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[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB [NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB

11-15-2018 , 06:37 PM
PokerStars Zoom, Hold'em No Limit - €0.05/€0.10 - 6 players
Hand delivered by Upswing Poker

UTG: €8.61 (86 bb)
MP: €31.44 (314 bb)
CO: €16.82 (168 bb)
BU: €11.43 (114 bb)
SB (Hero): €13.05 (131 bb)
BB: €15.62 (156 bb)

Pre-Flop: (€0.15) Hero is SB with 9 T
4 players fold, Hero raises to €0.35, BB calls €0.25

Flop: (€0.70) 8 Q 6 (2 players)
Hero bets €0.30, BB raises to €0.94, Hero calls €0.64

Turn: (€2.58) A (2 players)
Hero checks, BB bets €1.22, Hero raises to €3.65
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-15-2018 , 11:17 PM
I like showing aggression on the turn, but I would probably just lead out with a bet.
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-15-2018 , 11:21 PM
I think it's perfect.

Preflop - their range is probably wide

Flop - raising range can be a fair amount wider then usual and we want to flat other hands that want to continue.

Turn - I think they usually barrel their flop bluffs on a turn like this. Usually they have things like gut shots or some pair that raises, like 67 maybe, and also Ax type hands like AT/AJ and of course value hands. So yea, they probably bet/fold with at least enough frequency given our equity assuming he flats our turn xr rather than ships.

But even then, if my math is right, a turn shove is roughly $5 for us to call into $10, so we have the equity needed to call it off if they do shove.

One point I would make though is, do you want a turn xr range? I don't think it makes sense on this board texture, especially bvb where there is a lot of action and you may want to call with a wider range in spots like this, so flatting strong hands becomes even more important ott vs this line.

It doesn't really matter though because if has air there's nothing he can do about it and we will have other combos to call river after calling turn.
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 12:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fleetttt
But even then, if my math is right
It isn't. We have to call $8.11 to win $17.99 which means we need 31.01% equity to call. We have 29.55% equity. It's much worse counting the ~$1.25 taken out in rake:

(.2955*16.74) - (.7045*8.11)
4.95 - 5.71 = -$.76

Without rake:

(.2955*17.99) - (.7045*8.11)
5.32 - 5.71 = -$.39
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 01:00 AM
I don't know, xr bigger? I'm not folding lol

vs what range btw?
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 01:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fleetttt
vs what range btw?
Q8s. vs. all Q8 hands, we have less equity at 27.75%. I just put in a hand that would actually call a turn x/r. I didn't bother to think much about it since we're the ones drawing. Against 66/88/Q8/86s, we have 28.88% equity which is still < what I used.

Quote:
I'm not folding
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 03:58 AM
call turn
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 09:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by .isolated
Q8s. vs. all Q8 hands, we have less equity at 27.75%. I just put in a hand that would actually call a turn x/r. I didn't bother to think much about it since we're the ones drawing. Against 66/88/Q8/86s, we have 28.88% equity which is still < what I used.

Well ok, buuttt, we do have to factor in some turn FE and also the possibility they shove with something stupid, like AJ (I know you know it happens)

haha
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 12:06 PM
We don't factor in fe because we'd be facing an all-in shove to our raise. If he has AJ, we have less equity. At the end of the day, we have Ten high and his hand doesn't matter when he shoves because we're drawing.
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 12:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by .isolated
We don't factor in fe because we'd be facing an all-in shove to our raise. If he has AJ, we have less equity. At the end of the day, we have Ten high and his hand doesn't matter when he shoves because we're drawing.

Ok well let's say some Ax that doesn't block our outs. With regards to FE. I just mean he's gonna bet fold turn some % so we can factor that into the EV of xr/call.
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 01:37 PM
Are you 3.5x your entire range pre from the SB where you range is the widest?

I think turn is just a call with direct odds to do so.
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 02:02 PM
call turn and avoid a reraise
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 02:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ojune
call turn and avoid a reraise
what should we be bluff raising turn with
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 02:18 PM
Once we call turn we lose the chance to bluff river though. And even if we hit our out what do we do? X risking a x behind or random donk? Tough situation to balance anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flpmethntsdlr
Are you 3.5x your entire range pre from the SB where you range is the widest?
In PokerSnowie we trust.
I also have a completing range, still not super sure it's profitable playing nl10 given the rake though.
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 02:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by yasuo
what should we be bluff raising turn with
weaker stuff
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 03:28 PM
I sometimes 3-bet the flop while muttering "Go **** yourself" under my breath.
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 03:38 PM
Not a big fan of flop or turn.
If we’re gonna bet the flop I like a larger size here closer to 3/4 or pot. There’s a ton of hand out opponent wants to continue with here including weak pairs and gut shots that will always peel for such a good price.
As played...
Larger c/r on the turn seems more prudent. We’re representing a polarized range when we c/r and no reason so give our opponent such good odds to look us up here

(Also a larger c/r actually prices us in to call a shove whereas when we face a shove as played we have to puke fold)
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 04:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtyMcFly
I sometimes 3-bet the flop while muttering "Go **** yourself" under my breath.
Haha I can see myself doing this too
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote
11-16-2018 , 04:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtyMcFly
I sometimes 3-bet the flop while muttering "Go **** yourself" under my breath.
Is there a "Best 'Go **** Yourself' Hands" thread? Seems like it would be a thing, anyway.
[NL10z] T9s, Combo-draw Bluff BvB Quote

      
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