Thanks andyhai, makes sense.

no problem, happy i could be of assistance

Actually making it always 4x would be a huge leak but making it always 3x won't be. I think split mentioned that.

Don't forget not to worry about being exploited by someone who won't exploit.

It is really a great guide. Thanks much.

Maybe it already has been asked, but 29 pages is a lot to read. What can you expect in bb/100 playing this strategy at say 2NL and what do the best microstakes grinders make at that level?

you realize that sometimes things take a bit of effort in order to make it worth your while right?

This guide is super solid. Even though I have been playing 50NL for a while this guide is excellent to reinforce the concepts integral to winning poker. I'm sure everyone is very thankful that you took the time to write all of this invaluable information. Thanks and gl.

And a lot of us that had this knowledge by the time SirCuddles wrote this probably wish he hadn't. *chuckle*

In all seriousness, it's a great guide - just made the micros a bit tougher than they used to be but you could probably say that about all levels of poker.

Oh for the pre UEIGA days on Party - wow, were those good times.

The micros are loaded down with nits and regs who have already mastered this material, if not more. If one really wants to beat the micros, this is not enough. People are not waiting to stack off to your value bets.

If someone is playing 75% of his hands and wants to stop losing, this will help. Otherwise, this is inadequate. I don't see a significant difference between this strategy and that promoted by Phil Hellmuth, which is regularly mocked.

Guides like this are a recipe for frustration.

I searched through the pages quickly, but I didn't find it, I just didn't read it word by word, so I'll ask again: What can you expect in bb/100 playing this strategy at say 2NL and what do the best microstakes grinders make at that level?

It doesn't work that way. While I'm not a fan of this material, such information is necessary (but not sufficient) to beat 2NL.

I'm just trying to compare myself to others..

Over the 5k hands that I recorded at this level i made 8 bb/100

first off, sincere congratulations on booking a win over your first 5k hands.

that said...

1. i'm not a stats expert type dude, but i don't think 5k hands is a big enough sample from which to extrapolate a reliable winrate.
2. and imho, worrying about winrates is not the point @ 2NL; so long as you're actually winning a bit, don't worry about it, just keep studying and playing until you have enough bankroll to move up to the next limit, and then keep studying and playing til the next, and the next, and the next etc. comparing your own wr to the 'theoretical max wr' @ 2NL is kinda counterproductive; i assume since you're playing 2NL and posting ITT that you're just beginning your poker improvement, so comparing winrates with people who have/usually played much higher limits is likely to be disheartening and de-motivating.
3. this one's maybe a bit of a leap, but anyway - hope you realise that the strategies this guide suggests are just a foundation, not the whole structure; if you currently play as advised in this guide, then the way you play now is simply a starting point, and you should start reading some of the other great info on the forums to further expand your understanding of the game. neither this strategy, nor any other simple strategy, will ever be enough on its own to crush all poker. thus, worrying about what your wr is now after pretty much just following this guide is imho a waste of time; if you constantly study and improve, your theoretical wr should change and improve anyway, so when you're at higher limits, what will it matter what you used to beat 2NL for? when your understanding of the game was far less?

wow post got long without my realising. anyway hope my random thoughts are in some way helpful, and echt succes jongen (hope i said that right )

Yes, you said it right xD

Well, this guide was written a year ago. And there are enough donks that this still works, but yeah u just gotta adjust to the regs some. Leave the fancy-a$$ play to 400NL+

great thread that has really helped my play out.

has cuddles posted anything as of late?

Nah, he made enough to buy a screaming gaming PC and quit poker to take up WoW or something.

He should win microstakes player of the year for 2010 imo.

I'm half tempted to try to get a hold of him, play 10k of 2nl for him in his account to qualify and then nominate him.

His profile says he played 50NL, which means he never beat the micros himself. After he dropped out of poker, he reappeared here (#363) and admitted his guide is nowhere near complete. It is just a tipsheet for fish.

IMHO this "guide" is misleading. It tells people how to play like breakeven regs.

So, what is it like being a life nit?

Seriously, the proof of the value of sircuddles' thread is that it is over a year later and people are still using it. He never claimed to be crushing the micros or even that his work told anything to someone beating 25nl. The purpose was simply get someone on the right track from consistently losing and not knowing what to do. Being a BE regular is the first step to winning and makes that person better than the majority of players.

1.) This guy claimed to provide a complete guide to beating the micros. This falls in the same category as Phil Hellmuth's book claiming he was showing how to Play Poker Like The Pros. Hellmuth is routinely mocked for that book. At least Hellmuth is a pro, while OP never actually beat the micros. He cashed out and quit, apparently.

2.) He claims you can beat the micros by only going for fat value and hoping there are enough calling stations to pay off your monsters. I don't remember it working in the pre-UIGEA era and I doubt it works now.

3.) I only started having a significant winrate when I stopped playing like this. So I know the frustration of people who play like this and wonder why they are still not winning.

4.) If I saw alot of discussions of how to get beyond this sort of strategy, that would be one thing. Instead, anyone who asks about micro strategy is sent here. Like I said, much of the information here is necessary, but not sufficient to beating the micros.

In that case we look forward to your guide to beating the micros

First, I would have to beat the micros myself. At that point, I would stop caring about micros. If I could beat the micros, I might just sit there, keep my mouth shut, and print money.

Great thread SirCuddles !!