the perfect steal size for all hands with blind shorties}}
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Old 11-06-2009, 12:37 PM   #7483
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

Question I've been wondering about after tangling with a 44/25 after 100 hands last night that actually seemed good...is there such a thing as a good 40+ vpiper (or 30+ for that matter)? I mean I looked at this guy and was like "aww yeah here comes the monies" and then was like wtf he's dec...
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Old 11-06-2009, 12:39 PM   #7484
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

^

http://www.liquidpoker.net/poker-for...an........html imo
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Old 11-06-2009, 12:47 PM   #7485
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

^ I'm at work on my blackberry so it doesn't show up...I'll.have to check it out when I get home...ty
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Old 11-06-2009, 12:47 PM   #7486
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

Well, if you're a good hand reader and better than everyone else at the table, it is +EV to play a lot of hands. Make small mistakes so that your opponent has a chance to make big mistakes.

Also, how do you know he's decent?
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Old 11-06-2009, 12:51 PM   #7487
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

^ I agree bůt is this player type really playing 50nl and not a mid-stake player...I know there's a recession and all but besides split (and the few peeps like him) are there really any players that are doing this at 50
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Old 11-06-2009, 12:56 PM   #7488
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

Quote:
Originally Posted by King Spew View Post
{{2X is better cause that is the perfect steal size for all hands with blind shorties}}
The reason being that shorty can profitably push the wider the bigger your steal is.
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Old 11-06-2009, 01:07 PM   #7489
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

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Originally Posted by Equus asinus View Post
To beat the shortstacker, you must think like the short stacker.

Go live in Ukraine for 3 months. Eat nothing but potatoes and vodka. Discover the interwebs and figure out that you can make enough to be the wealthiest man in your town by becoming rat-holing scum.

Short stackers abuse fold equity.

You can do the same thing to them.

You should be shoving them all in with a wider (value) range than you are calling their all ins. <----- most important point.

To figure out the exact value range, you do need to play with Pokerstove as Joopjan said. It's going to be pretty stat dependent. There are some short stackers playing 3/3 and some playing 17/12 (very bad ones lol).
#1 Rule to beating SS'ers imo. If you dont believe me then ask Baluga.
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Old 11-06-2009, 01:08 PM   #7490
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

How many hands mpmp?

I will run pretty donkish stats on some tables for up to and over 100ish hands. Not sure how often I sustain above 30 for that long but I definitely do sometimes. I will be going around the table and color coding fish, and often I see my stats and go "omg look at that donk... oh wait. " IMO, it gets harder once you get to 30+ vpip. Then you are probably playing too loose to sustainably crush, for most mortals anyway.

I know the feeling though. At 50 I think the good sLAG players are pretty few, but I'm noticing more at 100. People who play 20/15 well.

Some things to look for are.
  • Sample Size ldo
  • Are they isoing droolers a lot - that can really skew stats
  • Look for any hands they have shown down - did they build a big pot with a marginal hand against a reg? -> fish
  • On the other hand, if they are not getting to show down much, and when they do they have the goods -> probably solid
  • Do they seem positionally aware?
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Old 11-06-2009, 01:09 PM   #7491
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

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Originally Posted by #1ThunderFan View Post
#1 Rule to beating SS'ers imo. If you dont believe me then ask Baluga.
True that. BW FTW!
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Old 11-06-2009, 01:10 PM   #7492
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

Positional awareness is key. Any time I see someone with really screwy stats, I'll open up the detailed window and see if perhaps they are just playing 100% of their buttons or something.

I don't do it that much for VPIP, but I use it a lot for PFR and 3bet.
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Old 11-06-2009, 01:10 PM   #7493
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

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#1 Rule to beating SS'ers imo. If you dont believe me then ask Baluga.
Yeah, I heard of the concept before.

Spoiler:
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Old 11-06-2009, 01:16 PM   #7494
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

I think my roadtrip will now include a stop over in the Ukraine as suggested so that i can better understand the short stack mentality and i can turn myself into a Cossack in no time

Last edited by El Nino 1; 11-06-2009 at 01:23 PM.
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Old 11-06-2009, 01:18 PM   #7495
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

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Originally Posted by Cangurino View Post
Yeah, I heard of the concept before.

Spoiler:
LOL. Yeah, it's obviously pretty simple and that's the beauty, but it needs to "click" for people.

When we first are learning to deal with SS's, we goo zomg fml they make me fold all the time

Well... in hindsight it's totally obvious that we can just throw their game right back at them, but sometimes people need a hint.
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Old 11-06-2009, 01:18 PM   #7496
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

cossack? Or is that the stupid american spelling?
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Old 11-06-2009, 01:20 PM   #7497
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

It was over about 100 hands... For the fist 50ish he was runniung 55+ vpip. I didn't know if he was just having a run of cards but he wasn't doing anything special and only had a $55 stack (although I did forget to look what he bought in for) just wondering cuz the only couple hands I got involved with him was a KK (me) vs. AA aipf, and another hand that I raised pre and cbet flop and he folded. I never really got into many situationas with him cuz he was in a wierd position and never was in good spots for 3betting and etc
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Old 11-06-2009, 01:23 PM   #7498
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

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Originally Posted by springsteen87 View Post
cossack? Or is that the stupid american spelling?
Im English so unfortunately that would have been the stupid English guy attempting to spell a word he didnt know how to spell and was too lazy to look it up
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Old 11-06-2009, 01:25 PM   #7499
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpmpjuicem View Post
It was over about 100 hands... For the fist 50ish he was runniung 55+ vpip. I didn't know if he was just having a run of cards but he wasn't doing anything special and only had a $55 stack (although I did forget to look what he bought in for) just wondering cuz the only couple hands I got involved with him was a KK (me) vs. AA aipf, and another hand that I raised pre and cbet flop and he folded. I never really got into many situationas with him cuz he was in a wierd position and never was in good spots for 3betting and etc
LOL, yeah 55+ over 50 and not reloading definitely tips the scales solidly to fish.

Sometimes they just own you and it's unreal. I had a guy playing 100% vpip @ 100nl on halloween. I was like holy crap!!! Drunk high stakes player?? WTF is going on?

He was just a donk though. He dropped 400+ in under 100 hands. I shipped AK, pf, he flips KK. gg. I b/b/s TP and he calls down with underpair that rivers set lol. Ended up grinding most of it back from him and another fish at the table (juciest I have seen in a while - legendary).

Just have to laugh it off.


Quote:
Originally Posted by El Nino 1 View Post
I think my roadtrip will now include a stop over in the Ukraine as suggested so that i can better understand the short stack mentality and i can turn myself into a Cossack in no time

LOL, you might not leave when you OWN a village.
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Old 11-06-2009, 01:27 PM   #7500
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Re: ***Official 2009 Micro Stakes FR Full Tilt Regulars Thread***

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cossack? Or is that the stupid american spelling?
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Nino 1 View Post
Im English so unfortunately that would have been the stupid English guy attempting to spell a word he didnt know how to spell and was too lazy to look it up
I have a nack for remembering medieval (ignore that cossacks are post-medieval) terms and how to spell them...

NERD ALERT
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