why are people whining about SSers when they have deep tables ?
just play deep.

You have to question whether FR is viable anymore ..

50bb tables are full of regs and the rest are full of shorties ...

The shorties problem in FR is getting out of control IMO ..

FTP is bad enough ... but ipoker is even worse .. its hard finding a normal table with less than 6 nowadays .. and its probably going to get worse unless something is done ..

The lure of 6 max is strong ... ok, its more aggro, but there are loads more fish and a lot less shorties ..

I do enjoy FR .. but there comes a point where you think long term .. and the sooner i get used to 6 max .. the better it will probbaly be for me .

Why does everyone use that as a arguement.


Fact is, most fish do not like to play deep. Only the super huge gambolllllllers that are terrible. Those don't come around too much.

Why are the shorties the ones getting paid off by the fish then, if all of us are playing deep.


Terrible arguement.

Then how does creating more short stack tables solve this problem? If fish want to play short, it seems like the only way around this is to not allow them to.

Besides, if you aren't a good poker player, it's smart to play short.

This is a bad arguement. If you play a lot of tables then there arent enough good deep tables.

THere's a lot more to this problem than a "just do this" answer can address.

You may not see the effect if you only 2-4 table even 6, but overall it also has a negative impact.. because the shortstackers win pots from fish at 20BB a time. Fish dont rebuy... bot shortstackers create fish shortstackers. bot shortstackers bust fish. They have a negative impact on your biggest source of winnings while hardly playing any actual poker n theyre not required to make any crucial decisions. This has a negative impact on regs and fish wether you as a reg is running + from shortstackers or not. I am winning money from the SS's, but I want them gone because big picture is that I will not win as much as I would without them around. The fish would live longer also.

How you can argue against this with a one line sentence is beyond me.

try playing some 200nl+ and you'll see what the problem is

heh even at nl25 it stinks

I honestly think the best method to fix the SS problem is start deep tables. I think the fish with deep pockets aren't really paying attention to what kind of tables they are joining. They just join a table that has like 8/9 and post their BB and start playing. So to increase their chances of joining a deep table, we just need to increase the ratio of deep tables to normal tables. There have been times where there were only 6-8 deep tables during peak hours. That is our fault. We need to start these tables. The other day there was only like 10 deep tables at 50nl, and me and this other guy - maybe a 2p2er - started like 10 more tables. We would play heads up and once a few people joined, it didn't take long to get to a full table. Once that table filled, we would hop on another empty deep table. Of course you will end up having to play a little bit of heads up, but who cares? It's fun.

enty, shame on you.

nothing compares to NL200..think about the same number of short stackers as NL25 but 1/10th of the tables.

I disagree. I've started both deep and regular tables. The reg tables will fill very quickly sometimes within a minute. On the deep tables you can sit there for 20 minutes without anyone joining.

Part of the problem is that the reg tables are the default and are easier to find. When the deep tables were first introduced they used to fill quickly but then FTP updated and separated the deeps. Ever since then the deeps have been very slow to fill and a nitfest.

This is true.

I didn't say it compares but it still stinks so microstakers are also effected

yeah so obviously the answer is starting deep tables, no ?
i cant comment on 200nl+ but im sure its worse.

i cant ever see tilt or any other major poker site introducing 50bb min regular tables or anything close, thats just wishful thinking iyam. obviously shortstackers are bad for us, thats beside the point. the fact is they are a major rake creating factor that the sites dont want to lose.

i dont care if i have to play regs hu, i just want to get deep tables started, and tbh this seems more a problem with tilt than anything else. i played on stars 50nl FR too and 50bb min tables start a whole lot faster there. i dont have to sit around and wait for 20 minutes on stars, but i do on tilt. all you have to do is play a reg hu for 100 hands max and fish will flock to your table.. theres still plenty of fish at deep tables if u ask me.

(and yes ive played 20+ 50bb min tables as well as 9 or 12.)

edit: hi fareed

I am starting to come to this conclusion as well. Been learning some 6 max and it is fun. The key is to remember variance goes both positive and negative.
Plus not worrying about SS'ers is nice.
Although I have been getting some free coaching for FR so I am playing FR currently. Never hurts to know both games as Equus asinus always tells me.

Fish want to play 100/75 BB's. Playing at a deep table, if they double up, or even half up their stack. All 150BB is at risk by most of the players there. (Mostly regulars).

I never said anything about starting more short tables.

I support King Spew's plan. Which if you have not read, I'd suggest you search or read the Interent Forums FTP Answers 10/1 Thread. Plenty of good plans there.

edited*

Yeah, I do to. That guy is Da Nuts.

..maybe even, dare I say, Top Nut?

what is the plan, shorts vs firing squad?

Fish just want to play the "normal" tables. If there isnt a deep icon next to a 50bb min table, they will sit there.

Also, the best way to combat SSers is to just sit out when there is too many. Fish will join the deep tables if they are the only ones with open seats. When all regs start doing this, it works beautifully. Just my input.

Question here.


What do you guys think about the micro NL tables here at FT ? I am not a great player but liek to play agnst really spewy lagtards but they are on late at night or when 2x pts are on. other then that there are alot of .50 25% tables out there,.

If you want me to start tables with you i will, dont normally play deep but have no problem doing it

I understand the arguments that you guys are making about the short stackers and playing with them certainly does suck but they are certainly beatable altho they do cause problems as they get in the way of fish
That said i think that if you table select and move tables often enough you can certainly get some good tables going at all times of the day bar like 5am - 7am FT time. Those are horrible but most evenings the games are good.
You can also do what i do when starting tables, i wont sit play a guy if he sits down with 20bbs, i just type in $20+ when starting $50nl tables

Your way nicer than I am, I hit and run SS's who join the tables I start every chance I get.

why are the 50nl tables feel like death tonight?

I'll start deep tables with you all, 25NL or 50NL. Just send a PM or post ITT.

I like playing HU, makes me feel like durrrr