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50NL river spot 50NL river spot

06-19-2021 , 09:59 PM
I don't think we want/need to float flop with no club. We have plenty of stuff that wants to continue

AP, not calling river as this is probably pretty merged
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06-20-2021 , 12:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FutureInsights
Range betting is a mistake for every flop. Node locked for range bet in a 3bet called pot in gto+. About all of my range became a raise (also, every hand a check to raiser). KTs with Axx on flop became a raise. I didn't realize at time, hand was range bet.



Folks are learning this. In my population, there are less range bets now. cbetting 100% is a mistake, and big leak.



My site gets all villain hole cards, including hands I have no involvement with. This makes for juicy reports, or can glide though about 200 of 1300+ hand session, and get feel for population, with the cards they do it with.
Range betting will never be the highest ev approach, but that's clearly not why people implement it.

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06-20-2021 , 05:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FutureInsights
Range betting is a mistake for every flop.
Um how can you even know this


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06-20-2021 , 05:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTOJacob
Um how can you even know this


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Not sure if this is what they were talking about, but I know there aren't as many flops that a solver will range bet as I thought there'd be when I first heard about the strategy.

At least not without doing any node-locking.

Of course, that doesn't mean we should never range bet.
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06-20-2021 , 05:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by newguyhere
Not sure if this is what they were talking about, but I know there aren't as many flops that a solver will range bet as I thought there'd be when I first heard about the strategy.

At least not without doing any node-locking.

Of course, that doesn't mean we should never range bet.

Yeah obviously you can’t range bet every single flop

But to say range bet is always a mistake is just not true and would be impossible to know even if it was true


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06-20-2021 , 04:46 PM
Solver range bets many, many flops IP with 30% sizing. Sure it will be mixed, not pure, and suits will play a role but I dont think it is accurate to say that "Range betting is a mistake for every flop." How about opening the CO to 3BB with ATC and BB calls. Flop comes AK3 rainbow. Massively favors our range and misses BB at very high freq. Range bet 1/3 pot with ATC 100% IMHO.
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06-20-2021 , 10:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by newguyhere
Not sure if this is what they were talking about, but I know there aren't as many flops that a solver will range bet as I thought there'd be when I first heard about the strategy.

At least not without doing any node-locking.

Of course, that doesn't mean we should never range bet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTOJacob
Yeah obviously you can’t range bet every single flop

But to say range bet is always a mistake is just not true and would be impossible to know even if it was true


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You misread, or I did not explain correctly. 100% cbet is a leak, though I see it in our population all the time (except 50nl and up).

There are certain flops to range bet, for the raiser. Certain flops favor the caller. When you learn those flops, you can check call or check raise.

Solver also advocates donking, so you need to adjust the solve if you don't want to ever donk.

I MEANT to say always range betting is a mistake. If you do, there are lines one can take, which will print money.

Basic rules to begin with:

K J and/or T on flop good for raiser, Q good for caller, A in between.

One high card, more polar for raiser: less raising, less calling, more folding.

No high cards, range is less polar, more raising.

2 high cards, range more merged, more calling and raising.

You study these flops in solver, then run multiple locked and unlocked iterations to come up with strategy, best done with PIO or GTO+.

That is how it is known.
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06-21-2021 , 04:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTOJacob
Yeah definitely an easy spot to overcall, you not calling at any frequency though?
I think it's a spot where people often skew their ranges. People who bet their pairs on the turn are going to have a lot of junk on the river. Equally players who check their 77/TT on the turn are going to show you that at a very high freq. It's a spot where I'd look to pop reads. I don't hate calling but I'd take a note on what gets shown and hate myself when it's 99.
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06-21-2021 , 05:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FutureInsights
You misread, or I did not explain correctly. 100% cbet is a leak, though I see it in our population all the time (except 50nl and up).

There are certain flops to range bet, for the raiser. Certain flops favor the caller. When you learn those flops, you can check call or check raise.

Solver also advocates donking, so you need to adjust the solve if you don't want to ever donk.

I MEANT to say always range betting is a mistake. If you do, there are lines one can take, which will print money.

Basic rules to begin with:

K J and/or T on flop good for raiser, Q good for caller, A in between.

One high card, more polar for raiser: less raising, less calling, more folding.

No high cards, range is less polar, more raising.

2 high cards, range more merged, more calling and raising.

You study these flops in solver, then run multiple locked and unlocked iterations to come up with strategy, best done with PIO or GTO+.

That is how it is known.

Yeah I misunderstood, playing a 100% cbet strat on every flop is definitely a mistake haha


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06-21-2021 , 08:12 AM
Agree with the clarification. 100% cbet IP is definitely a leak even with small sizing.
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