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Old 07-12-2012, 12:58 PM   #526
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by Alrighty Roo View Post
Snitches get stitches yo
Then don't complain if people aren't treated fairly in your mind.

Last edited by gtpitch; 07-12-2012 at 12:59 PM. Reason: seriously
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Old 07-12-2012, 12:59 PM   #527
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

i don't really get why ppl make such a big deal about gimmicks.

i mean gimmicks in games usually get more scrutiny anyway, so it sorta balances with the anonymity thing. but at the end of the day, just judge the player on the game content. and if you want to just policy kill gimmicks? then w/e...

i don't feel too strongly about it either way, but if it's the only way that some ppl think they can play games anymore (or it's just something fun to try), then i'm fine with them being used bc of that.

oh and good decision on MG, mods.

/$0.02
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Old 07-12-2012, 12:59 PM   #528
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by Alrighty Roo View Post
I'm not gonna name names because I don't actually want anyone banned so I see no point but gazz isn't the only one who has just given in in a game or gone loco or angleshot or whatever and there are people who've done similar things more than once.
There are several possibilities, given that you won't specify

a) it happened prior to the fouls thread and all this stuff being formalized. If so, this is what I mean by a "reset". Stuff before the fouls thread isn't logged in it, it wasn't retroactive. Magic's issues are post fouls thread, they are logged. This is fair in that it applies to everyone

b) it happened post fouls thread and either wasn't noticed/reported or it was but mods decided that nothing beyond a PM'd warning was appropriate given the circumstance or player. This has happened at least once or twice for different things. It is not generally my policy to issue a fouls thread entry or have a thread dedicated to every small violation, especially from otherwise normally good players. There's at least one occasion as well where someone probably should have gotten a suspension but didn't because it was overlooked.

In general though, the purpose of all this is to try to make the games better, not to constantly have some ongoing drama or because I enjoy all the bureaucracy. There's definitely going to be mistakes made. I do expect though that in the long run it's all going to work out
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:00 PM   #529
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by Anarchist View Post
I have played with both soah and VR when they were using gimmicks. Are they lame?
Their gimmicks were.

I never said people that use them are lame. Don't project my argument to judging the person.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:01 PM   #530
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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which one?
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:01 PM   #531
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by Alrighty Roo View Post
I'm not gonna name names because I don't actually want anyone banned so I see no point but gazz isn't the only one who has just given in in a game or gone loco or angleshot or whatever and there are people who've done similar things more than once.

This is the passive-aggressive junk that needs to go, though. We need to know who you think is so bad, so we can have a discussion on whether or not they are really as bad as you think. That way the community-at-large will know what standards are acceptable and what aren't.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:03 PM   #532
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

6 month probation seems perfect to me

mods
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:04 PM   #533
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by gtpitch View Post
Then don't complain if people aren't treated fairly in your mind.
That was a joke ldo and I'm definitely not arguing that these people that I won't name should be brought to justice because I think that, by and large, things are taken care of appropriately when they happen so there's no point me naming people. The point is magic has been singled out and all the stuff that happened before the infractions system has been brought up. It seems silly to me that this thread was even started against one player when he served his time for the one thing he did that definitely was against rules after the infractions started.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:05 PM   #534
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by bowens View Post
This is the passive-aggressive junk that needs to go, though. We need to know who you think is so bad, so we can have a discussion on whether or not they are really as bad as you think. That way the community-at-large will know what standards are acceptable and what aren't.
It's not passive aggressive because I have no problem with those players or gazz. I am fine to let anyone in my games and play with anyone, I'm merely pointing out that gazz has been singled out for things that other people have also done.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:05 PM   #535
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

More people should be singled out, though.

Ask Karpinski.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:06 PM   #536
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by bowens View Post
This is the passive-aggressive junk that needs to go, though. We need to know who you think is so bad, so we can have a discussion on whether or not they are really as bad as you think. That way the community-at-large will know what standards are acceptable and what aren't.
always with the drama!
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:06 PM   #537
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by well named View Post
a) it happened prior to the fouls thread and all this stuff being formalized. If so, this is what I mean by a "reset". Stuff before the fouls thread isn't logged in it, it wasn't retroactive. Magic's issues are post fouls thread, they are logged. This is fair in that it applies to everyone
Other than Burn Notice (for which he was punished) and the WSOWW game (which you addressed separately in your ruling), which of magic's issues are post fouls thread?

Genuine question, because I see people dredging stuff up re magic from months and months and months ago.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:10 PM   #538
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by Alrighty Roo View Post
It's not passive aggressive because I have no problem with those players or gazz. I am fine to let anyone in my games and play with anyone, I'm merely pointing out that gazz has been singled out for things that other people have also done.
no, it's way passive aggressive. you're a pretty passive aggressive fellow in general. either grow a pair and name names or quit your bellyaching.

fwiw the way i perceive it- magic didn't do anything wrong in this particular case, but the fact that everybody wanted to string him up over nothing illuminated how unenjoyable he is to play with for most. thus it was just to take action even if it was retroactive to an extent.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:10 PM   #539
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by Gadarene View Post
Other than Burn Notice (for which he was punished) and the WSOWW game (which you addressed separately in your ruling), which of magic's issues are post fouls thread?

Genuine question, because I see people dredging stuff up re magic from months and months and months ago.
This!
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:11 PM   #540
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by Gadarene View Post
Other than Burn Notice (for which he was punished) and the WSOWW game (which you addressed separately in your ruling), which of magic's issues are post fouls thread?

Genuine question, because I see people dredging stuff up re magic from months and months and months ago.
I believe that those are the only 2 if you consider he's had issues in 4 games.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:11 PM   #541
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gadarene View Post
Other than Burn Notice (for which he was punished) and the WSOWW game (which you addressed separately in your ruling), which of magic's issues are post fouls thread?

Genuine question, because I see people dredging stuff up re magic from months and months and months ago.
well, and it may seem like I'm having it both ways here

but I should have clarified that I'm not going back to rewrite fouls for old offenses

but if a current issue comes up, there's no reason why we can't take into consideration the history of the person in question, even from a long time ago. And in fact we do, but at least for me I weight it a little less then I would, in terms of choosing how to respond, then I would if it were later. I have several reasons for that, one of which I noted before, which is that I like to tell people what's going to happen before hand.

But it's not exactly like everyone is starting from scratch, it's just that if you go read the fouls thread, yeah you could say "but X player from a year ago was worse then that and has no fouls" and I say maybe so, but it's just because we started logging when we started logging. If player X causes a problem tomorrow we may take into account the prior history, but I'm still not going to write a foul entry for it.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:13 PM   #542
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

the decree is condign I am quiescent
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:16 PM   #543
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by Henrik Sedin View Post
always with the drama!
No, it has to do with what is acceptable and not acceptable.

Apparently, the line is in question.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:17 PM   #544
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by well named View Post
well, and it may seem like I'm having it both ways here

but I should have clarified that I'm not going back to rewrite fouls for old offenses

but if a current issue comes up, there's no reason why we can't take into consideration the history of the person in question, even from a long time ago. And in fact we do, but at least for me I weight it a little less then I would, in terms of choosing how to respond, then I would if it were later. I have several reasons for that, one of which I noted before, which is that I like to tell people what's going to happen before hand.

But it's not exactly like everyone is starting from scratch, it's just that if you go read the fouls thread, yeah you could say "but X player from a year ago was worse then that and has no fouls" and I say maybe so, but it's just because we started logging when we started logging. If player X causes a problem tomorrow we may take into account the prior history, but I'm still not going to write a foul entry for it.
It does seem like you're having it both ways here. Magic has been punished for Burn Notice, and now you're punishing him for things that happened prior to the establishment of the fouls thread -- things that were already addressed and (presumably) resolved by mods at the time.

Like, what is the "current issue" you refer to above, other than Burn Notice (already punished) and the WSOWW game (which, as I said, you addressed separately in your ruling)?
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:18 PM   #545
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

the thing that sucks about pog is that people always want to try to logically debate why people who do sucky things were justified in doing so.

like mac and teddy blatantly angleshoot in burn notice and don't get modkilled because nobody can precisely align their actions with a rule violation. that's just silly to me.

i've never even played or railed any of magic's games. but based on descriptions, he's clearly detracting a lot of value to the community while adding very little. therefore, it is in pog's best interest to take some form of harsh, punitive action.

kudos to the mods for taking a very level headed approach and coming to a fair and just decision. a perma would have been a bit unfair since he does deserve a fair chance to change, and a 2 month probation would have likely been too short to inspire any change. i think they aboslutely nailed this decision.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:18 PM   #546
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by TheDean1 View Post
no, it's way passive aggressive. you're a pretty passive aggressive fellow in general. either grow a pair and name names or quit your bellyaching.

fwiw the way i perceive it- magic didn't do anything wrong in this particular case, but the fact that everybody wanted to string him up over nothing illuminated how unenjoyable he is to play with for most. thus it was just to take action even if it was retroactive to an extent.
If you realllllly want names then fine w/e.

annie has lolcatted as a villager as recently as the pixar game.
mac sometimes disappears and doesn't put much effort in. Also, burn notice.
Master has 'lost it' a bit as recently as pixar but apparently more than once.

I'm sure I could think of more given time or more knowledge of recent games but I don't see the point. None of what they did was really against the rules (except maybe master but it was due to IRL stuff so imo a modkill was punishment enough) and it's the same sort of stuff that gazz has done. I like playing with all 3 of them most of the time and see no reason to start handing out punishments and apparently, neither does anyone else which is why I think it's odd that gazz is suddenly being singled out.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:19 PM   #547
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

we need to have a betting thread on when magic reoffends.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:19 PM   #548
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by TheDean1 View Post
no, it's way passive aggressive. you're a pretty passive aggressive fellow in general. either grow a pair and name names or quit your bellyaching.
well 2 ppl who've posted on this page have rapsheets that are about as long as MG, or longer, but i don't see any witch hunt after them, for whatever reason. and why did this witch hunt take off?

that passive-aggressive enough for ya?

note: like Roo, i'm not advocating penalties against any of these ppl, but the double-standard is confusing, seems like it comes down to some kind of popularity contest

Quote:
fwiw the way i perceive it- magic didn't do anything wrong in this particular case, but the fact that everybody wanted to string him up over nothing illuminated how unenjoyable he is to play with for most. thus it was just to take action even if it was retroactive to an extent.
is he that bad? i feel like i must have played with him a few times (i can think of one for sure, but there have had to be others), but i don't recall thinking he was horrible to play with or anything. the fact that i basically have no opinion of him suggests that he can't be too terrible. idk, this all seems kinda weird and i'm not really sure where it's coming from.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:21 PM   #549
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

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Originally Posted by Henrik Sedin View Post
well 2 ppl who've posted on this page have rapsheets that are about as long as MG, or longer, but i don't see any witch hunt after them, for whatever reason. and why did this witch hunt take off?

that passive-aggressive enough for ya?

note: like Roo, i'm not advocating penalties against any of these ppl, but the double-standard is confusing, seems like it comes down to some kind of popularity contest



is he that bad? i feel like i must have played with him a few times (i can think of one for sure, but there have had to be others), but i don't recall thinking he was horrible to play with or anything. the fact that i basically have no opinion of him suggests that he can't be too terrible. idk, this all seems kinda weird and i'm not really sure where it's coming from.
All of this!
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:21 PM   #550
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Re: WW Court Version 1 - The Deliberations

i love how passive aggressive is now the slag du jour round here.

But Roo wasnt being passive aggressive.
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