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iLost iLost

11-04-2009 , 02:57 PM
villain is a fine reg. 25/21/2 , fold to 3bet 40%.


Poker Stars $2/$4 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

SB: $397.65
BB: $226.05
UTG: $449.20
MP: $396.00
CO: $401.00
Hero (BTN): $412.00

Pre Flop: ($6.00) Hero is BTN with A K
UTG raises to $16, 2 folds, Hero raises to $49, 2 folds, UTG calls $33

Flop: ($104.00) 4 A J (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $77, UTG calls $77

Turn: ($258.00) Q (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero
iLost Quote
11-04-2009 , 03:26 PM
check
iLost Quote
11-04-2009 , 03:28 PM
I like checking the turn. If the river brick then maybe we can value bet, maybe we can't depends on villian. If the board gets even worst, hopefully we are able to check it down. Think I might fold if he bets a scary river.
iLost Quote
11-04-2009 , 04:19 PM
Just check it... river is were its interesting
iLost Quote
11-04-2009 , 04:24 PM
check turn and check back riv if checked to you.
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 12:00 AM
easy poker!

villain 4bet % in my sample is 0.

Poker Stars $2/$4 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

SB: $397.65
BB: $226.05
UTG: $449.20
MP: $396.00
CO: $401.00
Hero (BTN): $412.00

Pre Flop: ($6.00) Hero is BTN with A K
UTG raises to $16, 2 folds, Hero raises to $49, 2 folds, UTG calls $33

Flop: ($104.00) 4 A J (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $77, UTG calls $77

Turn: ($258.00) Q (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero checks

River: ($258.00) A (2 players)
UTG bets $323 all in


since BTN is a soft point to 3bet from, can he float flop with TT-55 and try pushing me on the river of KQ or some kind of J from my perceived range?
if I have to fold river, what river bet should I call?

Last edited by stickychips15; 11-05-2009 at 12:08 AM.
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 12:59 AM
no way im folding this
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 01:01 AM
Unless villain is bluffing river w/ KJ I really dont see how you can call. I mean what are we beating?
/
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 01:31 AM
Fold. Also...

Quote:
Originally Posted by stickychips15
since BTN is a soft point to 3bet from, can he float flop with TT-55 and try pushing me on the river of KQ or some kind of J from my perceived range?
lol.
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 01:33 AM
first sorry for my english. as a non native speaker writing drunk gets way worse.

second, whats so lol about it? will he never try pushing me off a mediocre holding? my check looks weak.
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 01:36 AM
Fold. You don't even have KQ in your range.

Your flop cbet is way too large. By default I'd cbet ~$54 as standard in 3b pots, but on this board you can even go $40 or so.
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 01:38 AM
The guy is not gonna OOP float an underpair on an AJx rainbow flop when you've threebet his UTG open. It's insanity. I mean it's equivalent to speculating that his fold to cbet is 0%, because if he doesn't fold this flop, when does he fold?
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 01:40 AM
Ok, fair enough.

So if I fold to a shove, what do I call?
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 02:46 AM
Looks like a fold, not really much ya beat. And cbet around half pot given the board texture
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 02:57 AM
Damn, tough spot I guess... my gut reaction is snaperooni.

Dunno that you'd be posting it if he didn't have AQ, AJ, JJ, or QQ since he did raise/call3b from UTG. If villain is a "fine" reg then ya I doubt he has worse A's in his range, and he likely 4bets KK pf. Maybe it is a fold after all.
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 03:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stickychips15
Ok, fair enough.

So if I fold to a shove, what do I call?
Probably nothing, but that's OK because you won't get exploited for it. If you think he'll actually shove 100% on the river since you can't call with this line, then call, and start checking all your stronger hands on the turn aswell.
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 03:13 AM
CALL YOU HAV E TRIPZ
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 03:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grindcore
Probably nothing
instafold?
so you say villains bottom range is a low full house and there are 0% bluffs in his range?
idk about this.

Last edited by stickychips15; 11-05-2009 at 03:22 AM.
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 07:22 AM
There's no bluffs in his range because there are no bluffs in his flop check calling range and nothing has changed. The check call meant that he had at least a decent hand, and he's now telling you he has the upper end of his range.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grindcore
Probably nothing, but that's OK because you won't get exploited for it. If you think he'll actually shove 100% on the river since you can't call with this line, then call, and start checking all your stronger hands on the turn aswell.
This. If you actually had to call here, your perception of the guy wouldn't be "good reg", it would be "psycho aggro guy who never folds cbets, pick lines which induce bluffs at all costs".
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 08:46 AM
sick levels itt
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 10:18 AM
I snap without a Q on the board, but against a player you describe as "good reg" I fold this. Why?
1. he raised UTG which if he is a good reg should be a narrow range
2. you 3bet on the BTN which if you know what you are doing should be a wide range
3. he never 4bets in your sample so when he calls OOP it means he probably has QQ+, AKs maybe but rarely AQs and never mind his fold to 3bet, because I'm pretty sure it's different from the times he calls OOP or IP
4. he c/ced a very good flop for you which suggests he has a piece of it or is not willing to fold his pair yet
5. your play on turn suggested you didn't want to commit to the hand I mean what hands checks such a drawy turn? Scared aces, KK,1010 so you just made your hand if you have one face up.
6. since your hand is face up he will always play the river perfectly against you
7. river doesn't look like it could have helped him but it also is a good card for his KK
8. if we have him beat we should expect a c/c from him if we don't we should expect a shove that hopes to get looked up light
9. we could be splitting sometimes I guess but the chance of him having the case ace and the pot odds wont let us call to split

So to conclude: -you are beat, fold.


I avoid spots like this by betting all the way. And the way I do that is I size my flop bet a bit smaller w such a large 3bet and I bet/fold 1/3 pot on turn w bluffs and call w strong hands.
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 11:22 AM
bet flop smaller

fold now for sure, he's not turning made hands into bluffs and is definitely not vbetting worse.
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 01:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grindcore
Fold. You don't even have KQ in your range.

Your flop cbet is way too large. By default I'd cbet ~$54 as standard in 3b pots, but on this board you can even go $40 or so.
GC, I'm curious why KQ isn't in his range?
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 01:12 PM
people who fold to 3bet 40% of the time have pretty much anything when they call. id slowroll the river
iLost Quote
11-05-2009 , 01:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Imrahil
people who fold to 3bet 40% of the time have pretty much anything when they call. id slowroll the river
Probably isn't the same OOP as IP. I never flat mediocre hand OOP but I might sometimes IP.
iLost Quote

      
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