Too aggro? - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

Two Plus Two Forums Poker Strategy Online No-Limit Hold’em Cash

Too aggro?

Post Reply Subscribe

...

Page 1 of 2

1 2

Page 1 of 2

1 2

06-05-2021 , 03:53 PM

IIlllIlIllIIlIlllI

journeyman

Join Date: Feb 2020 Posts: 364

PokerStars - $0.05 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 98.6 BB
Hero (SB): 102.2 BB
BB: 100 BB
UTG: 100 BB
MP: 101 BB
CO: 27.8 BB

Hero posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has T

fold, fold, fold, BTN raises to 3 BB, Hero raises to 12 BB, fold, BTN calls 9 BB

Flop: (25 BB, 2 players) T

Hero checks, BTN bets 12 BB, Hero calls 12 BB

Turn: (49 BB, 2 players) 2

Hero checks, BTN bets 37 BB, Hero raises to 78.2 BB and is all-in

I don't think I ever call here right? Is this a slam dunk fold? Or a 'sigh jam'? In theory I would think a jam is OK? Of course they can stil have sets and better top pairs. I wonder if people are bluffing this enough though. Maybe I don't have enough fold equity if people's ranges are more value heavy than they should be in this spot?

Quote

06-05-2021 , 03:58 PM

Icecreamcone

enthusiast

Join Date: May 2021 Posts: 63

Folding shouldn't be bad here, most villain's have at least top pair here, not betting FDs or anything like that, and this is also underbluffed spot.

Calling is worst, but against certain players, can see this is c/r jam. Basically, weaker players/whales you'll see them bet some stuff like T7, T8 etc, so highly villain dependent.

Quote

06-05-2021 , 04:15 PM

YanasaurBBQ

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2020 Posts: 2,101

I disagree that people aren't bluffing this enough. I think people bluff this type of board too much in my experience which is why I like the play. If we dont expect opponent to bluff we should probably just lead the flop since its a dream flop for our hand and we are vulnerable. You 3 bet pre and now checked twice. Your hand is super under repped, you look like AK or 88, 99 type of hand. Well done I say. He can have sets sure, but I think folding here is way too weak considering the way we've played the hand

Quote

06-05-2021 , 04:23 PM

SharkytheFish

adept

Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 1,114

This is a fold pre for me. Turn shove is pretty bad given the action post. What worse hands in villains range did you think were calling the turn shove?

Quote

06-05-2021 , 04:26 PM

Icecreamcone

enthusiast

Join Date: May 2021 Posts: 63

Quote:

Originally Posted by YanasaurBBQ

So in your experience, lots of players are betting their Ax here ?

Quote

06-05-2021 , 04:28 PM

YanasaurBBQ

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2020 Posts: 2,101

Quote:

Originally Posted by SharkytheFish

This is a fold pre for me. Turn shove is pretty bad given the action post. What worse hands in villains range did you think were calling the turn shove?

109, 108, 107, flush draws, str8 draws, plus getting villain to fold overcards that have equity against us.

Quote

06-05-2021 , 04:29 PM

newguyhere

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2016 Posts: 7,164

Quote:

Originally Posted by SharkytheFish

This is a fold pre for me.

Standard 3bet

Quote

06-05-2021 , 04:29 PM

YanasaurBBQ

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2020 Posts: 2,101

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icecreamcone

So in your experience, lots of players are betting their Ax here ?

Yes, Ax and any two really. They bet too often when we 3bet OOP pre and then check. It could be my pool I don't know.

Quote

06-05-2021 , 04:46 PM

21Outer

grinder

Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 485

I'm range betting otf for 1/3.

I think I'm probably betting 1/3 ott. Don't want V checking back when a ton of cards are bad otr, i.e. club,Q,K,A,3.

On a blank river I'm check/calling.

Quote

06-05-2021 , 05:04 PM

#10

TRUSTtheDRAWCESS

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2016 Posts: 2,775

I'm definitely not checking flop here, and on this board I would use a bigger sizing, I think around 50% is good. Though probably 1/3 is fine aswell.

Definitely calling once you've checked. Turn, I really have no clue if you should call so I will check in GTO Wizard and see what it says.

Wow, GTO Wizard actually loves your shove OTT and is almost pure jamming with some calls it. Well played.

Flop actions:

Turn (you have no donks so I didnt screenshot it):

Quote

06-05-2021 , 06:25 PM

#11

Ramius

veteran

Join Date: Jan 2021 Posts: 2,148

interesting that for gto wizard sixes are turn shove but a6 is folding

Quote

06-05-2021 , 07:03 PM

#12

IIlllIlIllIIlIlllI

journeyman

Join Date: Feb 2020 Posts: 364

Quote:

Originally Posted by YanasaurBBQ

Yeah exactly, IDK if this is a thing but I'm at the top of my checking range I think. Maybe QT too? I probably bet most of the stronger Tx and x TT? After x/c flop x turn I think it's one of the stronger hands in my range? Just calling leaves me with basically no money on the river and they may be able to check back. I'm obviously never folding to the river jam if I just call. So I think it's between folding and jamming. And yeah, folding just feels weak here. Maybe it's totally OK though, IDK.

As for flop, you tink I should bet? I figured I can't go bet bet bet. I think I'd rather do that with like AT+?

Quote

06-05-2021 , 07:05 PM

#13

IIlllIlIllIIlIlllI

journeyman

Join Date: Feb 2020 Posts: 364

Quote:

Originally Posted by SharkytheFish

This is a fold pre for me. Turn shove is pretty bad given the action post. What worse hands in villains range did you think were calling the turn shove?

Because of 3x sizing or? Are you folding this to 2.5x? That seems suuuuper tight no?

Quote

06-05-2021 , 07:11 PM

#14

IIlllIlIllIIlIlllI

journeyman

Join Date: Feb 2020 Posts: 364

Quote:

Originally Posted by 21Outer

I'm range betting otf for 1/3.

I think I'm probably betting 1/3 ott. Don't want V checking back when a ton of cards are bad otr, i.e. club,Q,K,A,3.

On a blank river I'm check/calling.

Yeah, I wasn't sure if this is a 1/4 range spot or more like a bet big or check with overpairs/strong top pair/bluffs with overcards/backdoors?

I would think turn is an overbet (or big bet) or check spot if we bet 1/4 or 1/3 on flop, as they're probably pretty capped?

But yeah, so many bad river cards, I think I could safely check call non club/overcard rivers if turn checks through. But yeah, if turn goes x/x IDK how we respond to a club/Q/K/A etc

Quote

06-05-2021 , 07:15 PM

#15

Ramius

veteran

Join Date: Jan 2021 Posts: 2,148

turn check raise looks like self inflicted by combo of 3betting 3x opening and half pot cbet, it's hard to play normal 3 streets poker, but it's propably ok to polarize and just shove turn, villain have decision with 66-99, his draws have all equity in the world but not enaugh, but by check shipping turn hero just gave villain pot odds call with his draws, villain should only call sets otf, so it doesnt really matter for this part of range

Quote

06-05-2021 , 07:25 PM

#16

IIlllIlIllIIlIlllI

journeyman

Join Date: Feb 2020 Posts: 364

Quote:

Originally Posted by TRUSTtheDRAWCESS

Turn (you have no donks so I didnt screenshot it):

I knew I was a poker prodigy

Thanks for this! I just figured I can never call cause that would leave me with like 1/4 PSB left on the river or something. Between jamming and folding, folding felt very weak. Tx is one of the best hands I can have here after taking the line I did, and I unblock the draw, so I don't think I can fold, as much as this isn't a fun spot

Quote

06-05-2021 , 07:27 PM

#17

IIlllIlIllIIlIlllI

journeyman

Join Date: Feb 2020 Posts: 364

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramius

So I can just lead jam turn for like 1.5x pot after x/c flop? Or should I bet flop jam turn? After x/c flop, I don't *think* I have leads on this turn? Maybe I could call a small bet and fold bad rivers, but vs that size I think I have to jam?

I like that line a lot actually, bet flop jam turn. I guess most of their range is underpairs, weak Tx, flush draws and random backdoor **** that floated the flop bet like QJs etc.

But wouldn't I rather do that with a more polarized range? TJs feels so middling here, although I suppose I still deny a whole lot of equity

Quote

06-05-2021 , 07:34 PM

#18

Ramius

veteran

Join Date: Jan 2021 Posts: 2,148

Quote:

Originally Posted by IIlllIlIllIIlIlllI

Given flop sizing bet flop and jam turn-yes. This is sb vs btn, villain cant have overpair here, if he have then solver is not that helpfull for this hand, any tp is just nuts, villlain have a lot of worse hands he may call or a lot of his equity is danied

Quote

06-05-2021 , 07:41 PM

#19

IIlllIlIllIIlIlllI

journeyman

Join Date: Feb 2020 Posts: 364

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramius

Yeah I know the top pair is strong but I figured I'd rather do that with like KT+ and have some top pair in my check calling range? I guess we still want to deny equity though as it sucks check calling down with this, so we'll be pushed off the best hand quite often.

Quote

06-05-2021 , 07:57 PM

#20

newguyhere

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2016 Posts: 7,164

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramius

Given flop sizing bet flop and jam turn-yes. This is sb vs btn, villain cant have overpair here, if he have then solver is not that helpfull for this hand, any tp is just nuts, villlain have a lot of worse hands he may call or a lot of his equity is danied

Maybe not, although I don't think population is 4betting JJ at 100%

But even if no overpairs, villain can still have all the better TPs

Quote

06-05-2021 , 09:18 PM

#21

SharkytheFish

adept

Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 1,114

Quote:

Originally Posted by YanasaurBBQ

109, 108, 107, flush draws, str8 draws, plus getting villain to fold overcards that have equity against us.

Interesting, I havent played 5nl in a very long time but when I did I wouldnt have encountered most of these hands in the average opponents 4bet flatting range. Assigning hands like 107 and 67 into that range just wouldnt have been realistic.

Quote

06-05-2021 , 09:30 PM

#22

FutureInsights

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 4,509

Quote:

Originally Posted by SharkytheFish

This is a fold pre for me. Turn shove is pretty bad given the action post. What worse hands in villains range did you think were calling the turn shove?

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguyhere

Standard 3bet

Yeah, standard for me as well, too bad I never get it (in 100k hands, this is sad).

Why do we 3bet pre? One of the best draw hands out there, to fold common button steals, we get to act first, aggressively.

Haven't read the rest of thread, and haven't seen the solves. As raiser, we should be betting, I like to remember BUs 3bet call range here as well. Some Ax, and TT-55, along with our fave, JTs.

As played, we played too passively. So not aggro enough. Why did we check? If we are x flop, then we x/r here. But I would do a 1/2 pot cbet, see where we are.

Quote

06-05-2021 , 09:39 PM

#23

FutureInsights

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 4,509

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguyhere

Maybe not, although I don't think population is 4betting JJ at 100%

But even if no overpairs, villain can still have all the better TPs

They do on our site. They also love to shove. I will 4bet to normal 4bet size vs SB (24/25bb).

Quote

06-05-2021 , 09:45 PM

#24

Ramius

veteran

Join Date: Jan 2021 Posts: 2,148

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguyhere

Maybe not, although I don't think population is 4betting JJ at 100%

But even if no overpairs, villain can still have all the better TPs

More good tens than solver think he have, solver would 4bet bluff some offsuit better tens and proapbly fold a bit more than nl5 villain, but i could be wrong, no idea how todays nl5 looks like

Quote

06-06-2021 , 05:25 AM

#25

Swedishmonkey

old hand

Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 1,713

Fine as played. Would just cbet myself.

Obv we cannot call turn since SPR otr is so little. SO not loving it but always going with my hand here. So I like the x/jam.

if villain would have bet turn for a smaller sizing I like x/c more.

Quote

Page 1 of 2

First

1 2

Last

Post Reply Subscribe

...

Page 1 of 2

First

1 2

Last