OK those Youtube videos are incredibly terrible. How can you have the conversation right in front of the person? The game is then "Who does Lodden want to win?"

I think it's a given that a.) the person they're asking won't angleshoot, and b.) his answer should be "locked in" before they set the line.

How old are you and where were you?

Colombo, I'd just keep tappin and worry about it later.

Karak, that actually sounds like a pretty good strategy for a quieter bar where there is less of an excuse to engage a group of strangers. I think I'll dumb it down a bit and try it sometime if I remember.

tbe, I was at the store today and tried your line. Except I was alone, so I was just sayin it to myself. Got lots of really strange looks, mostly. No 28 yo Kiwis were brought home :/

But really, good TR.

I went to this party on a private beach yesterday with some friends, and there were like 3 or 4 chicks just topless. Obviously this was awesome for viewing purposes, but not very functional. How do you approach a topless chick? I feel like it's sooo transparent, as if a guy's motivations aren't already transparent enough when approaching a fit woman.

wtf i havent seen a girls boobs outside of having sex since the summer of 2008, mbn

Neg her body ldo.

Slightly more serious answer: probably just try extra hard not to look at her tits.

take your shorts off.

Bleh, so I texted her about this yesterday, she responded "sounds great but I might need to pack & finish up some work on Monday before I leave town on Tuesday, I'll see what I can get done the rest of the weekend and let you know". She just got back to me on that and texted me saying "Hey, I could probably do a quick dinner tomorrow, either earlier in SF or later in Oakland, otherwise will need to take a raincheck". Sounds like I'm not getting laid.

Kinda a tough spot actually, even though I'd suggested cooking together her response above seems to imply going out somewhere, which is GUARANTEED to be PG-rated action limited to making out in car or w/e. Cooking together in my apt, even if quick, could still result in PG-13, maybe even R-rated action. However, asking her for clarification basically locks me in to doing either one since I can't be like "oh so let's cook something quick at my place! oh you wanted to go out? **** I'm busy all of a sudden..."

WHAT'S MY LINE?!?!

gb I think this is pretty easy. She's fitting you into her busy schedule, giving you a chance to have a "quick" dinner with her. I say you reschedule for another time. The way she framed it makes it seem like she's not so into the idea. Add to the fact that it would likely not be at your place anyway, just cancel it. That way you maintain some efficacy in the relationship. Y don't want her thinking she can direct everything and you'll follow along.

Hrm, you think? She's def into cooking, I guess she might not want to do something so private or w/e this early on but I'd think she'd be into the idea. Also, I def got the impression she wants to see me again, convo when we said goodbye was like this:

me: "So you're leaving on Tuesday?"
her: "Yeah...want to do something Monday night?"
me: "Sure, that sounds good"
her: "Okay, you might have to leave work at a reasonable hour though "
me: "Haha, I dunno, I only do that for special occasions..."
her: "Well am I a special occasion? "
me: "We'll see about that "

*smoochsmoochsmooch*


btw, latest ******ation on POF: if you guys recall when I mentioned how they force you to display what you're looking for ("no relationship or commitment of any kind", "dating but nothing serious", "a relationship", etc), they now force you to answer the question "how long was your longest relationship?" and they show it at the top of your profile. My response should be:
a.) the truth ("less than 1 year")?
b.) lie and pick a # of years (best answer is probably "more than 1" or "more than 2")?
c.) pick the obviously false ">10 years" to basically not answer the question?

If you let god into your life you can have a relationship with him your entire life.

just realized that i sent BTO a pic of someone who is definitely not the person from my TR

GB i threw up in my mouf a little at that convo.

true story: i've never sent a wink smiley face in my life

The number of people on this site that say "peaked my interest" instead of "piqued" tilts me so hard.

Dude that was the irl convo, obv have to add smileys to denote the connotation/inflection with which each line was said.

no way is it actually "piqued". and no way is that (if true) anywhere near the realm of annoyance that "should of" in place of "should have" is.

Goofy, it's not uncommon at all for a girl to completely flip flop. So I'd discount what she said last time you saw her. This is just my perspective, but if she really wanted to see you, she'd make time. If she was inviting you to something, and you wanted to bang her, you'd have done your packing over the weekend to free up time, right? There would be no "quick dinners" coming from your end. Maybe I'm overanalyzing a little phrase she used, I mean, more importantly, she does wanna get dinner with you. But I feel that you'd be better off delaying until she has more time and you can cook dinner, instead of going out somewhere.

And, GG, the is a very valuable tool, imo. Try it and see

I went with a for myself, because it's the truth, and that's the sort of thing that would eventually come up down the road. Not good to start off with a secret. Also, I think it might actually be best. I'm not as interested in a girl that had a three year relationship. That's kind of daunting to think that I could ever be as close as that guy was...and I feel like that comes with more baggage.

GB, what's your philosophy on messages? I have a ton of girls reply to the first message or two and not really say much. Like I give a couple short paragraphs and they give 2 sentences that just answers a question and brings up nothing new. Then I dunno what to do

boom just owned some girl. she's being a huge tease and was going into details about sex but also saying idk if i can do it cuz i have respect for my friend and i want to be in a relationship. she flirted with the idea of a 3some with the friend i had hookedup with and was basically "sex-ting" so i was turned on.

went and jacked off to porn and put her back in her place. she knows i reply hella slow to her texts or just ignore them completely unless they're about sex so she was using the only leverage she had. reminded me of my ex when we brokeup but were still hooking up. she'd come over and play hard to get like we barely knew each other. she'd even deny any like advances i made. soon we'd have sex and after she'd cuddle up all on me and tell me she loved me. she knew as soon as i wasn't horny she lost all power she had over me.

Wat? Every relationship starts with a million secrets. It takes forever to know every single detail about a person, and there are tons of details you don't go into until you know someone pretty well. I'm not trying to be super up front with anyone (whether it's the interwebz or any other situation) about my relationship history or lack thereof.

Also, it might be a turnoff to some girls if they want a serious relationship and they see that I'm 25 and my longest relationship is <1yr - they might be like "wtf, this guy's obviously just ****ing around and doesn't want to get serious w/ anyone" and pass up on talking to me, even though that's not really an accurate representation.

I'm hardly an expert but I think a lot of girls are just ditzes that don't have much interesting to say or aren't very good at conversation. If I was better at using POF to bang chicks I might know what to do about it, but since I'm not and I largely figure that I wouldn't be that compatible with anyone who writes me back in a totally uninteresting manner (esp given that my outgoing messages almost always have some open-ended stuff in them that are designed to get girls to talk about themselves and get conversation going) I usually just stop responding to people like that.

I'd lie here and pick something like more than 1. It's not going to be a deal-breaker once you know them to explain that you haven't really had a long relationship before, but you'll definitely get screened out if you don't do it.

Judging by the fact that you have a POF account and your reg date I'm guessing you're at least mid-twenties, right? I am too and I have to say I think about this completely opposite from you. I'd be incredibly suspicious of any girl who hasn't been in a serious relationship at some point by the time she's in her mid-twenties. For a few reasons (note this has to do with who I'd date exclusively, not who I'd try and bang):

1) I'd assume there was something wrong with her that I didn't know about. Girls generally try and get pseudo-wifed up at some point. If no one has obliged by this point, there's probably a reason.
2) I'd assume that if she hasn't had steady, personal sex for some long period of her life, she's probably moved into the undateable range as far as promiscuity is concerned.
3) She'll probably f-up her first LTR. LTR's are complicated, and trying to have one with someone who is taking their first run at one when she's 25 means a lot of the time she'll act like she's 16 because she doesn't know any better.

Now, I don't really care if she's had a 1 year relationship or a 4 year one, and I'm obviously generalizing, but to me absence of a serious relationship by this point in a girl's life is a serious red flag for me.

PS - I don't understand the being daunted by exes thing. Make her like you more, that's obv what internets advice is for.

can we replace the word secret with lie? i think gcg is right about this.

tbe took the words out of my mouth, I should have used the word lie instead of secret. It's one thing if you have a secret profession (poker) secret hook up (one of her friends) or secret problem (retrograde ejaculation or some ****). Those can be overcome because you never lied about it in the first place. But somewhere down the road, you'll have to admit with this that you lied about your relationship history. I'd rather send a red flag early with a girl I have absolutely nothing invested in, than throw one up three months into a relationship that I've put a lot into with a girl that I now care about.

But then, I have a bit of a different perception of relationship histories, maybe there is a much bigger stigma than I thought, and you'll never get through the door. I suppose I have been running super cold since I had to add that stupid ****. Maybe that's why?


Yeah that's pretty much my view. It's frustrating cause theoretically, these girls are in the top 1% of desperate, so they ought to be doing anything they can to meet a guy. I realize most of them get like 10 messages a day, but 95% are "hey ur cute." I feel like once they've put themselves out there, wrote up a profile, uploaded pics, it'd be a minor step to make thoughtful replies. So maybe they really are just that dumb/uninteresting? I mean even the fatties that message me first give me mindless one liners. Result is that I've only met one person from the site, and then she sucked irl. There's probably 20 conversations that I've just given up on after 2 or 3 messages because they put no effort into it and that's not the sort of person I'd really wanna meet.

I'm early 20s, probably 2 or 3 years younger than you. I think you make some really good points that I never really thought about. I buy reason #1 and #3. You would think that if she has redeeming qualities, somebody would have shown long term interest in her, and the experience should help. I guess it's my conservative upbringing still hiding somewhere, despite the fact that I've abandoned all the rest of it.

I can feel #3 from looking at myself, my next LTR will be smoother because of a 6 month thing that was the most serious so far But at the same time, it'll take longer and I think I'll care less about the next girl, cause of this one. I suppose it's my unrealistic Disney romanticized view of relationships that I'm her Prince Charming, and that is shot to hell when she has already dated another guy for three years. How can I top that? What can we do together that they didn't already experience? I realize it's an immature way to look at relationships, and I'd definitely still date a girl that had a LTR, but I would have those feelings.

I'm 24 if that helps put what I said in context...

So I've been experimenting around with PoF lately in attempt to meet different types of girls than I would normally meet at a bar. I've had minimal success - three 1st dates, and none have gone to a second. The highlight of those being one girl who managed to use the 'myspace angles' better than anyone I have ever seen. We even went on webcam once before meeting up, and she still turned out to be literally double the size I was expecting IRL!

Anyway, I just stumbled on this massive beast of a thread. There is no way I would be able to read all 90+ pages before I die of old age. I'm curious, has there been much discussion on PoF strategy and tactics regarding creating an attractive profile, openers that often get responses, how to close etc.? (similar to what went on back in the day in that myspace thread). If so, could someone point me to approximately where it started?

If not, why not start now?

I'm pretty OK with my profile, though I could certainly tweak it a little later on.The biggest issue I'm having is coming up with opening messages that get responses. I've tried all sorts of different methods with pretty minimal success. At first I would read over her entire profile, then tailor a message to her talking about her interests, what we had in common, fun things to do etc.. That took a lot of effort, and pretty much yielded me a 0% response rate. Complimenting her on her pics would probably get about the same response as I'm sure most girls will get that from 90% of other idiot guys. I even tried the "smile of a champion" line that some of you may remember chuddo using in one of the myspace threads back in the day with reasonable success. Did not work at all for me on PoF.

I've found what works best for me is sending a goofy/mildly clever one liner or short message out in mass. The latest one I have been trying is just a play on a cheesy pickup line and goes something like this:

Subject: If I could rearrange the alphabet...
Body: I would put S and Z together. They would make a pretty fantastic couple, don't you think?

I would say that I get roughly 10% response from that, which still seems pretty bad. Half of the responses are just like "what?" from girls that don't get it or have never heard of the pickup line before. Some actually think it's pretty funny, and will play along with me for a while, and it works out quite nicely. Once in a while, I get some chick who is really mad and just says something like "oh yea.. how many girls did you send that to a**hole?"

So what kind of openers or strategies for opening have you found to work really well? Anyone tried "Inside?"