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NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn? NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn?

04-20-2019 , 05:32 AM
[converted_hand][hand_history]Poker Stars, $0.02/$0.05 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

SB: $4.25 (85 bb)
BB: $4.15 (83 bb)
UTG: $10.97 (219.4 bb)
MP: $6.17 (123.4 bb)
Hero (CO): $6.24 (124.8 bb)
BTN: $5 (100 bb)

Preflop: Hero is CO with 9 8
UTG raises to $0.11, MP folds, Hero raises to $0.37, 3 folds, UTG calls $0.26

Flop: ($0.81) T 7 6 (2 players)
UTG bets $0.39, Hero raises to $1.42, UTG calls $1.03

Turn: ($3.65) 9 (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $4.45 and is all-in, UTG calls $4.45


Villain is unknown rec (1 table). Guys might be i'm paranoid already but i've lost for last 2 weeks around 15bi on spots like this. Did i overplay my hand? Or it's just a bad run? When he donks i assumed that he had flush, set, gs with diamonds, OPs with diamond and i decided to raise him. OTT i don't know what is the best play, i decided to jam because i was thinking he will call me with sets, OP with FD, and AdKx.
NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn? Quote
04-20-2019 , 06:13 AM
It's tricky because your crushing a tonne of hands but when you jam that turn it really restricts his calling range to flushes due to the four straight. He may call with sets but he will probably fold them at a decent rate. Just because he's a rec doesn't mean he will call these hands. Unless you have a read that he stacks off light you may be overplaying this a bit. It's fairly hard to be beat here considering he played it very strangely. Another issue is that his pre-flop calling range will mainly consist of suited hands if we assume he 4 bets all his AKo.

Your basically hoping he calls off with AQo with fd but this is kinda assumptive on this turn and it really feels like when you get called here your drawing dead. I do think it's pretty standard to jam here against a fish though, if he has a flush then so be it but against a fish specifically you can get it in pretty good. One thing to remember is that he won't ever consider you having an 8 here because of the preflop action and he therefore will probably end up calling much wider. This is pretty important and definitely would make me want to jam and try and rep AKo with a diamond. If you lost this hand then it's pretty unlucky, think you are okay with this play, wouldn't overthink it.

One more thing, if you keep losing hands like this it would appear that you are getting into too many marginal spots postflop by consistently 3-betting these hands preflop and maybe not giving recreational credit for having any value hands. If this situation keeps coming up for you then you may want to reassess your strategy preflop.
NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn? Quote
04-20-2019 , 06:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 291
It's tricky because your crushing a tonne of hands but when you jam that turn it really restricts his calling range to flushes due to the four straight. He may call with sets but he will probably fold them at a decent rate. Just because he's a rec doesn't mean he will call these hands. Unless you have a read that he stacks off light you may be overplaying this a bit. It's fairly hard to be beat here considering he played it very strangely. Another issue is that his pre-flop calling range will mainly consist of suited hands if we assume he 4 bets all his AKo.

Your basically hoping he calls off with AQo with fd but this is kinda assumptive on this turn and it really feels like when you get called here your drawing dead. I do think it's pretty standard to jam here against a fish though, if he has a flush then so be it but against a fish specifically you can get it in pretty good. One thing to remember is that he won't ever consider you having an 8 here because of the preflop action and he therefore will probably end up calling much wider. This is pretty important and definitely would make me want to jam and try and rep AKo with a diamond. If you lost this hand then it's pretty unlucky, think you are okay with this play, wouldn't overthink it.

One more thing, if you keep losing hands like this it would appear that you are getting into too many marginal spots postflop by consistently 3-betting these hands preflop and maybe not giving recreational credit for having any value hands. If this situation keeps coming up for you then you may want to reassess your strategy preflop.
Thanks for feedback! I won't 3bet this combo 100%, I'll 3bet it with some frequency by randomizer. My 3bet CO vs EPs is quite narrow ~ 4.2%. I don't know should i 3bet hands like this vs unkown fishes or i just need to 3bet best 3-5% of hands vs them.
NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn? Quote
04-20-2019 , 07:20 AM
It's fine to 3 bet these hands occasionally just so you can have some board coverage on these kinds of flops, this will protect your overpairs post-flop versus aggressive regs. I much prefer using these hands versus a limp from a fish to iso them, especially when I have specific reads on them (e.g. overfolds to cbets/always 3 bets nutted Ax hands and we can bluff them on Ax flops etc.)

Another thing is I wouldn't really choose this hand to 3-bet versus an UTG range, you really want to be 3-bet bluffing hands with blockers (suited Aces, AJo) because you block his value range. It's really easy to ignore the fact that the fish is UTG and just focus on the fact he is a fish, but if we disregard this we can really get into some trouble, fun players can have strong hands too and position matters a lot. If it's a really bad fish I would actually start to widen my 3 bet value range to include hands like 99+ and KQs+, if he's not folding to 3 bets and is playing too many hands you will be putting in more money with a range advantage in position and can really outplay them.

Your 3 betting frequencies should extremely player dependant, if they fold a lot then incorporate more bluffs, if they call too much then widen the value range. You should always be looking to change these frequencies for each player on your table, it you do it well it can make a big difference. One thing to note, the effectiveness of changing your frequencies like this is somewhat dependent on your post-flop skill level. You can get into some slightly marginal spots where you are unsure what to do, therefore it really matters you start getting some reads on the players at the table (bet sizing, what hands they are showing up with & where) to help you postflop.

Forget the randomiser, use these nuances ^^^^ to decide on what is the right frequency.
NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn? Quote
04-20-2019 , 06:19 PM
Are you a pro 5NLz player? What's the difference between you and a rec 5NLz player? You mean some sort of fish?

Accurate and informative labels over political correctness please.
NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn? Quote
04-20-2019 , 06:47 PM
Let him use whatever labels he wants the information was accurate, don't bother commenting if your not going to try and help.

Tragic...
NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn? Quote
04-21-2019 , 12:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WorldzMine
Are you a pro 5NLz player? What's the difference between you and a rec 5NLz player? You mean some sort of fish?

Accurate and informative labels over political correctness please.

Lol - typical comment of a person without friends ! Such an ridicolous comment! Are you 12 years old or just not very clever?
NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn? Quote
04-21-2019 , 12:18 PM
I dont mind the 3bet here to isolate the fish in postion and get to play the pot heads up. I dont think you could have played the hand any other way in this scenario tbh. There is tons of hands he could be floating the flop with thatll fold the turn or hands that you beat that he can call with that we beat. As for the other pots that you lost recently, are you talking about 3bet hu pots or just 3 to a flush flops where you have a straight in general?
NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn? Quote
04-21-2019 , 03:13 PM
Not a fan of 3b pre vs. UTG, dont care if it's a fish or not. We aren't trying to balance our 3b ranges at 5z.

Flop is standard, anything else is criminal.
Turn is kinda interesting due to the SPR. If V has a set he's very unlikely to fold to the shove. However, a fishy fish can also have hands that will be tempted to call a 50-60% bet, like AdJ/Q/K, JJ, JTs.

You played it well except for pre imo.
NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn? Quote
04-21-2019 , 05:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wacker1913
Lol - typical comment of a person without friends ! Such an ridicolous comment! Are you 12 years old or just not very clever?
wat
NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn? Quote
04-21-2019 , 05:34 PM
Low frequency 3bet is fine, we don't need a flatting range pre.
NL5z Straight from flop on monotone board vs rec player, how to play turn? Quote

      
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