I've always been partial to "The Missiles of October" for that type of fare.

Simple tv production that is interesting and entertaining.

I agree with this as well.

Balt seems to want to put some political spin on everything.

(Although I agree with him on the ferry scene in TDK, not necessary and stops the flow of the film)

No need for Balt to slap the casual moviegoers either, I would like to think this thread is open to anyone posting an opinion on a movie.
Not just the erudite ones.

Tdk was amazing and not a political movie. I do not know what is with the recent desire to appear intellectual by slamming movies for their "politics" when they are obviously not political.

Tdk is not condoning fascism, in fact a good part of the movie deals with whether or not batman is a good guy.

A Quiet Place is not pro life and pro gun.

These are movies, not reality. More importantly they aren't close to reality. If you happen to live in a city where the Joker is running around causing havoc and the police are unable to do anything then yeah, you might want a Batman. If you live in a world where aliens roam and kill you if you make any noise then yeah, you might want a gun. For everyone else, these are escape from reality and not political messages.

You're remembering wrong.

There's politics in everything. Even if TDK were more of a light entertainment, there would still be the angle of "ok, I'm watching a billionaire beat up on poor people and he's supposed to be a hero?"

In the case of TDK though, the politics are in the script pretty explicitly.

I've seen TDKR just once, last year, and posted about it in the previous thread. Whatever politics it's trying to have were too confusing for me to figure out the first time, which actually makes me think higher of it. (Other critics take the opposite view, where they respect TDK more for being clear about it, even if they disagree with the politics. See Michael & Us: https://soundcloud.com/michael-and-u...k-knight-rises, which continues to be my #1 podcast by far.)

Yea, you're right. The negativity is more directed at the strawpeople who I imagined would say "lol why are you thinking about politics in a Batman movie?"

I only bother with the politics if they're super overt, super disagreeable, super agreeable, and/or I am not otherwise entertained. There's plenty of movies I like that technically have bad "politics".

TDK is borderline for me as entertainment and the politics push it down.

Another negative about it is that it throws a lot of philosophical garbage at the wall so that some of it sticks. This is common in movies that people think are really smart, such as Fight Club.

I wanted to write about what a bad moronic quote "die a hero, or live long enough to see yourself become the villain" is, but I thought about it in the shower and it's accurate enough of the time that maybe it's decent.

Alfred, Joker, and Dent all have plenty of incoherent quotes with a couple of kernels of truth in there. It's 1,000 monkeys typing.

Harvey the character and his relationship with Rachel is all incredibly bad and eye-rolly too.

Do you think the movie wants you to think about whether or not it's good that Batman tapped everyone's phone, tortures the Joker, and is able to use military-grade hardware because he's rich (while tying up copycat vigilantes who don't have money)?

Yes, the movie is very explicit with that and it is a major focus of the movie.

I guess you could make that complaint about Batman being a billionaire about anything featuring the character. I find it no more offensive or political than an alien (like Superman) beating up on bad guys or a mutant (like Wolverine) beating up on bad guys, etc.

And of course, you're assuming that people he beats up on are poor and that the reason they are criminals because they are poor. You're just projecting your own politics onto the film. You're right, I saw the movie a long time ago, when it was out in the theater, and I don't remember all the details, I just remember it was the best Batman film I have ever seen, and I've seen all of them. And I'm pretty sure I'd remember if the criminals he beat up explained how they were poor and that's why they were driven to a life of crime.

don't have much to say about the movie as i haven't seen it, just wanted to remind everyone when we did the draft a super group Freddie was my lead singer.
also hunter s was my roadie/procurement guy/band biographer so i won the draft.

charlie wilson's war was ****ing awesome.
road to perdition was pretty dope tho im not sure if that was before or after catch me if you can.

.

Art reflects the time it is made in, either intentionally or not. TDK is incredible entertaining...and it does wear its politics on its sleeve. Which is often clunky, but perfectly fine.

Dom,

Well said.

I have to admit I never watch a scene like Batman hacking everyone's cell phones in TDK and think politics or domestic spying and invasion of privacy, or some other messaging first. I'm just like... Oh, another superhero technology trick film trope... Neato.

I'm reading up on the ideology of rom-coms. Interesting.

Any particular book? I always thought it would be interesting to read up on screwball rom-coms.

The best book on screwball comedy is Stanley Cavell's Pursuits of Happiness. I'm reading The Hollywood Romantic Comedy by Leger Grindon and just finished Romantic Comedy by Tamar Jeffers McDonald. Grindon's book is the more academic while Cavell's is my favorite.

This is gto. Same with just about all morality issues presented in these.

There's only the perception of privacy in modern society... if folks don't think predictive analytics, passive ease dropping and tracking are taking place as commonly as watching TV, your not awake to modern realities.

Right or wrong, it's real.

Of course TDK is political, as is every movie, yet to reduce it to fascism is very reductive.

For the record, I enjoy BJ's movie reviews a lot, even if I disagree with him very often, as they are well constructed and very emotionally and politically inclined (which makes them fun ), but to say that TDK is not smart, is pretty pedantic.

As politics is intrinsic to movies, so is philosophy. The concept of the double is fascinating in TDK (opening scenes of jokers/batmans, ending scenes on building, joker/batman, Two Face etc.).

Also of note : there is a ton of similarities with the novel Demons by Dostoevsky (which happens to be a criticism of the communist to come in USSR, not fascism ) within which is also displayed the manipulation of the image of martyr or, in the DKN, the perceived sacrifice/martyr of Harvey Dent AKA/"die a hero or live to become the villain" line referenced by BJ. Anyhow, TDK has a ton to dissect and is definitely indeed a well thought it film

The BBC did an exhaustive poll of over 200 critics all over the world to rank the greatest non-English-language films.

link to article

Got some good discussion there.

Here is the list:

100. Landscape in the Mist (Theo Angelopoulos, 1988)
99. Ashes and Diamonds (Andrzej Wajda, 1958)
98. In the Heat of the Sun (Jiang Wen, 1994)
97. Taste of Cherry (Abbas Kiarostami, 1997)
96. Shoah (Claude Lanzmann, 1985)
95. Floating Clouds (Mikio Naruse, 1955)
94. Where Is the Friend's Home? (Abbas Kiarostami, 1987)
93. Raise the Red Lantern (Zhang Yimou, 1991)
92. Scenes from a Marriage (Ingmar Bergman, 1973)
91. Rififi (Jules Dassin, 1955)
90. Hiroshima Mon Amour (Alain Resnais, 1959)
89. Wild Strawberries (Ingmar Bergman, 1957)
88. The Story of the Last Chrysanthemum (Kenji Mizoguchi, 1939)
87. The Nights of Cabiria (Federico Fellini, 1957)
86. La Jetée (Chris Marker, 1962)
85. Umberto D (Vittorio de Sica, 1952)
84. The Discreet Charm of the Bourgeoisie (Luis Buñuel, 1972)
83. La Strada (Federico Fellini, 1954)
82. Amélie (Jean-Pierre Jeunet, 2001)
81. Celine and Julie go Boating (Jacques Rivette, 1974)
80. The Young and the Damned (Luis Buñuel, 1950)
79. Ran (Akira Kurosawa, 1985)
78. Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon (Ang Lee, 2000)
77. The Conformist (Bernardo Bertolucci, 1970)
76. Y Tu Mamá También (Alfonso Cuarón, 2001)
75. Belle de Jour (Luis Buñuel, 1967)
74. Pierrot Le Fou (Jean-Luc Godard, 1965)
73. Man with a Movie Camera (Dziga Vertov, 1929)
72. Ikiru (Akira Kurosawa, 1952)
71. Happy Together (Wong Kar-wai, 1997)
70. L’Eclisse (Michelangelo Antonioni, 1962)
69. Amour (Michael Haneke, 2012)
68. Ugetsu (Kenji Mizoguchi, 1953)
67. The Exterminating Angel (Luis Buñuel, 1962)
66. Ali: Fear Eats the Soul (Rainer Werner Fassbinder, 1973)
65. Ordet (Carl Theodor Dreyer, 1955)
64. Three Colours: Blue (Krzysztof Kieślowski, 1993)
63. Spring in a Small Town (Fei Mu, 1948)
62. Touki Bouki (Djibril Diop Mambéty, 1973)
61. Sansho the Bailiff (Kenji Mizoguchi, 1954)
60. Contempt (Jean-Luc Godard, 1963)
59. Come and See (Elem Klimov, 1985)
58. The Earrings of Madame de… (Max Ophüls, 1953)
57. Solaris (Andrei Tarkovsky, 1972)
56. Chungking Express (Wong Kar-wai, 1994)
55. Jules and Jim (François Truffaut, 1962)
54. Eat Drink Man Woman (Ang Lee, 1994)
53. Late Spring (Yasujirô Ozu, 1949)
52. Au Hasard Balthazar (Robert Bresson, 1966)
51. The Umbrellas of Cherbourg (Jacques Demy, 1964)
50. L’Atalante (Jean Vigo, 1934)
49. Stalker (Andrei Tarkovsky, 1979)
48. Viridiana (Luis Buñuel, 1961)
47. 4 Months, 3 Weeks and 2 Days (Cristian Mungiu, 2007)
46. Children of Paradise (Marcel Carné, 1945)
45. L’Avventura (Michelangelo Antonioni, 1960)
44. Cleo from 5 to 7 (Agnès Varda, 1962)
43. Beau Travail (Claire Denis, 1999)
42. City of God (Fernando Meirelles, Kátia Lund, 2002)
41. To Live (Zhang Yimou, 1994)
40. Andrei Rublev (Andrei Tarkovsky, 1966)
39. Close-Up (Abbas Kiarostami, 1990)
38. A Brighter Summer Day (Edward Yang, 1991)
37. Spirited Away (Hayao Miyazaki, 2001)
36. La Grande Illusion (Jean Renoir, 1937)
35. The Leopard (Luchino Visconti, 1963)
34. Wings of Desire (Wim Wenders, 1987)
33. Playtime (Jacques Tati, 1967)
32. All About My Mother (Pedro Almodóvar, 1999)
31. The Lives of Others (Florian Henckel von Donnersmarck, 2006)
30. The Seventh Seal (Ingmar Bergman, 1957)
29. Oldboy (Park Chan-wook, 2003)
28. Fanny and Alexander (Ingmar Bergman, 1982)
27. The Spirit of the Beehive (Victor Erice, 1973)
26. Cinema Paradiso (Giuseppe Tornatore, 1988)
25. Yi Yi (Edward Yang, 2000)
24. Battleship Potemkin (Sergei M Eisenstein, 1925)
23. The Passion of Joan of Arc (Carl Theodor Dreyer, 1928)
22. Pan’s Labyrinth (Guillermo del Toro, 2006)
21. A Separation (Asghar Farhadi, 2011)
20. The Mirror (Andrei Tarkovsky, 1974)
19. The Battle of Algiers (Gillo Pontecorvo, 1966)
18. A City of Sadness (Hou Hsiao-hsien, 1989)
17. Aguirre, the Wrath of God (Werner Herzog, 1972)
16. Metropolis (Fritz Lang, 1927)
15. Pather Panchali (Satyajit Ray, 1955)
14. Jeanne Dielman, 23 Commerce Quay, 1080 Brussels (Chantal Akerman, 1975)
13. M (Fritz Lang, 1931)
12. Farewell My Concubine (Chen Kaige, 1993)
11. Breathless (Jean-Luc Godard, 1960)
10. La Dolce Vita (Federico Fellini, 1960)
9. In the Mood for Love (Wong Kar-wai, 2000)
8. The 400 Blows (François Truffaut, 1959)
7. 8 1/2 (Federico Fellini, 1963)
6. Persona (Ingmar Bergman, 1966)
5. The Rules of the Game (Jean Renoir, 1939)
4. Rashomon (Akira Kurosawa, 1950)
3. Tokyo Story (Yasujirô Ozu, 1953)
2. Bicycle Thieves (Vittorio de Sica, 1948)
1. Seven Samurai (Akira Kurosawa, 1954)

I am ashamed to say I've only seen 33 of these movies.

On Bohemian Rhapsody...

I was quite surprised to read all the negative reviews on the movie considering the cast, music and subject matter- and its PG-13 rating was almost enough to just convince me not to see it (ok, not really but I was bummed about the idea of a sterilized rock biopic.)

But you’d have to be a special kind of weirdo to not enjoy this film. It’s just lovely to watch and hear. Sure, it sidesteps all of the sexual debauchery, but it’s a 2 hour film about one of the greatest rock frontmen of all time. It seems fine to focus on portraying the entertainment on stage and save the disection of Freddie’s most intimate details for the 8-part Netflix docudrama.

In fact, I think the criticisms are somewhere between rampant disingenuousness and veiled homophobia. Think of all of the music biopic movies that have been made and how infrequently you read a criticism about the movie not delving deeply enough into the subjects’ most intimate sexual details. It’s not like Johnny Cash’s sex life was devoid of interesting details. How come if it’s Janis or Jimi a single scene of them sauntering off with a one night stand makes the point just fine but for Freddie a reviewer can give the film a single star just because the depiction of his sexual orientation wasn’t quite graphic enough?

I don’t know, I just think the whole thing stinks. It’s the wrong conversation to be having about the film and it’s going to cost the artists involved some gold (the film artists, not Queen.)

Personally, I think the film did a great job of portraying Freddie’s struggles with sexuality and privacy, the role Mary Austin played in his personal life, and the way they “literally” villanized Paul Pretner. The Jim Hutton stuff was reasonably well handled also. And if you don’t know who any of those people are even though you love Queen’s music then you just strengthened my point.

Regarding Dom’s timeline criticisms... im surprised it bothered you for a few reasons. First, bands often write songs long before they end up recorded on an album and rehearse them long after they are recorded. So that fact should adequately fuel the suspension of disbelief needed to hear them perform some particular song at some particular time. Second, I’m surprised the musical timeline bothered you but the fact that FM announced his HIV status to the band before the Live Aid show didn’t stand out as very close to impossible. Also if Queen broke up and weren’t talking to each other until they reunited at Live Aid then that’s news to me (and whomever attended their tour the year prior.) So ya, the timeline doesn’t check out but that’s nitpicking now isn’t it?

I’m curious if anyone else was more offended by the critics than the film.

Have you seen "Dude, Where's My Car?"?

I've missed 15 or 16.

I haven't read any reviews of the movie....are critics really complaining about not delving into Freddie's sex life? I think the movie did it plenty. Personally, I don't care about other people's sex lives and couldn't care less about Freddie's...I could've done without all of it, actually, and just concentrated on the music. Or, go the other way and make a really controversial movie ABOUT his sex life. That might be interesting.

I just wanted a better movie. I certainly enjoyed it. And the timeline thing is nit-picking, yes, but dammit, it bothered me when it said "1980" and they started working on We Will Rock You.

I just don't like Queen's music, it's like the Fight Club of music to me.

Sheila O’malley on RogerEbert.com gave the film ONE STAR because she was so offended that it didn’t handle his sexuality explicitly enough. WTF just the recreation of the Live Aid show and the editing and sound mixing alone makes it a good movie. Using fake butt-hurt to literally tarnish the whole film is not cool. Why not just say “I personally wanted a gayer movie, but I’ll give it a reluctant thumbs up for craftsmanship alone” which I honestly think is the worst review this movie could credibly deserve.