Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board 10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board

05-20-2018 , 08:18 PM
I have no history with the villain.

Winning Poker Network (Yatahay) - $0.10 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (SB): 111.7 BB
BB: 100 BB (VPIP: 20.00, PFR: 20.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 5)
UTG: 133.3 BB (VPIP: 25.00, PFR: 19.53, 3Bet Preflop: 9.28, Hands: 264)
CO: 151.3 BB (VPIP: 25.82, PFR: 18.78, 3Bet Preflop: 12.36, Hands: 222)
BTN: 89.5 BB (VPIP: 28.25, PFR: 22.03, 3Bet Preflop: 13.04, Hands: 182)

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has K A

fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, BB calls 2 BB

Flop: (6 BB, 2 players) A K T

How to proceed? Lead out with something like 3/4 pot size? How should we respond to a raise?
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-20-2018 , 08:41 PM
bet/call down most runouts
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-21-2018 , 08:12 AM
We crush this board so I would check and let him put money in with a wide range.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-21-2018 , 10:04 AM
I would bet and consider jamming over a raise. We are getting stacked by JQ either way save a J or Q on turn or river. I wouldn't expect to get raised very often on this flop though.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-21-2018 , 10:06 AM
Bet small. You don't want to just get called by qj and sets.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-21-2018 , 10:18 AM
I would go bigger with top 2, we should get floats from all Ax and Kx and TQ and TJ from these positions etc. Smaller with top pair which we have all Ax I am guessing which is plenty to balance lots of small bets with air on this flop
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-21-2018 , 10:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomj
I would go bigger with top 2, we should get floats from all Ax and Kx and TQ and TJ from these positions etc. Smaller with top pair which we have all Ax I am guessing which is plenty to balance lots of small bets with air on this flop
If you only go big with big value its not very balanced.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-21-2018 , 10:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by simplelessons
If you only go big with big value its not very balanced.
Small bet range could include maybe AQ and AJ which can stand raises, and block the straights (?)

AT and KT perhaps
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-21-2018 , 07:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomj
Small bet range could include maybe AQ and AJ which can stand raises, and block the straights (?)

AT and KT perhaps
So you are only betting big with 2p?
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-22-2018 , 01:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomj
I would bet and consider jamming over a raise. We are getting stacked by JQ either way save a J or Q on turn or river. I wouldn't expect to get raised very often on this flop though.
Hard to imagine the villain raising the flop with anything except QJ for value. The BB is not likely to be flatting AA/KK/TT/AK preflop whereas we can have literally every combo of 2pair+ on this board. I think 3-betting the flop is bad, though... We lose the maximum when behind and win the minimum from the villain's bluffs.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-22-2018 , 10:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by simplelessons
So you are only betting big with 2p?
Nut straights and sets can be bet big as well. My thought was that our bet small range can still have strong hands in it that are worse than AK so we don't have to protect the bet small range with a hand as strong as this.
Basically I'm trying to justify always betting big with AK on a AKT board bvb where villain has plenty TJ, TQ, KT, QT etc. Betting small just isn't computing for me
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-22-2018 , 11:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomj
Nut straights and sets can be bet big as well. My thought was that our bet small range can still have strong hands in it that are worse than AK so we don't have to protect the bet small range with a hand as strong as this.
Basically I'm trying to justify always betting big with AK on a AKT board bvb where villain has plenty TJ, TQ, KT, QT etc. Betting small just isn't computing for me
Let me rephrase my question. Are you only betting big with 2p+? Are you going to bet big with JT and KQ? 89dd? I don't see how we can split our range across this board without some part of our range either being face up weak or face up strong. That's what I was asking, how do you split your range if you used mixed sizing?
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-22-2018 , 04:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by simplelessons
Let me rephrase my question. Are you only betting big with 2p+? Are you going to bet big with JT and KQ? 89dd? I don't see how we can split our range across this board without some part of our range either being face up weak or face up strong. That's what I was asking, how do you split your range if you used mixed sizing?
Right, yes I get you. I don't know basically, because I don't know where to begin with balancing mixed sizings, I am a beginner with balancing in general.

SB open is

22+,A2s+,K2s+,Q4s+,J6s+,T6s+,95s+,84s+,74s+,64s+,5 4s,43s,32s,A2o+,K8o+,Q8o+,J8o+,T8o+,98o

top pair or better is

KK+,TT,A2s+,KTs,QJs,A2o+,KTo,QJo

which is 1/3 of SB open range.

I want to mostly bet big with (notice there are some strong hands missing so our bet small range isn't weak)

KK+,TT,AKs,QJs,AKo,QJo

This is 6.6% of flop range, so we could have around 12% of 3/4 or pot size bluffs? Which could be all the non paired Jx and Qx hands

Q9s-Q8s,J9s-J8s,Q9o-Q8o,J9o-J8o

which is 12.4% of flop range.

?????????
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-22-2018 , 04:58 PM
I am not saying that this is actually the right way to go, but since I am a bear of very little brain I find it makes life simpler to do this:

Let the size of my bet be guided by position, stack sizes, and flop texture, and ignoring what my holding is.

Really, really dry flops call for small bets. Really juicy ones that offer lots of draws call for bigger ones.

I try (such as I am able to do so on the fly) to balance my value bets with bluffs or semibluffs, but if I am betting, I am betting what the flop tells me. I don't want my bet size to be an information leak.

Separately balancing ranges for various bet sizes is too complicated for my tiny brain.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-23-2018 , 04:56 AM
While checking and letting opponent bet seems very tempting because of our tp blocker, most opponents will be calling super wide preflop in this spot.

Which means once you check you are saying I have atleast 2nd pair or maybe a trap here, so opponent will just give up with say 96 or something.

With this little information, the optimal line (in my opinion) is to bet and call down a raise depending on run outs.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-23-2018 , 10:03 AM
I'm definitely betting something, never checking. I am unsure how inelastic Vs calling ranges are in spots like this. Still figuring it out. If they call 3/4 with the same range they're calling 1/3 to 1/2, it's a mistake to bet smaller.

I don't think QJ raises bvb, FWIW. At least I wouldn't.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-23-2018 , 02:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by simplelessons
I don't see how we can split our range across this board without some part of our range either being face up weak or face up strong. That's what I was asking, how do you split your range if you used mixed sizing?
Splitting your range is always going to yield higher ev if done properly but since we're not bots I don't think we should split on the flop (at least I don't). But yea in theory there is nothing wrong with betting big with mostly 2pairs+/bluffs and small with mostly weaker stuff+bluffs. The deeper the stacks the more you have to add strong hands into the smallbet range.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-23-2018 , 03:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlanBostick
I am not saying that this is actually the right way to go, but since I am a bear of very little brain I find it makes life simpler to do this:

Let the size of my bet be guided by position, stack sizes, and flop texture, and ignoring what my holding is.

Really, really dry flops call for small bets. Really juicy ones that offer lots of draws call for bigger ones.

I try (such as I am able to do so on the fly) to balance my value bets with bluffs or semibluffs, but if I am betting, I am betting what the flop tells me. I don't want my bet size to be an information leak.

Separately balancing ranges for various bet sizes is too complicated for my tiny brain.
The best bots out there use all kinds of mixed strategies and varying bet sizes. This is going to be optimal play. We don't function as well when trying to do this. The very best players in the world can probably have multiple bet sizes and be capable of keeping everything balanced and remembering what goes where and at what frequency.

I think it's fine to have one bet size and vary it based on the factors you listed and strive to keep it balanced and played optimally. If you do this and do it well you will have no problem beating most stakes, especially here in the micros.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-23-2018 , 03:38 PM
If we don't split our range are we sizing up at 100bb stack depth or going small? I want to bet my whole range on this flop given how few strong combos BB actually has. My default would be to go 1/3 with our whole range and then size up our values hands on the turn and give up with with around 1/2 our range.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-24-2018 , 04:07 AM
With only 5 hands don't assume bb'S playstyle. He can have AJ or TT here being unknown.

I think you have to have some checks on this board. You can definitely check a hand like A3 and 67s without bdfd.can balance those type of hands with qj and maybe kk type of habds i.e. you don't block the value part of ur opponents betting range.

And this board is pretty dynamic. Can bet like 2/3 to 3/4 pot depending on game flow.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-26-2018 , 01:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlanBostick
Really, really dry flops call for small bets. Really juicy ones that offer lots of draws call for bigger ones.
This is an age old tried and true strat.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-26-2018 , 06:38 AM
why is it correct to bet small on dry flops?
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-26-2018 , 06:49 AM
It's difficult to have strong hands on flops like Q72, K83, K22, KK4, etc. Betting small will likely win the pot otf most of the time.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-26-2018 , 06:56 AM
It's not that. nothing prevents villain from calling wide with bd draws, Ahigh, etc
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote
05-26-2018 , 11:50 AM
By betting small with our entire range on dry board we put bottom end of villian's showdown range in a very tough spot... It's not fun to call A6 on Q72.. the top end is calling no matter what.
10NL Blind Battle: AK Flops Top Two on Broadway Board Quote

      
m