Today's tournament rake also includes a piece for staff. The Venetian for example takes $65 from a $600 tournament for the rake and another $30 for "staff." Dealers are included in this staff take. 400 entrants = $12,000 for staff. This is the very reason tournament players have been less inclined to tip after cashing.

It’s hard to know how much of the “staff” take goes to dealers. Way back in the day many venues called it “taking out a percentage for dealers”. Then they changed it to “staff” because it came to light that very little actually went to dealers in some of these events. I think if the venues made it clear how much actually went to dealers, this would be less of an issue.

Anyhow, I can’t speak as to whether the Venetian dealers make decent money in tournaments compared to cash. But the fact of the matter is the majority of dealers across the country make a lot less in tournaments. And that is simply because you cannot usually take enough money out of the prizepool in many buy-in levels to both pay the dealers a decent amount and also have an event anyone would want to play.

Of course, this all has nothing to do with the question of why it has become the norm for players to be responsible for the majority of dealers’ compensation. Sure there are good dealers and bad dealers, but it all sort of evens out in the end and nobody is exactly getting the sort of personal service one would expect to be part of a tipping paradigm. Basically making it so dealers (in all games) are beholden to player generosity is just a other way the casino industry takes advantage. Of course, they seem hell bent on getting rid of dealers altogether, so I don’t see that changing any time soon.

The rumbling I was talking about will become reality soon. Borgata has finalized and soon coming out with the news of Spring Poker open in April.

The solution is start w 30bb stacks or level 4 and make the hourly worth it for dealers and house

I think very few people would ever play an event which started with 30bb.

The real reason tournaments go down on the west coast and no longer on the east coast is the staggering difference in dealer pay, as well as state laws surrounding minimum wage structure. Dealers are paid $5/hour at Borgata and Parx. At the Venetian, Wynn and other Vegas strip casinos, dealers are paid $11/12. In LA and most of CA, dealers are paid $13/hour.

This is due to the minimum wage laws within these states. In CA, "tipped" minimum wage is the same as the state minimum wage- $15. It's the same deal in Nevada, tipped minimum wage is the same as minimum wage, only it's less there- $9.75. But in both states, dealers keep their tips above that wage rate. In contrast, in NJ, cash minimum wage is only $5/hr (coincidentally, the number Borgata etc pay their dealers). But the state requires "tipped" minimum wage to reach $13. In PA, cash min wage is only $2.83/hr, and tipped minimum wage only has to reach $7.25.

Because of this phenomenon, 1) dealers on the west coast are less reliant on tips, and so can be tasked dealing with tip-less tournaments 2) the supply of dealers on the west coast is greater than on the east coast bc the savvy dealer knows to flock to the west coast's higher pay and 3) the greedy east coast casinos have an incentive to keep their cost basis lower by relying on cash games (and our tipping) to fill the spread between the absurdly low min wage they pay their workers, and the "tipping" minimum wage.

My guess is that on the East Coast there is a huge dealer shortage.

At Foxwoods where they have started tournaments back up now twice a week, many of the regular dealers from before Covid are no longer there. My guess is that they got jobs in other industries to make ends meet during the pandemic or they moved.

It is frustrating that they aren't running tournaments at Foxwoods on consecutive days (or more than one tournament a day on the weekends). But it is also a little scary that they don't have mask mandates given how old the average player is.

When I played in the WSOP late last year there was a vaccine mandate for players but not dealers (because they were afraid there wouldn't be enough dealers if vaccines were required). Dealers did have to wear masks but not players.

Now due to the Omnicom variant, vaccines can't prevent the spread of Covid anymore so I would imagine that would make dealers even more scarce. Especially older ones. And younger dealers? Why would anyone go into that now when there is not going to be job guarantees in the event the pandemic surges again. Not even sure dealer schools are operating.

I keep checking to see if Parx and Borgota are going to run their big series but at this point I don't think it will happen in the near future. Hopefully the pandemic will subside in terms of hospitalizations and deaths and people will be willing to play again and deal.

I played 2021 WSOP too. Played 4 events including ME. There wasn’t one dealer without mask during 10 or 12 days I played . ( Even they weren’t mandated)

I'm not holding my breath....been almost over 1 1/2 months since you made the original statement and over 3 weeks since you stated the above. I smell BS.

It’s your prospective how you want to feel .

As per my information, it is still happening in April.

And meanwhile as a test balloon, they announced:

Presidents Day $200,0000 Multi-Day Tournament

February 20th and February 21st

Anyway after almost 2 year , first of its kind 2 days Poker tournament at Atlantic City Poker venue. !! ��

Let’s see how hungry and charged up are poker players around here .

I also was told from someone in the know that Borgata plans to return in a big way in April.

I hope I heard right.

Well, I really hope you are correct re: a Borgata Spring Open in April....it's just that when you made the statement, it sounded like a Borgata announcement was imminent.
I'm happy to wait as long as necessary, even if the announcement comes in late March. Here's hoping they put together a great series...been too long!

As per I know , it’s 100% in the book for April. Only thing I can see is they don’t want to commit so early to get disappointed if things goes bad on Covid front. (Again this is my logical guess).

And I think they are well in accordance with industry standards for a tournament which is in April ,

In my opinion this will be very Big and they want to make sure they cross every T’s and dots every i’s in planning and logistics.

Thanks!

I think live poker will start to make a come back in the northeast shortly. Like another poster said here, I wouldn’t be surprised if borgata runs a spring series (or maybe they play it safe and go summer) but I’m sure the #s will be very good based on other limited northeast action.

I look at cardplayer frequently for mtt schedule updates. Vegas is going full bore for March madness. I see a series at the Venetian, orleans (actually 2 mtts with good big gtns), Bally’s (WSOP.COM), aria (high stakes so no one here is playing that most likely). To me- this is a sign that live mtts will start making a comeback. The end of March is a great time for vegas as the mtt selection is really good. This hasn’t been the case the past 2 years in a non wsop peak time.

Think we start seeing northeast casinos running mtts again + I would be shocked if #s aren’t very good. Borgata is probably the place that needs to run a series and show #s are great. Hopefully that 200k on Presidents’ Day weekend is very big (I think it will get a ton of runners obv). Parx- lacking any mtt information, I really hope they do better and start running big stax again. Probably my favorite place to play in the northeast. I’m kinda worried they could be delayed due to dealer issues. It seems they have made no progress running mtts.

Live Maryland is running a cool little series in March. I think it’s kinda goofy they are running the same time as WSOPC turning stone. I feel those 2 series are going to drag a lot of people out. I’m sure the Maryland mtts will actually have half way decent structures also (unlike the circuit events).

IMO, the reason Vegas can go full throttle is the cash games available after you get eliminated. I haven't been to Atlantic City for a few months, but if there aren't enough cash games running, I find myself questioning why I want to make a 3 hour trip from NY.

In addition to having enough dealers for the tournament, they need to have enough for the cash games too which would need even more dealers

Unfortunately I don't see a big comeback happening in the Northeast for quite awhile yet. Parx won't be having their Big Stax until at least August, Foxwoods is delaying their start of any series. Borgata is still iffy and to be honest since Tab left their structures now suck. And the 2 Philadelphia casinos seem to just want to compete against one another rather than work together. East Coast has a long way to go.

I more agree with Davepoker .
I agree with EastCoastBalla about Borgata’s ExPoker Manager Tab.

Yes it’s affecting Borgata Poker big time . Tab was a very knowledgeable , pleasant, and player friendly manager I have ever met.

riverph7 (or anyone else): So, is this Borgata Spring Poker Open still happening given the fiasco over President's Day weekend?

I doubt it now .

I am so disappointed. My information was from The horses mouth !

Generally spring open is in early to mid April.

Today is 23rd of March , chances are slim to none !

Unless they comes up with something after their “ The Spring Rebound Event” this weekend.

Yeah your source was way off. From what I've heard all they will be doing indefinitely now are random 2 day tournaments from time to time like they just had a month ago. They have that upcoming 1k which sucks. Guarantee only 100k. But from what I've heard MGM has little interest in poker at Borgota from now on. Structures will now remain bad. And the Spring, Summer, Fall and Winter Opens are most likely finished.

Borgota should write a book on how to ruin a once great venue for poker tournaments in a few easy steps. They suck.

You know what the worst part about them ruining their poker revenue stream?
They just extinguished the revenue from the table games , rooms and food concessions from the poker players. As long as the players are still playing the tournaments, they don't need to change a thing.

Yeah you summed it up perfectly. I will not set foot in that place again.

Btw I don’t think tab leaving is the reason borgata sucks now. It’s not that difficult to run a tourny series with decent structures as the northeast will show up if the gtns are good. I mean poker demand is insane right now in the northeast.

MGM looks to be moving away from poker bc it doesn’t generate the money they want. I can see that but I also think poker does bring in some degenerates that punt money betting sports/ firing away $ at goofy money rake table games.

Btw I think it was funny how someone early in this thread said they were going to have a spring series. Lmao yea they aren’t going to announce 2-3 months in advance so people can plan for it. Whoever posted that really was wrong which is kinda hilarious- I even said in this thread I will believe it when i see it.

I know staffing problems exist etc but still can’t see how more places aren’t running mtts in the northeast. It’s nice to see Maryland live/ Philly area running some stuff. AC / Foxwoods not running any mtt series of note. I just don’t understand it. I think live mtts will really bring in solid #s vs prior to the pandemic but yea it’s whatever. I guess it’s better to not run tournies than do what borgata did and run some stupid shitty structure tourny they weren’t prepared for which is hilarious.