Hey guys , I've tried my 3rd shot on NL5 , and this huge loss happened . I get many big losing sessions , and my winning one's aren't that big. ( Haven't achieved over $20 yet) . What are the common problems you faced with a graph like this . My redline is negative. Do I call down many hands I shouldn't instead of bluffing more? Do I miss value ? If so , where. I know I got many leaks , so where should I focus to fix them? What books / videos do you recommend?

(Is NL5 still beatable? With that rake , you have to play extremely well in order to get a minor winrate.)

Thanks

I feel like most players' red lines are going to be negative. At lower stakes you generally play fishier players, and so your money comes from value betting, scaling back your triple-barrel bluffs, and overfolding in spots where people play back with aggression. A friend of mine who's 10BB/100 at 25NL has a slowly decreasing red line. I'm like 8BB/100 at 5NL and have a slowly decreasing red line. I think a lot of winning micros players are gonna fall into this category.

What are your stats by position?

These are my positional stats



Wow. 8BB/100 is really great. I always play my A game , but somehow end up losing really big and winning small

Preflop stats looks decent. I'd open up more from BTN/SB and defend your BB more. Best way to do this is by taking some time to make some proper ranges. You should defend more to 3Bs especially on the button, but if you don't feel comfortable postflop overfolding is fine for now.

Redline being negative is perfectly fine and very common, at 20NL my red line was no where near positive but still 12bb/100 wr. It's probably your postflop game that's letting you down. To improve postflop you might wanna try join a study group or do some sweats.

In general though, most 5NL leaks will be not value betting thin enough, slowplaying too many hands, not floating enough (too fit/fold), not being aggressive enough especially in blinds (x/r), not barrelling enough turns or bluff catching in bad spots. Go have a look at these on 2p2 or google them etc.

Yeah I also check back some overpairs on turn and losing value , as I'm afraid people will check raise which they do more than often. Also raising sizes are probably another leak. Overall I'm not even a break-even player. -9bb/100 on that sample means I do major mistakes.

You mean read every thread about NL5?

I would never be afraid to value bet because of being x/r, 5NL it happens so rarely and is so often value heavy we can overfold our range tons. Oh yeah also you should overfold tons vs aggression since players don't bluff enough.

Well I recommend taking some time each day to browse this forum, give your suggestions or post your hands and get peoples feedback. I was at 2NL when I first joined like 7 months ago, pretty sure one of my first posts was me doing some stupid 3x pot jam on a paired board with a nut flush lol, anythings possible haha Quickly learnt better, esp since it can be savage at times on here

Alright, I'll be active on the forum.Thanks ! Want to hear some other opinions as well. But overall the stake got way too tough and competitive compared to nl2. Thought I knew enough for a +EV gameplay, but I'm way behind and didn't know where to focus.

Defo beatable and not many are going to do it with +redlines

Open tighter Ep and Mp and Wider on the BTN.

Is this zoom or reg tables?

Read all the Memorable Strategy Threads stickys if you haven't already

Yeah it's 6max zoom

To be honest, you say you 'always play your A-game', but do you really? The thing that jumped out at me was the enormous losing sessions you've had. I really think the best thing I've ever done was tidying up lots of little problems with my whole approach to playing. I don't check results more than once a week, I don't worry about trying to win sessions as big as losing ones, I don't play more than 50 minutes without a break. I dropped down to three tables. My guess is that you absolutely are not playing even your B-game all the time, if you're playing 3.5 hours and losing ten buy ins. Study more and play less volume. Read Tendler's book. I can be a bit 'self-help', but I can't recommend it enough.

On the technical side, I'd just say you're playing way too tight. Steal way, way more, don't bluff fish, and don't expect to have a positive red line. Your should be closer to 28/22.

EDIT - just to add, I used to think my mental game was solid, but looking back now it was relatively terrible. None of this is to say I'm not great, but I think most people can improve the mental side of things, without realizing the need to do so. Maybe even just drop down to 2NL, and be satisfied when you learn something new and make better decisions in paritucular spots, rather than basing everything on how many buy ins you won or lost.

I don't actually know if it's the mental game that holds me back or my gameplay. In the 3 hour session I was down the entire 1.5 hour like 5 buy ins. Even calling it a night there would let me lose the next sessions. I'll try studying the hands guys post in 2+2 and play when I feel more confident. Is mental game book actually that good in reducing tilt ?

Yes, completely. It's really, really helpful. It will probably make you realise you're tilting all the time, without realising it. For instance, if one session affects how you play the next, that's a form of tilt. If you link your confidence to money, not decisions made, that's another weakness. And then you have to realise that poor decisions are absolutely inevitable, but can be corrected through hard work. So it also made me wake up and realise studying the game properly is crucial. I also always recommend the Grinder's Manual by Pete Clarke.

Sorry if it sounds like I'm plugging these books! But just more than anything else I think I used think things like 'how am I losing when I play my A-game all the time and I post hands on 2+2?'. And now I realise my whole approach was poor.

Make PT4 filters, go over spots over and over and over again. Come up with a thought process for each one, post hands and note the advice, improve your thought process etc etc etc.

I'll shut up now anyway, cause maybe you do stuff like that. But that's my two cents anyway.

Lol, I'm the one asking which books you recommend. Read only easy game 3. People told me the theory by sklanaky and holdem for advanced players are a must read. Does this more general poker approach actually change a lot the winrate ? Probably 70% of the player pool on NL5 know more than enough and have read over 5 books or so.

Also Harrington on cash games is actually that good ? Or has more outdted stuff than what i need

I think I'm saying take a more specific approach. Hand down the Grinders Manual is the most helpful book I've read yet. That doesn't mean it's the best, but I've got Holdem for Advanced Players and I just don't think it's too relevant to 5nl. Same for Sklansky.

You are playing 1000 hands per hour, try one tabling (yes seriously) and thinking about each card more.

For sure play fewer tables. Personally, I play two tables of 16NLz and seem to be a winning player there. But if I go and play 5nlz with 4 tables up I make tons of small mistakesand become a losing player. Those mistakes pile up insanely fast when you're playing 800+ hands per hour.

Alright , I will try 2 tabling then

+1

4 or 8 tables is for players that have a certain game beat, hands down.

As others have suggested, you have to get your confidence level from your decisions, not your results. Good/better decisions will bring long term results. But you have to be able to see and remember your decisions to learn and get better.

Personally, my goal is to always be learning, so I stay with 2 tables in a stake that I have not mastered. My BB/100 suffers a little but I can always go down in stakes if I want to just grind and not focus.

Wtf how big is ur computer/that screen resolution...

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@OP just be more value-heavy in a lot spots villain's are calling more often takes notes as well

You're playing too passive, that redline is too steep.

I was hoping somebody would not give such a steep redline a pass. It will/should not be positive, but there is a lot of lost profit down there.

No simple fix, to be sure. But if you want to beat a game and be ready for the next rung on the ladder it should not be so steep.

Several ways to improve it, but generally it means play fewer hands and bluff more selectively, and pick off a few more bluffs.
OR, it could mean play the same hands but much more aggressively. The math works either way.

I normally play 2 types of sessions. A focus session and a volume session. Focus is just 2 tabling and the objective is to make the best decisions. Volume is 3 tables to make some money so I can move up. I play focus session 5 days a week and volume during weekends. Helps the mental game a ton. I never knew I had that many mental leaks until I cut down on tables

Have been wondering that as well


Used to play higher when the tables were a lot softer - but these days have just be playing 2nl for the Usain Bolt promo ... and even that's not been going so hot

Guess my real move up to 5nl was in 2013 - and for a while my late position stats looked quite a bit like yours (bb/100, wtsd, wsd) ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheKingCobain

These are my positional stats

Still have the training vids that helped me at the time posted in my old blog over at Poker School Online - not sure if maybe you might find these helpful as well op?


The first video's from ACoimbra, who used to play hyper-turbos - guess after he became SNE, he signed on as a member of Team Online, and then started playing beginner stakes and making vlogs?

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrustySam;

*Just* finished posting this sample hand of Andre Coimbra's in another thread, that I thought was really cool (starts @2:13):




Then went and did the opposite - sigh ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrustySam;

SAMPLE HAND: Using Player Reads to Know When to fold TPTK


Hand from Live Training - How to Check if Our Kicker is Good
(Typecasting Zoom @23:55)

Had a chance to do a weekly review to look for 'big picture' leaks, and noticed a lot of spew coming from TP 2nd best kicker. Especially in between the cut-off and blinds ...

If that's a common leak with people, here's a hand that has gotten me focusing a lot more on kickers at the table - and it's helped make me more aware of the signs that might be there to let us know where our kicker might stand in relation to the villain's?




Will see how it goes ...

Poker's sure gotten a lot tougher - still fun, but quite a challenge as well ... best of luck to you op!!

Thanks a lot guys, will keep on studying and focus on decisions instead of volume