Alright, so, I'm a total noob at NL. I played limit poker profitably at about 2bb/100 in 2005-2006, before I took a year long hiatus from poker. There were many reasons for this, none of which matter at all.

I've opted for NL this time around because I want something new to get all passionate about again.

Over my first 3,386 hands of NL i've lost about 3 buyins. I'm assuming this is perfectly normal variance... I remember having lots of 200bb+ swings at limit back in the day....

Anyway, here are my stats so far over these hands.

21/16/3.67

Is this TOO aggressive?

FR or 6max? if FR then maybe your playing a little too aggro preflop and putting yourself in tough spots in raised spots....it might pay to not put yourself in these spots until you have a bit more experience at NL

also as someone making the transition who loves his stats in limit games cos i know a bet is a bet is a bet ive come to realise that theres more to betting than just hitting the bet button in NL. bet sizing is something ive worked on alot and will continue to do so. stating the obvious but bet sizing matters. I do think your AF is high but in isolation without other stats i dunno what else to say. maybe read the example hand thread that alobar posted. perhaps you can just call a little more.

and finally, 3BI and <3.5k hands isnt that much or that much of a sample. I suggest getting involved in the forums (try microstakes NL forums too as there is way more traffic there but stick round here also as this is more of a small group where your post wont be off the front page in 5 minutes and full of one line replies....)

Imagine just once in your 3k hands you get it in AK vs QQ for stacks, that's a 200bb swing on the flip of a coin. While lots of spots may not be as obvious as that, a lot of the time you'll be committing lots of money in near flip situations so losing a few of those will have a huge impact on a 3k sample.

I think just from the experience of playing the hands you should know if you are playing well or not. If you can't really remember anybody sucking out on your for half a stack, or running into a set with kings or whatever then maybe you're not getting enough value from your winning hands. If you've feel like you've had to fold a ton maybe your just running into a load of better hands and making the right play, or maybe you're getting run over. Only you will really know how those 3k hands went down, and you should have a reasonable idea the results would differ much if you ran the 3k hands again.

fwiw when I first started playing NL properly I really struggled to make folds when I knew I was beat, so calling river shoves, that kind of thing. Value betting when there is no value is something else you should try not to do, and if you've got a super high aggression factor it's probably something you should think about more. Sometimes calling is the right play.

Congrats on choosing NL, you made the right choice

is this 6max or fullring? I would tend to play tighter than looser while learning the game, the game plays a lot different and it will help keep you out of trouble until you get a better feel for the game.

The thing is in NL stats are basically meaningless, you can play so many styles and still win, thats its not like limit were you can get a much better feel for someone simply on stats. My first 100K hands of NL I have pretty much the exact same stats all across the board as my second 100K. In the first 100K I breakeven, in the second 100K im a 6ptbb/100 winner. So stats dont tell that great a story.

Just a few general thing where NL is different from limit.

POSITION POSITION POSITION.....position is 1000x more important than in limit. play really really tight upfront and loose in the back.

Don't be anal about defending your blinds, in LHE you guard your blinds with your life, in NL you dont really worry about it that much. If you folded your BB and SB everytime there was a LP raise while you were learning the game (unless you had a big PP) you really wouldnt be making a mistake.

TP and ace high arent the nuts. Clicking the "call" button to get to showdown will destroy you in NL, while in limit its obviously the thing to do most of the time.


The biggest thing I would say, is while new to NL, quit worrying about stats, just completly ignore them. Iron out your PF game so that you arent making huge leaks, but just play really tight and worry about post flop. Post actual hands and situations here that you are having trouble with, and as you start to get better and more confident then you can open up your game.

Appreciate the comments guys, all helpful. I'm playing SH not FR.

The bet sizing thing is what has really struck me. I've been kind of at a loss so far as how much one should bet. Limit is straight forward obviously, not something you ever have to worry about.

Was watching a video of iStrong the other day that went something like this...

BB: $51
HERO (UTG): $92.75
BTN: $30
SB: $11.75

Pre-flop: AdJd dealt to Hero (UTG)
Hero raises $2.25, BTN folds, SB folds, BB calls

Flop: 3 2 2
BB checks, Hero checks

Turn: Q
BB bets $2, Hero raises to $8, BB folds...

Why would he not just continuation bet here? iStrong says he put him on a "small pair" and decided to check. I haven not been doing anything like this, I would have continuation bet there 100% of the time. In my view, I want to win that pot right now with a continuation bet and not give them a chance to hit anything they won't want to let go.

But i've been seeing a lot of stuff like this. When/Why would you play this way when you have the momentum in late position and all that? If you had a hand like 33 and hit the boat, would you play the hand the same way?


*edit* above typo... he -> you | 44 -> 33

IG, the only real reason to not Cbet in a spot like that is if you suspect that villain will checkraise you.

In limit, if you get checkraised with AJ on a 322 board, you can just call and make a turn decision.

In NL, you have to make your decision right then and there because there's so much money going into the pot. By checking behind, you're sometimes making that decision pre-emptively.

The reason im guessing he didnt cbet is because he figured the guy had a small PP and wasnt folding, so all he was doing is putting money in while behind and risking getting checkraised, if he checks he can still pick the pot up on a later street as lot of turn cards (any broadway card) are good cards to bet and get a fold from 55 or whatever.

That makes sense, and it's how iStrong explained it. However, I don't know how he concluded the villain had a small pocket pair.

well what was his thought process that went into concluding that?


Lots of players in that spot their range is pretty much PPs and suited connector type stuff. (so maybe he was working off a stat read?) A cbet never folds out the PPs and you have the best hand vs all the other stuff so getting them to fold isnt that important.

In limit its hammered into your brain to never give free cards, always protect your hand, etc etc. In NL lots of times its just not that important. In limit the % of the pot you are betting to protect your share of the pot is pretty small, in NL the size of your bet to protect your share of the pot is much higher, so its often not worth protecting that share, considering how much more you have to risk in order to do so, and not just on that street, but on future streets as well.

well, he had just sat down at the table... maybe 1 round had gone by. He had no stats up either...

I just don't have a feel for the game yet I suppose... I'm not too sure WHAT people are cold calling with like that. Everyone actually has seemed way random so far, so it really just might not apply to the limits that i'm at.

I suspect he had a read on the guy as basic TAG. Because in small stakes NL, small PPs are basically the only hands that warrant a coldcall (unlike limit, where it's basically KQs, so you shouldn't ever, because you turn your hand face up).

I highly recommed iStrong's videos BTW, because shows a basic TAG/LAG game and how it profits against a mixed field.

Where can I find iStrong's videos?

Look at the SSNL Link Collection sticky in SSNL, it has links to some of them, you can find the rest from there.

I was going to reply, but basically I would just be echoing everything alobar/guru said, so yeah, listen to them.

Surf