Is there an optimal line in this situation? I have no reads on villain. I am posting this hand after looking through my HH's in HEM. I realized I always feel vulnerable and not confident in these spots (As seen by my flop bet... yikes) I feel if we 4bet large we turn our hand face up. Should we do this? How bad is a c/c c/c c/c line? Your help is appreciated. Notice that we are both deep. Thank you.

Hands:250
Vpip: 23
PFR: 20
3bet%: 13
Fold to 3bet: 58%


Full Tilt Poker $50.00 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

UTG+2: $51.85
MP1: $43.15
Hero (MP2): $136.65
CO: $141.85
BTN: $114.30
SB: $16.00
BB: $53.50
UTG: $50.50
UTG+1: $80.40

Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is MP2 with A A
4 folds, Hero raises to $2, CO raises to $6, 3 folds, Hero raises to $15, CO calls $9

Flop: ($30.75) 5 T 6 (2 players)
Hero bets $10.00, CO raises to $30, Hero...?

Edit: Is there any merit to flatting the three bet pre? I just feel playing this deep in a bloated pot is incredibly difficult at times.

I make preflop about 19-21. Bet more on flop as you already know. I don't know why you're even remotely scared of this flop. If he ever has a set here you'll be getting your money back shortly anyway. Now its just a matter of whether he will hang himself with KK/QQ imo

If you make it 20 pot would then be about 40. What would your Cbet amount be? Thanks a lot.

You make it $20 preflop (40bb) because effective stacks are ~275bb. Then the pot is 80bb and you've got 235bb behind, so SPR is 3. Anything bigger than 2/3 pot on the flop and you can shove turn for a pot sized bet.

Betting 1/3 pot has some merit if you're doing it to induce a bluff from hands like JJ-KK or some wacky Ax hands. Then you should call and hope he barrels the turn. If he doesn't then you still only have a pot sized bet left, but it will be harder to get him to call on the river than if you had just been firing all the way.

as played make it 55/call, or shove turn if he flats flop 3bet.

i would 4bet bigger pre. stack size is a bit akward to shove turn, so either leading flop for 3/4PSB then shove turn or 1/2PSB planning on betting turn/shoving river seems best

AF would be nice to know. anyways seems like he does this as often w/ JJ+ as TT imo.

I think I'm ahead of his range like 95% of the time on this flop... So pretty much he'll fold AK to any cbet, and probably peel any KK and maybe even QQ, so I go for close to pot.

Thanks everyone.

He almost never has a set here. How many regs have you seen 3bet 1010/66/55 ip. Even if he did calling your 4bet would be bad even this deep.

Being this deep, I think you can make it more like $25 pre. If you 4bet larger pre it makes it more of a mistake if villain has TT and it makes it easier to get it in vs JJ-KK(on this particular flop)

Def CB larger (unless you have a read that a smaller bet will induce). The part of his range that you're trying to target is JJ-KK, if he has JJ or QQ and an over hits ott it could possibly scare him off so try to get as much money in otf. So 3bet w/ the intention of getting ai on this flop. The only reason to flat otf imo is if you had some stone cold read villain has AK.

Good reasoning. Thanks a lot.

lol - 4betting to 25$ pre? wtf, do we ever not have AA when we 4bet so ****ing huge? Your 4bet size is fine. I would prolly bet around 17 on the flop, and once he raises the you just need to get the money in. make it like 55-60 and call a shove. villain almost never has a set here.

Is there any validity to making it bigger pre because we are deep?

Not unless you like turning over your cards and telling your opponents what you have. 4betting to 25 is ridiculous. I probably would make it a little bigger pre because you are so deep but not more than like 17. you want to make 4bets bigger oop in general too. But seriously if he is 3bet/calling a 4bet with any hand that makes a set on this flop then that is just bad. If the flop had come KQ2 then you have a problem but this flop the way the hand played out is just sooooooooooooo good for you. If he did have a set plz post it.

No set... but...

Full Tilt Poker $50.00 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players - View hand 750839
The Official DeucesCracked.com Hand History Converter

UTG+2: $51.85
MP1: $43.15
Hero (MP2): $136.65
CO: $141.85
BTN: $114.30
SB: $16.00
BB: $53.50
UTG: $50.50
UTG+1: $80.40

Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is MP2 with A A
4 folds, Hero raises to $2, CO raises to $6, 3 folds, Hero raises to $15, CO calls $9

Flop: ($30.75) 5 T 6 (2 players)
Hero bets $10.00, CO raises to $30, Hero raises to $50, CO raises to $126.85, Hero calls $71.65 all in

Turn: ($274.05) 2 (2 players - 1 is all in)

River: ($274.05) Q (2 players - 1 is all in)

Final Pot: $274.05
Hero shows A A
CO shows 5 6
CO wins $271.05
(Rake: $3.00)

hahhaha, you gotta love it

Grunch

Its a 4bet pot and you have AA. Board is T high. Never fold here. I would flat the raise and then call down to not scare him off worse overpairs.

yeah, I just feel the turn would go c/c a lot...

lol - I pretty much hate they way he played this hand. Sometimes you make terrible calls and get lucky

You see......i told you he never has a set here.

I would have gone with it too. When he has that hand you are still over 20% i think.

Skinny, readdress your preflop raise amounts. You gave a reasoning of "turning your hand face up", but that is not a big negative as you might think. That would only be really bad against the elite that know what to do in the thinnest of spots. Those kind are almost extinct, as they would have already progressed past 50NL. Just make the play, villian can't profit from set-mining even that deep if you make it 21.00 4bet.

Sports analogies are usually crap, but this is college basketball. Don't overthink it, just make the play. Pivot, off the glass, get back on defense. 4bet big, punish KK-JJ, adjust as you play more hands.

If c-betting 10 and getting raised to 30 doesnt make you feel well, not saying it is the best play, but not cbetting to insure QQ hangs on would be better then bet/folding AA on a 105X board.

Why 4bet small? to get hands like 5 6 suited it, deep. You got what you wanted, and he got what he wanted, deep.