bigger: I think one answer is that both states X and Y may be feasible, but a big shock going from X to Y with no plan can be really damaging economically/socially/whatever. The shock is as important as the actual details of X and Y. A lot of business relationships and economic arrangements take the current EU state of affairs for granted, and pulling the rug out from under them is really disruptive.

There's probably some reason to expect that the open trade relationships of the EU are better in general than whatever UK will end up with outside the EU also, but even if you minimize that and assume that non-EU-UK will eventually get to a good state it will be a bumpy ride.

bigger, consider what would happen if the US made Florida leave (become an independent country) without any arrangements to figure out trade arrangements, migration policies, or the taxation of mixed (presently interstate) investments

We were known as 'the sick man of Europe' and had to arrange a bailout from the IMF (shortly after we'd entered the eec, but indicative of the economic conditions that led to us joining):

Also, as wn says, the rupture of an uncontrolled transition is liable to be much write than either being in not ever having entered.

Also also, given the complexity of modern trade and supply chains, I think we're going to be tightly linked to European trade for the foreseeable future, and so being inside the tent participating in powwows is better than being outside and trying to negotiate from a more distant relationship.

Well, you are asking someone that spent most of their life in Texas (motto - we should be our own country).

Yeah, that all makes sense. Thanks.

I wish you guys luck. But, think of it this way - at least Trump isn't running the show.

Birdman you have shown to be anti semitic and won't acknowledge that saying Israel hypnotizes the world, that Jews have dual loyalty, and it's all about the benjamins are not anti semetic

I brought up Keith Ellison whi has been anti Israel but not anti semetic imo and he was the first Muslim in Congress but you're conclusion is im an islamophobe but you're not anti semetic when you bash Israel but refuse to acknowledge the atrocities of the Muslim run countries

This is mostly incoherent gibberish.

Also, whether or not I am anti-Semitic has nothing to do with you being an islamaphobe. I am not sure why your brain so consistently functions this way where you feel if you can somehow point out faults elseware in the world it somehow absolves your own wrongdoings. That is how a child thinks and no matter how many times this gets explained to you by literally every other poster itt you keep doing it and seem unable to engage on an adult level. No, the fact that Clinton was a rapist doesn’t make it ok for the GOP to appoint a rapist to the Supreme Court. No, that fact that another country does bad things doesn’t make it ok for Israel to be fascist. No, your opinion that I am anti-Semitic does nothing to justify your obvious anti-Muslim racism. Stop with the childish bull****. You are a grown man. Act like it

It appears the NRA does not own the government in New Zealand.

They are going to ban assault rifles. What an amazingly simple and logical response. Only part if the solution, obv, but positive nonetheless...

The idea here is to make sure the cops are the only ones with assault rifles?

im gonna guess that nz doesn't have a problem with cops shooting people, at least not like here in the usa *sigh*

Either way, I think ArcticKnight was trying to say it’s what the US should do

Of course it does

You are anti semetic and call out Israel because of it if course it's relevant

You grill me about Israel who i admit is not a democracy and you scream at them defending themselves but have no problems with them being bombed in the first place

And then complain that im anti Muslim as if it is a bigger crime than anti semitism

You are fooling nobody you bigot

How many of these mass shootings would be prevented if we just didn’t let white men have guns?

Are punctuation marks anti-Semitic?

Palestine is a fascist state

Israel is a flawed democracy

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huma...e_of_Palestine

“Fascism is brown people, and the more brown people there are the fascister it is”

-Metsandfinsfan

Most Israelis are brown people

You can't tell an Israeli from a Palestinian from skin color

Are you clueless?

Palestine needs to abuse human rights because Israel abuses so many human rights, right Birdman?


Didn't you say something similar about Communist press censorship a while back?

Can you imagine living in a society where your biggest complaint about the police is that you don't see enough of them?

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-z...s-in-2018.html

So are you just conceding that point...? From what I've gathered, mets has been calling you a hypocrite for calling him out for things that are similar to your own behavior, and you haven't really shown why he's wrong. What am I missing? I've admittedly been distracted by other matters while this has been taking place.

What if I told you that Arabs are also a semitic people?

No of course I’m not conceding that “point”. I’m just choosing not to indulge Mets in his game of ad hominem.

I’m not sure what you are even referring to here

That part was rhetorical. But could you humor me and address the broader point of my post? Perhaps it's obvious to you why mets is wrong on this, but the dots aren't connecting on their own for me.

Mets view seems to be that any criticism of Israel is anti-Semitic. I think that is ridiculous and will assume you do as I continue this post. However, if you believe even that needs addressing we can start there.

Now Mets won’t openly state this view. He disguised it as something else to make it seem less stupid. In this case what he seems to be basing his accusations of anti-Semitism on is that since I criticize Israel for the awful things it does but ignore bad things Palestine does that Mets imagines are equivalent.

Now I feel like most sane people understand that Israel and Palestine are not equivalent actors in this situation (if their actions could even be called comparable which they can’t). And once you acknowledge that the basis of Mets disguised anti-Semitic accusations fall apart.

So either
1) you beleive I have misrepresented Mets accusations in which case maybe explain them to me as you think they need addressing
2) you think Palestine and Israel are equally deserving of criticism and thus Mets makes a reasonable case with his accusations