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08-23-2018 , 05:45 PM
#1
vladimir123
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28 Players register a 90+10 tournament

10 of the players are fish with -20% ROI

18 of the players are equally good regs.


The fish lose 100$ to the rake and 100$ to the regs

The regs lose 180$ to the rake and win 100$ from the fish = the group of regs lose 80$ playing the tournament.

Is it really this hard to win in such a high rake environment or am i calculating wrong?
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08-23-2018 , 06:54 PM
#2
SeaKing's Avatar
SeaKing
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$1000 is what is contributed by the fish to the prize pool after accounting for rake, there are 18 players for which this money gets equally distributed meaning they all get $1000/18 = $5.555. The post-rake losses of the fish will sum with the post-rake winnings of the regs to equal 0.

10 * -10 + 18 * 5.555 = 0
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08-27-2018 , 03:14 AM
#3
vladimir123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaKing
$1000 is what is contributed by the fish to the prize pool after accounting for rake
10 * -10 + 18 * 5.555 = 0
90 goes to the price pool and 10 goes to rake = 900?
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08-28-2018 , 09:03 AM
#4
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SeaKing
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Sorry there were some typos in my previous post ($1000 instead of $100). The post-rake losses of the fish are $100 which gets distributed to the regs equally, meaning they all get ~$5.55 from that, but also have to pay $10 each in rake, thus end up losing ~$4.45 each or collectively losing $80. Yes, everyone is losing in this MTT.

-$20 * 10 Fish +
-$4.45 * 18 Regs
------
$-280 = -$10 (rake) * 28 players who entered.
Last edited by SeaKing; 08-28-2018 at 09:18 AM.
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08-28-2018 , 10:43 AM
#5
ThatsMySpot
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centurion
Join Date: Jul 2015 Posts: 163
Bad calculation as ROI includes rake; a fish with -20% ROI means that on a $100 MTT loses $10 to other players and $10 to site.
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08-28-2018 , 10:44 AM
#6
ThatsMySpot
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centurion
Join Date: Jul 2015 Posts: 163
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaKing
Sorry there were some typos in my previous post ($1000 instead of $100). The post-rake losses of the fish are $100 which gets distributed to the regs equally, meaning they all get ~$5.55 from that, but also have to pay $10 each in rake, thus end up losing ~$4.45 each or collectively losing $80. Yes, everyone is losing in this MTT.

-$20 * 10 Fish +
-$4.45 * 18 Regs
------
$-280 = -$10 (rake) * 28 players who entered.
yup, this calculation is right.

Home=+$280
Fish=-$200
Reg=-$80
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08-28-2018 , 02:47 PM
#7
JoeC2012
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-20% seems like a really high ROI for a fish
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08-28-2018 , 10:00 PM
#8
vladimir123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeC2012
-20% seems like a really high ROI for a fish
Yeah that's probably true. What do you think is the average ROI for a rec in a deepstacked midstakes MTT?
Last edited by vladimir123; 08-28-2018 at 10:10 PM.
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08-29-2018 , 01:27 AM
#9
JoeC2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vladimir123
Yeah that's probably true. What do you think is the average ROI for a rec in a deepstacked midstakes MTT?
Great question really. I'm pretty sure -20% is too optimistic-- even when these guys cash they're pretty hopeless against the tougher players and myriad ICM considerations once ITM. But I don't really know if it's -40% or -85%.
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08-30-2018 , 06:02 AM
#10
SuicideSquad
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journeyman
Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 343
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeC2012
-20% seems like a really high ROI for a fish
And 60% of the field being 'equally good' regs seems like a very bizzare assumption.
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