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Old 10-03-2013, 11:43 PM   #26
mement_mori
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

Yeah ghosting is not okay but it is very hard to do anything about and I don't think listing stables will really help much, and also horses shouldn't have to tell who and if they are backed if they don't want to.
But from everything that I have been told and can gather what Kleath is talking about is unfortunately a very big problem, it sounds like there are a lot of americans playing under new accounts (before WSOP I remember there were a couple of suspicious Romanian accounts that came up out of nowhere, have never seen them play again though so I assume they got caught).
It also sounds like a lot of people know about their friends doing this but don't want to rat them out, I really wish they would though. I am sure these guys find a way of justifying what they are doing but it is just so incredibly unfair. It sucks that you have to move to play but its no excuse to steal money from the rest of us who play under our own name.

I would have no problem listing people if I was sure but I feel a bit uneasy mentioning names or individuals without being 100% certain. I usually just try to shoot a message to people I know if I find a weird one and have them spread the word, and its a tough choice because you want as many people as possible to know but you also don't really want to post a SN unless you are absolutely sure.

I don't think I would had ever advocated this before but given how severe the situation seems to be I wonder if a thread where people can bring up names of potential accounts would be a good idea, open to other suggestions as well.
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Old 10-03-2013, 11:43 PM   #27
LeonP
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

This is exactly why people think your a tool.
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Old 10-03-2013, 11:47 PM   #28
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

furthermore HUD's are far worse for the game than any form of backer ghosting... or the public coaching threads you spam fb and all your other **** with... Thats what is saturating MTT's not someone trying to look out for their own investment... Maybe stars should ban HUD's then we will see who can actually hang
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Old 10-04-2013, 12:14 AM   #29
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

So if you are 90% certain a good friend is ghosting people Mement_mori or Kleath, what do you do? I feel that I know enough people that you know who are ghosting, and we've just passively accepted this as a reality. You don't rat names out to the public, you might tell people you have an interest in, but don't make it generally available information. Why is that?

LeonP, just cause you don't use a HUD correctly doesn't mean they are worse for the game. Thanks for the free coaching advertisement, if you think my skills with a HUD are killing the game harder than multi-accounting, clearly my coaching is worth the money!
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Old 10-04-2013, 12:21 AM   #30
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

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Maybe stars should ban HUD's then we will see who can actually hang
This will just make the detection of ghosting even more difficult.
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Old 10-04-2013, 12:24 AM   #31
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

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This will just make the detection of ghosting even more difficult.
You people just don't see the point... It is making it impossible for fish or recreational players to win... And it is making bad players semi decent and lowering ppls roi's. Probably 25% of HSMTT regs right now without a hud couldn't make a dollar long run.
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Old 10-04-2013, 12:25 AM   #32
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

Also there are people who sell data bases... Which is way more illegal than any ghosting.
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Old 10-04-2013, 12:43 AM   #33
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

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Maybe you need posting ghosting
Lol why did this get no love yet.

And I guess squee's intentions were good but man this was just not thought out at all. How can you suggest that the community do something about ghosting when you are unwilling to take a stand against it yourself. Nothing can be done about a problem if those who are in the know are unwilling to step up in the slightest. And as others mentioned, a list of backed players and backers only takes away from the privacy that players who have not been shown to do anything wrong are entitled to and only addresses a small part of the problem. If you want to report on the things you have seen, great, but until then you are just trying to make yourself feel like a good person without actually doing or accomplishing anything
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Old 10-04-2013, 01:07 AM   #34
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

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OPs intentions obv were good ones, i can imagine how tough the situation is. who wants to be a snitch? as stupid as it sounds, like the only way would be if someone who knows a lot makes a 2nd account here and posts stuff anonymously. and if i think a certain backer has ghosted one of his horses, knowing who all of his horses are would help A LOT. i mean if i was a backer and i wasnt doing anything shady i had zero problem with people knowing who is backed by me! just post who's connected with who, would def help everybody imo. would help me for sure at least.
go back to pocketfives

Last edited by Rowniwn; 10-04-2013 at 01:08 AM. Reason: please
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Old 10-04-2013, 01:09 AM   #35
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

Hey Squee,

As you have previously mentioned you have yourself ghosted people. So it's very kind of you to get all high and mighty just as you are 'retiring' and should no longer find yourself in a situation where ghosting a friend, a horse or a colleague could be beneficial to yourself. I feel if your plans were not to retire you probably wouldn't have felt the need to bring this to light.

Ghosting is wrong and bad for the community, we all know it, but as previous posters have mentioned it seems fairly hard to police and lumping every backed player on a list together would lead to some grossly unfair assumptions.

Someone mentioned earlier about blocking all social media and tools like Skype while your poker client is open. Pretty ridiculous to think that could and should ever happen, why should a recreational player (or even a professional) not be able to share with the world the excitement that he/she is currently 6/111 in the Big 5...

How unreasonable would it be of people to assume that as someone who coaches for profit that you may help students out during deep runs? If someone were to ask if they played those pocket 5's two hands ago poorly and asked for bet sizing advice or whatever, would you and others stand your ethical ground and state that it's unfair for you to comment? I agree this is not quite the same as being on live Skype call or whatever but is it really that different when even subtle things can change the outcome.

I'm not saying that you do or do not but I'm pretty sure people will speculate over such possibilities as well.
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Old 10-04-2013, 01:21 AM   #36
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

as someone who is hundreds of thousands of dollars poorer for never having ghosted my idiot horses over the years all this thread is doing is making me wish i had, because no-one gets outed anyway.

ghosting is so hard to police effectively that its probably ultimately part of the game, but people should really be outed for doing it.

there needs to be negative reinforcement, since people make money from it. stars can't really stop people doing it, but people who are significantly richer for having cheated the spirit of the game deserve to have a marred reputation, like people in sports who played dirty or used PEDs. outing people is the best and only way to even the ledger and dissuade good players from doing it. it can potentially be quite effective too since most people good enough to bother ghosting are already rich and respected.

on the other hand, regs playing from the US/getting fresh accounts/pure multiaccounts and so on should be very policeable and people need to be outed to stars. i would snap report anyone i heard about doing any of these things and i would think worse of anyone i knew was doing it.
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Old 10-04-2013, 01:59 AM   #37
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

SEABEAST nails it.

The only issues I can see are people being outed based on assumptions or the rumour-mill rather than fact.

The whole thing makes me a bit sick. I've also heard the rationalisation that people would engage in the behaviour because others are and you're at a disadvantage if you don't... that gem is particularly irritating.
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Old 10-04-2013, 03:25 AM   #38
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

If what kleath was saying is really the big issue here then isn't everyone being anonymous the only way to assure an even playing field? It's pretty extreme but it's probably the only way to make sure no one is gaining an unfair advantage...
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Old 10-04-2013, 03:31 AM   #39
LeonP
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

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Originally Posted by mjw006 View Post
If what kleath was saying is really the big issue here then isn't everyone being anonymous the only way to assure an even playing field? It's pretty extreme but it's probably the only way to make sure no one is gaining an unfair advantage...
Backers would love that I am sure... No more backing, no more marketplace, ppl should just stop bitching about **** that is never going to change.
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Old 10-04-2013, 03:34 AM   #40
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

it actually wouldnt be a bad idea if it were all anonymous then at the end the lobby showed results with actual names.

it would be hectic for backers and railers but not impossible. it would take much more trust to back someone also.

however i dont think its gotten to that point yet, even tho it is getting pretty stupid sometimes
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Old 10-04-2013, 03:35 AM   #41
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

i can actually imagine it being fun if once you busted the name shows up, then KOing someone and getting the sweat of checking the lobby to see who u busted
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Old 10-04-2013, 03:47 AM   #42
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

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Backers would love that I am sure... No more backing, no more marketplace, ppl should just stop bitching about **** that is never going to change.
I'm not saying I want it to happen nor that there's no issues with it. There's heaps beyond your point, just saying that it's prolly the only way to alleviate the problem described itt.
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Old 10-04-2013, 04:45 AM   #43
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

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the focus isnt even on the right ****, you want to ***** about ma's the big problem isnt the backers ghosting its the ronaldkoshs and gboros of the world grinding full schedules on fresh accounts, or a new uraguan account that plays just like sixthsense every month, or shared accounts that have 100% of cals tendencies on a random day. Hmm havent seen noctus in a while guess he mustve quit backing and playing. ghosting is one thing, not saying its not a grey area at best and scummy at its worst but vast majority of backer horse ghosting ive experienced is horse goes hey think im gonna fold here backer says sure go for it, thats a whole different level than giving someone a proverbial blank face and giving them 100% control over decisions when they have history with heaps of the field. props to the few non ******s who still play on their own name, its getting rarer and rarer
lol about sixth... you are completely wrong. i know personally the guys from uruguay and they are the nuts, its a **** to tell they are sixth.. put in their spot for one second, so undiserved.
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Old 10-04-2013, 04:53 AM   #44
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

do you sit on a throne when you play poker squee?
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Old 10-04-2013, 05:08 AM   #45
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

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do you sit on a throne when you play poker squee?
do you?
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Old 10-04-2013, 05:09 AM   #46
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

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Originally Posted by kleath View Post
the focus isnt even on the right ****, you want to ***** about ma's the big problem isnt the backers ghosting its the ronaldkoshs and gboros of the world grinding full schedules on fresh accounts, or a new uraguan account that plays just like sixthsense every month, or shared accounts that have 100% of cals tendencies on a random day. Hmm havent seen noctus in a while guess he mustve quit backing and playing. ghosting is one thing, not saying its not a grey area at best and scummy at its worst but vast majority of backer horse ghosting ive experienced is horse goes hey think im gonna fold here backer says sure go for it, thats a whole different level than giving someone a proverbial blank face and giving them 100% control over decisions when they have history with heaps of the field. props to the few non ******s who still play on their own name, its getting rarer and rarer
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Old 10-04-2013, 05:25 AM   #47
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

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Originally Posted by mjw006 View Post
If what kleath was saying is really the big issue here then isn't everyone being anonymous the only way to assure an even playing field? It's pretty extreme but it's probably the only way to make sure no one is gaining an unfair advantage...
i guess bovada (bodog) is ahead of pokerstars in that department

but in all seriousness there is def close to nothing that can be done about ghosting
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Old 10-04-2013, 05:28 AM   #48
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

Bitching about other things that are wrong isn't helping this. If everyone wasn't so ****ing scared to lose their 'friends' or be viewed negatively and had some balls this thread would be exploding with names. It really isn't that hard. Read this thread and its obvious nobody actually wants to fix anything wrt ghosting.
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Old 10-04-2013, 05:30 AM   #49
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

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Bitching about other things that are wrong isn't helping this. If everyone wasn't so ****ing scared to lose their 'friends' or be viewed negatively and had some balls this thread would be exploding with names. It really isn't that hard. Read this thread and its obvious nobody actually wants to fix anything wrt ghosting.
yup
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Old 10-04-2013, 05:33 AM   #50
hauptschule
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Re: BOO!: There's a ghost at my FT

meh, if my backer wasnt that bad in mtts, i would meanwhile run the biggest stable worldwide myself ainec












......and obv wouldnt find lifetime to ghost dolts in the big 11 waddup
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