Hi guys.

Something's wrong with the HH so here's a replayer link: http://www.pokerhandreplays.com/view.php/id/8960576

I just joined the (zoom) pool so not many reads. I do, however, have original raiser marked as a limper. No info on overcaller.

Plan on flop was to x-shove. Reason being I do not expect small PPs to proceed vs such a big SQ (apparently wrongly), there being many draws and realistically no 2p, a small SPR and there being so many bad turns. Also, "limper guy" could have anything. When he bets 1/2 it's not that indicative of strength and I'm 90% sure I have overcaller beat on this board when he just flats.

However, my friend thinks I'm spewing and that I should just x-f flop. We both seem to agree that x-c flop to x-f turn is the worst option.

What do you think? What would be a standard line vs basically two unknowns?

Many thanks.

C/f flop dependent on action sounds terrible if it goes check , bet , call and then action is back on you. Better could be value betting worse not to mention bluffs he's going to have on this type of board. I'd just go ahead and bet flop tbh.

There will for sure be sets in both villians ranges more so the second preflop caller.

we should cbet flop

can anyone give a reasonable argument as to why we should c-bet this flop other than "we have an overpair so we must bet"?

You'll get called by top pairs, weaker over pairs, 6X, and flush draws that have less equity in the hand than you do.

x 100% on the flop seems like it almost has to be very close to equilibrium. this is just a terrible board for us and a great board for them, plus there are two of them.

I would just bet this hand as an exploit though. there are SO many turns that are bad for us - we don't even have a club - and if I'm not mistaken at these stakes people are more likely to err on the side of calling too light instead of betting too light. plus we can get value (our hand is DEF strong enough to bet flop for value), as well as narrow down their ranges and have better visibility on turns, which is really important with this SPR. there's just no reason to allow a scary turn to come and have very little idea what their ranges are, moreover on a LOT of turns you're now too deep to both effectively limit their ability to draw on you and minimize your losses vs. stronger hands. I doubt the EV diff is that large between bet and x, but I would guess that bet is marginally better.

anyway, obvious checkshove vs almost any betsize and action. folding to a bet and a call would be absolutely terrible lol

Check raising otf here is not standard. That's not to say it's wrong but I would just lead for value and to deny your opponents equity. I'd rank this flop somewhere around the middle in terms of good/bad flops for our hand. Board doesn't necessarily connect strongly with mp villain's range but there's still enough pps and draws to justify a lead. It's also the sort of flop that one of your opponents can stack off on with a worse overpair. Oop here we don't love a ace or king ott.

x/c flop and x/f turn. A whale would bet this into two callers from OOP

15/10 f***ing perfect logic!! Don't see any other way to play the hand... With reads maybe and that's a big maybe can bet fold/call tho I really don't like both lines with out soulreads