Ranges facing min 5bets. - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

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Ranges facing min 5bets.

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08-20-2018 , 10:40 AM

KGAA

centurion

Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 173

Dear all,

Sometimes in late position we get into clickback wars. For the usual betsizing model,

3x-9x-22x

it's common to see a 5b shove over the top here for 100BB

I feel fairly comfortable with my ranges vs a 5b shove, depending on my position and villain type.

However, fishier villains often go for a 5b sizing like 44BB in these spots.
This can mean different things depending on the player ("I only ever have AA" or "I have garbage and want you to fold whilst I lose the least if called")

Vs unknown players who we don't have reads on, what should our default ragnes be when faced with this 5b?

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08-20-2018 , 11:37 AM

Rikk

veteran

Join Date: Oct 2016 Posts: 2,140

I don't think it changes too much as our ranges will react similarly to either sizing due to the flop SPR. Maybe this changes however if we're 4betting some SC type hands like KQs, whose equity swings greatly after seeing a flop; or if we usually 4b/fold AK in the given positions (though I can't see this applying as we would probably need to be 4b/folding AK in position for the small sizing to be attractive enough to see a flop).

It definitely gets interesting and changes ranges, however, as stacks get deeper and villains click it back as implied odds become a bigger factor.

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08-20-2018 , 10:51 PM

YouAreAwesome

journeyman

Join Date: Aug 2017 Posts: 345

I used to do this as a noob. My strategy was to min5bet with my entire 5bet range (KK+,AK) believing that villains will only shove on me if they have AA because the min5bet looks so strong. So I would fold everything except AA when they shove. It actually worked really well at 10NL and below about 10 years ago. Not sure if it would work these days, but villain may have a similar strategy.

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08-21-2018 , 04:07 AM

Rikk

veteran

Join Date: Oct 2016 Posts: 2,140

Quote:

Originally Posted by YouAreAwesome

Just out of curiosity, how did you know it worked really well if you folded everything except AA? lol

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08-21-2018 , 04:43 AM

YouAreAwesome

journeyman

Join Date: Aug 2017 Posts: 345

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rikk

Just out of curiosity, how did you know it worked really well if you folded everything except AA? lol

I crushed 12bb/100 at 10NL playing like a donkey

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08-21-2018 , 04:55 AM

Rikk

veteran

Join Date: Oct 2016 Posts: 2,140

Quote:

Originally Posted by YouAreAwesome

I crushed 12bb/100 at 10NL playing like a donkey

I don't doubt it, but that doesn't mean that particular tactic worked!

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

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08-21-2018 , 08:41 AM

ULTRACURRY

centurion

Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 179

Against unknow players you must play the GTO, so, you will be talking about adapting your range for the pot odds directly, and, of course, if they are fish, you will not want to have many bluffs in that range.

But on a mini 5bet 100bbs deep, I would only defend AKs, KK (KK I can shove some times)
And always shove AA..

So, I have, lets say 4 combos os AK that always calls, 2 combos of KK that can call, and 8 combos that will always shove..

If the villain is certanly fish, I will call with AKo..

Remmenber this is a mini 5bet spot, almost no one in NL2-nl25 will have enough hands from you to exploit this range, like.. never..

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08-21-2018 , 05:11 PM

YouAreAwesome

journeyman

Join Date: Aug 2017 Posts: 345

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rikk

I don't doubt it, but that doesn't mean that particular tactic worked!

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

I noticed most people were only min5betting with AA so people started overfolding (maybe they still do) and against me were only shoving KK+ to the min5bet. So if I had AK their continuing range halved, plus if I had KK their range consisted of 6/7 combos of AA. So folding AK/KK to the shove was +ev if KK+ were the only hands I came up against allin.

It might still be a +ev strategy against weak players actually (clearly not the best but easy to play for beginners).

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