AQs 3bet pot 5nl zone - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

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AQs 3bet pot 5nl zone

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06-16-2018 , 12:41 AM

whitemares

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,762

5nl zone on ignition, ~130bb effective

Preflop: Hero is BTN with A

3 folds, Hero raises to 2bb, SB raises to 7bb, BB calls 6bb, Hero calls 5bb

Flop: (21bb) 8

(3 players)
SB bets 6bb, BB calls 6bb, Hero calls 6bb

Turn: (39bb) Q

(3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets 17bb, SB calls 17bb, BB folds

River: (73bb) 5

(2 players)
SB checks, Hero ?

Preflop, flop, and turn and pretty straightforward, but not sure if I should've sized up the turn. I think I should either be checking or bet/folding like 30-40% pot OTR

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06-16-2018 , 01:03 AM

sossinbergs

grinder

Join Date: Nov 2017 Posts: 519

I think this is a pretty clear value bet. When SB bets tiny flop and then check calls turn I think they almost always have a pretty marginal hand. J9s is a possibility, but I don't know how often that hand is 3-betting pre. We're also going to have a decent amount of bluffs on this river since most of our flush draws that called the flop would bet the turn and want to bluff this river. For this reason, I would probably go for a bit of a larger bet size, around 35-45bb and really try to put his Tx or JJ in a tough spot. I feel like this sizing gives us the most fold equity and gets us the most value. Also yes I would've bet bigger on the turn.

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06-16-2018 , 10:20 AM

Oregon Rick

adept

Join Date: Dec 2016 Posts: 770

I would bet about 1/2 pot on the river.

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06-16-2018 , 06:08 PM

coolshadow

centurion

Join Date: Jun 2018 Posts: 132

That small SB sizebet on the flop vs. 2 players with that wet flop and then the checkcall turn for me means flushdraw.

I can not see value in this line of V on the flop. I think Tx, JJ would bet bigger on the wet flop.

In case of bet river, we'll be collecting value of what?

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06-16-2018 , 08:54 PM

simplelessons

veteran

Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 3,012

Given you went small on the turn river is a pretty easy value bet. I like going bigger on the turn to get value from the draws and checking back a lot of rivers.

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06-17-2018 , 07:51 PM

whitemares

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,762

Villain is most likely range betting with that flop sizing, so I feel villain will have some KQ/QJ/AT/KTs/JTs/T9s/JJ that could call a smaller river bet

Looking back I think this is a more clear bet with my turn sizing since he’ll probably have several worse pairs that could call

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06-18-2018 , 05:18 AM

TheGodson

veteran

Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 3,070

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oregon Rick

I would bet about 1/2 pot on the river.

This is what I was thinking as well. Consider that your opponent may be calling KQ, QJs, and JJ.

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06-18-2018 , 12:57 PM

ldmariodl28

journeyman

Join Date: Sep 2017 Posts: 276

I would check back the River. Most worse hands are prob folding. Maybe you get ATs to call? Why bet and risk a raise putting yourself in a tough spot.

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06-18-2018 , 01:14 PM

whitemares

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,762

It wouldn’t be a tough spot, it’d be a pretty easy fold

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06-18-2018 , 01:24 PM

#10

ldmariodl28

journeyman

Join Date: Sep 2017 Posts: 276

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

It wouldn’t be a tough spot, it’d be a pretty easy fold

Well yea, so why put yourself in that position then? I guess if anything bet thin for value to get some worse pairs to call.

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06-18-2018 , 02:14 PM

#11

whitemares

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,762

You literally just suggested checking behind

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06-18-2018 , 02:47 PM

#12

.isolated

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 21,495

I don't understand this thread. It's summed up in the first sentence of the first reply.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sossinbergs

I think this is a pretty clear value bet.

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06-18-2018 , 02:55 PM

#13

ldmariodl28

journeyman

Join Date: Sep 2017 Posts: 276

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

You literally just suggested checking behind

Checking behind would be my default here yes, but if you want to bet for value bet thin. There is no one way to play it.

If we had player reads which of course in Zone we don’t then if you know your opp is going to showdown to often with weak holdings, then a bet makes more sense. Unfortunately we have no reads in Zone so for this game type I would check.

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06-18-2018 , 03:01 PM

#14

ldmariodl28

journeyman

Join Date: Sep 2017 Posts: 276

There is something else here which makes this hand a little tougher to analyze is what is SBs stack? That might help determine player type. It’s not a clear value bet because a X/R from villian is possible too. Maybe he was short stacked.. we don’t know. This is why I have learned to dislike Zone.. Really hard with no reads, so best to play it safe.

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06-18-2018 , 03:05 PM

#15

whitemares

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,762

Quote:

Originally Posted by .isolated

I don't understand this thread. It's summed up in the first sentence of the first reply.

I’m new to both ignition and zoom, and river play is by far the weakest part of my game

Any input as to sizing?

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06-18-2018 , 03:06 PM

#16

whitemares

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,762

Quote:

Originally Posted by ldmariodl28

Effective stack size is in the OP

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06-18-2018 , 03:10 PM

#17

ldmariodl28

journeyman

Join Date: Sep 2017 Posts: 276

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

Effective stack size is in the OP

Ok sorry thought what was Eff Stack of Hero

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06-18-2018 , 03:12 PM

#18

ldmariodl28

journeyman

Join Date: Sep 2017 Posts: 276

Btw off topic another thing I would consider here is throwing out a 4 bet Pre. You could take it down now, and or get rid of BB as well to play heads up.

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06-18-2018 , 03:16 PM

#19

.isolated

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 21,495

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

Any input as to sizing?

I'd bet big. I'd be tempted to shove. At $5nl on Ignition, if you're beaten here, you're facing a x/r ott. We're good here >95% and these people call too much so we should bet big. 30-40% may guarantee a call from a ten but does it get the most value over the long run? I don't think so.

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06-19-2018 , 03:27 PM

#20

AlanBostick

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 11,488

Quote:

Originally Posted by ldmariodl28

Btw off topic another thing I would consider here is throwing out a 4 bet Pre. You could take it down now, and or get rid of BB as well to play heads up.

These are unknowns on ignition. I don't think we want to polarize our raising range here.

And even if we did, we would be better off four-bet-bluffing with a hand like A4s. Maaaybe AQo, but I doubt it. AQs is very definitely in our calling range, so do not 4-bet.

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