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Old 06-19-2017, 10:27 AM   #1
Fish-And-Chips
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c-betting paired boards. Texture + sizing analysis

http://www.cardrunners.com/pokertool...029937/replay/

BTN: $21.54
SB: $19.51
BB: $10.00
Hero (UTG): $28.75
MP: $10.00
CO: $29.24

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is UTG with T A
Hero raises to $0.30, 4 folds, BB calls $0.20

Flop: ($0.65) 4 K K (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.22, BB folds

Sorry about the external HH, 2+2 hasn't been working for me for weeks.

I c-bet this combo w/ the blockers + BDNFD, and because AJ high is usually going to be the best hand. But I have always struggled with what hands I should be c-betting in these spots, for what sizing.
A lot of very dry paired boards I check 100% of my range, and then wetter textures (paired boards w/ FD/straight draw on board) I have a bet, check and c/r range. Is this correct?
How are you playing this flop? if you have a betting range, what combo's are you including? How are you balancing?

Last edited by Fish-And-Chips; 06-19-2017 at 10:49 AM.
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Old 06-19-2017, 10:41 AM   #2
Rikk
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Re: c-betting paired boards. Texture + sizing analysis

I can never see your posts to reply, but in case anyone else is having the same problem you can always use:
http://www.handconverter.com/

It's even got a 2+2 output
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Old 06-19-2017, 10:49 AM   #3
Fish-And-Chips
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Re: c-betting paired boards. Texture + sizing analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rikk View Post
I can never see your posts to reply, but in case anyone else is having the same problem you can always use:
http://www.handconverter.com/

thanks a lot Rikk - I've included HH in this format in original post + reply.
It's even got a 2+2 output
BTN: $21.54
SB: $19.51
BB: $10.00
Hero (UTG): $28.75
MP: $10.00
CO: $29.24

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is UTG with T A
Hero raises to $0.30, 4 folds, BB calls $0.20

Flop: ($0.65) 4 K K (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.22, BB folds
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Old 06-19-2017, 10:53 AM   #4
Bladesman87
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Re: c-betting paired boards. Texture + sizing analysis

When thinking about paired boards I think it's important to recognise that KK4r is very different to 884r or with a flush draw. On the first board you have all the best Kx and pairs in your range that your opponent doesn't. On the latter the BB can in theory be defending a decent amount of the suited 8x combos he wouldn't flat from elsewhere, plus gutshots, and more appealing calls with smaller pairs. Just from a simplistic view, the KK4r against UTG is a spot where your opponent either has Kx/44 or is just very unhappy defending his range over multiple streets, and so we should be c-betting at a very high frequency.
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Old 06-19-2017, 02:24 PM   #5
pokerforumposter
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Re: c-betting paired boards. Texture + sizing analysis

You can fold out AJ/AQ, set mines, 4x, and many live cards. Betting therefore works well against the large majority of your standard reg range. Note they should not have too many Kx vs utg open, depending on pool. You also are in position with bdnfd. On this board I would be betting any value hand including AA, sometimes less. My tightest range for bluffs would be Axs type stuff, qjs, and I would expand based on v tendencies. I would bet half pot at the very least since I have a sizeable, strong value range here.
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Old 06-19-2017, 02:46 PM   #6
Fish-And-Chips
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Re: c-betting paired boards. Texture + sizing analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by pokerforumposter View Post
You can fold out AJ/AQ, set mines, 4x, and many live cards.
We are almost never folding out any 2-pair combo's (set-mines), including 4x with a single bet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pokerforumposter View Post
Betting therefore works well against the large majority of your standard reg range. Note they should not have too many Kx vs utg open, depending on pool. You also are in position with bdnfd. On this board I would be betting any value hand including AA, sometimes less. My tightest range for bluffs would be Axs type stuff, qjs, and I would expand based on v tendencies. I would bet half pot at the very least since I have a sizeable, strong value range here.
cheers for the input
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Old 06-19-2017, 09:19 PM   #7
pokerforumposter
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Re: c-betting paired boards. Texture + sizing analysis

You have 36% equity vs a 100% cbet on this board with 55. If you take out the bottom half of utg's air you have 25% which means you are breaking even equity wise vs half pot. Your position and playability are then taken into account for a standard fold, unless v way overcbets flop and does not continue turn. More intuitively, you are oop vs a strong range with 2 outs to improve.
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Old 06-20-2017, 06:41 AM   #8
Fish-And-Chips
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Re: c-betting paired boards. Texture + sizing analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by pokerforumposter View Post
You have 36% equity vs a 100% cbet on this board with 55. If you take out the bottom half of utg's air you have 25% which means you are breaking even equity wise vs half pot. Your position and playability are then taken into account for a standard fold, unless v way overcbets flop and does not continue turn. More intuitively, you are oop vs a strong range with 2 outs to improve.
Whilst the maths may be correct, we cannot ever assume V is playing a strategy that is mathematically sound based on my c-betting %. If that were the case, we would find it incredibly hard to profit from the pool!
Also - insinuating that our/V's continuing range should be 44 & Kx on this texture is pretty insane, and massively exploitable.

I know that the majority of the pool is continuing with all 2-pairs (22-88 & 4x - assuming V 3-bets 99+ pre) - perhaps some players fold out their 22/33 and continue with there 4x+. Once again, I am not defending the play (although there is certainly a strong argument to be made in defense), but this is the pools standard continuing range IMO.
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Old 06-20-2017, 07:29 AM   #9
Three_high
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Re: c-betting paired boards. Texture + sizing analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fish-And-Chips View Post

I know that the majority of the pool is continuing with all 2-pairs (22-88 & 4x - assuming V 3-bets 99+ pre) - perhaps some players fold out their 22/33 and continue with there 4x+. Once again, I am not defending the play (although there is certainly a strong argument to be made in defense), but this is the pools standard continuing range IMO.
I agree with your estimation of a cbet calling range in these pools. Still, that's a small portion of a BB calling range. That said, even when you don't get a fold on the flop I think that same pool is almost always folding to a 3rd barrel without the K.
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Old 06-20-2017, 10:20 AM   #10
Bladesman87
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Re: c-betting paired boards. Texture + sizing analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by pokerforumposter View Post
You have 36% equity vs a 100% cbet on this board with 55. If you take out the bottom half of utg's air you have 25% which means you are breaking even equity wise vs half pot. Your position and playability are then taken into account for a standard fold, unless v way overcbets flop and does not continue turn. More intuitively, you are oop vs a strong range with 2 outs to improve.
It's worth thinking about the way boards develop. If you take a hand like 55 that is a clear x/c for villain on the flop (against any standard c-bet sizing), how many run outs is villain happy to call down on (or just call turn)? Even take something at the top of villain's range like KTs that he likely has to call down three barrels with. How often does that feel like a comfortable bluff catch for a semi-aware reg?

It's not like villain can x/c flop with hands like 55-99 and expect the board to develop in his favour very often. 36% equity, maybe, but in terms of actually realising that equity, this board sucks hard for villain.
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