folding a set in a 4bp 25NL - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

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folding a set in a 4bp 25NL

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06-14-2021 , 04:05 PM

GTOJacob

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2020 Posts: 161

think i might get roasted for this one

Hero is in SB with J

[preflop]

BU opens to 2.4bb
SB (hero) raises to 10.8bb
BU raises to 25.2bb
SB calls

[flop, 49.1bb, 73.6bb effective]

Q

SB checks
BU checks

[turn, 49.1bb, 73.6bb effective]

J

SB checks
BU bets 32.4bb
SB calls

[river, 110.96bb, 41.24bb effective]

7

SB checks
BU shoves all-in
SB folds

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06-14-2021 , 05:56 PM

threatD

grinder

Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 581

Shove pre

Sent from my SM-G996B using Tapatalk

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06-14-2021 , 06:08 PM

DooDooPoker

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Mar 2018 Posts: 18,585

ship pre because of rake.

As played you can donk -

As played just call he can have AA/KK sometimes that he value owns himself with.

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06-14-2021 , 06:31 PM

GTOJacob

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2020 Posts: 161

Quote:

Originally Posted by DooDooPoker

ship pre because of rake.

As played you can donk -

As played just call he can have AA/KK sometimes that he value owns himself with.

Why does rake incentivise me to ship rather than call? It’s still the same % rake, right?

And donk which streets and what kinda sizings if you don’t mind saying

And yeah I guess that can happen once in a while, I still think pretty unlikely given his line, but I suppose given the price, doesn’t need to be that often for call EV To be positive

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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06-14-2021 , 06:58 PM

newguyhere

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2016 Posts: 7,164

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTOJacob

Why does rake incentivise me to ship rather than call? It’s still the same % rake, right?

Only when he calls.

I believe when you ship and he folds, you win a nice pot and pay zero rake.

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06-14-2021 , 07:33 PM

GTOJacob

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2020 Posts: 161

Quote:

Originally Posted by newguyhere

Only when he calls.

I believe when you ship and he folds, you win a nice pot and pay zero rake.

Ah yeah of course

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06-14-2021 , 07:36 PM

GTOJacob

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2020 Posts: 161

Feel so lost in these spots where most players in this pool aren't finding any 4-bet bluffs IP

Is there any point in even having a calling range and just play 5-bet or fold instead?

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06-14-2021 , 07:44 PM

DooDooPoker

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Mar 2018 Posts: 18,585

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTOJacob

Feel so lost in these spots where most players in this pool aren't finding any 4-bet bluffs IP

Is there any point in even having a calling range and just play 5-bet or fold instead?

Yeah id just not have a 4bet calling range OOP until 100nl where rake is less,

assuming 100bbs.

At deeper stacks we can start calling strong suited hands/pocket pairs like 77-JJ/AQs/AJs/KQs

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06-14-2021 , 07:45 PM

DooDooPoker

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Mar 2018 Posts: 18,585

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTOJacob

Flop can be donked since he has all AK and you have none.

Just small sizing

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06-15-2021 , 04:25 AM

#10

GTOJacob

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2020 Posts: 161

Quote:

Originally Posted by DooDooPoker

Yeah id just not have a 4bet calling range OOP until 100nl where rake is less,

assuming 100bbs.

At deeper stacks we can start calling strong suited hands/pocket pairs like 77-JJ/AQs/AJs/KQs

ah okay cool, and IP you think it's still okay to play 5bets and calls?

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06-15-2021 , 10:40 AM

#11

FutureInsights

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 4,509

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTOJacob

ah okay cool, and IP you think it's still okay to play 5bets and calls?

At deeper stacks, we should still use the same ranges as 100bb effective. We lesson our amounts of 4bets/shoves, and expand our amount of 3bet calls.

It is perfectly fine to call a 4bet, especially with AA as a disguise, in certain positions. You really need a positional hand chart, and not generalizations here. 77 from utg vs Sb is a terrible call here. No matter how deep you are.

While 77 makes a good call from HJ to BU 3bet.

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06-15-2021 , 07:18 PM

#12

Spud Gun

grinder

Join Date: Aug 2020 Posts: 567

Call river in game because we only need a few combos of AA/KK to play like this. Then wonder why the hell you paid off a nit that only ever has AK when they take this line.

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06-18-2021 , 11:06 AM

#13

dgkula

journeyman

Join Date: Feb 2019 Posts: 212

42BB to win 150BB so over 3:1 odds, you need to be good here 25% of the time so call because you probably are good >25% IMHO

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06-18-2021 , 12:02 PM

#14

GTOJacob

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2020 Posts: 161

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgkula

42BB to win 150BB so over 3:1 odds, you need to be good here 25% of the time so call because you probably are good >25% IMHO

Yeah I think you'll agree it's pretty close though

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06-18-2021 , 12:04 PM

#15

GTOJacob

centurion

Join Date: Sep 2020 Posts: 161

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgkula

42BB to win 150BB so over 3:1 odds, you need to be good here 25% of the time so call because you probably are good >25% IMHO

Maybe, definitely close tho

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