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Old Today, 12:34 AM   #6326
iamnotawerewolf
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Re: POG Politics Thread

The watch-word is Involvement.

The bystander effect is real.
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Old Today, 12:45 AM   #6327
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Re: POG Politics Thread

I’m so glad Mets came back to flood this thread with racist ignorant DUMB AF musings.

I wonder why only the ****ty district wants you to teach, dildo...
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Old Today, 12:45 AM   #6328
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Re: POG Politics Thread

Nj assessments are computer based no scantron necessary

I agree again but teacher assessments are objective
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Old Today, 12:47 AM   #6329
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Re: POG Politics Thread

Nice examples btw for what constitutes “bad parents”.

Racist sexist garbage, all of it. The rest of it is voting for Oprah level stupidity.
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Old Today, 12:59 AM   #6330
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Re: POG Politics Thread

Iam

I agree that there are much better ways of teaching than having to worry about a statewide test

I agree punishing poorer districts for poor performance is unfair

Nyc tried school choice which helped some students but the ways they choose who gets into what school isn't really equitable either

I agree that maybe all schools should have the same resources, and that would have to be distributed federally possibly. Most schools are trying to be one to one with either a chrome book or ipad but obviously some districts cannot afford to be and that is unfair

And since schools are mandated and one part of our government that most people agree with being socialized, it should be more equitable for all. So yes a complete overhaul of how taxes relate to schools is needed but i can't realistically ever see it happen
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Old Today, 01:08 AM   #6331
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Re: POG Politics Thread

On a change of topic, id like to see trump condemn this saudi Arabian attack that killed the kids with a missile we allegedely sold them.
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Old Today, 01:58 AM   #6332
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Re: POG Politics Thread

I like how the unofficial foreign policy of the US is to just say "whoops" after a certain time has passed and a uniquely ****ty thing has been done. Can we stop pretending that any American gives a **** about 40 children dying as long as they vote in people who actively support and participate in embargoes and blockades that have resulted in 100,000+ children dying of famine, 500,000+ people having cholera, 80% of Yemeni population lacking vital supplies for survival, millions having been displaced. Maybe if all of this went down on the Mexican-US border then at least the Democrats would give a ****, sucks for Yemen to be god knows where, probably near some other countries filled with brown people.
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Old Today, 03:48 AM   #6333
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Re: POG Politics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by eyebooger View Post
Okay, let's make this work. How about we SIGNIFICANTLY increase teacher pay?

Studies show that other countries are better at this.

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/brown...und-the-world/

How about we dump a ton of money into education?



He did, but I think he went about it the wrong way. Pretty much everyone now regards NCLB as a failure.



Gut reaction tells me this is wrong. Do you have any data or logical rationale for this belief?



I'd posit that schools should not be funded by property tax. It perpetuates the cycle of poor area -> ****ty school



I don't pretend to have all the answers either, but I think everything I said is reasonable enough to consider.
all of this
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Old Today, 04:09 AM   #6334
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Re: POG Politics Thread

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Originally Posted by iamnotawerewolf View Post
I don't think teachers need more money; I think schools need more resources.

I would rather a teacher work because they love the job than because they can get more for it.


Of course, teachers do deserve more money.
giving schools more resources rather than raising teacher pay means spending more on administrative bull****

in the countries that outperform us, teachers are paid better and the profession is more respected

education majors come from the lowest performers on the SATs (check out these charts

maybe that has more to do with education just being a stupid major (the best teachers probably have degrees in what they teach rather than education), but I think a big part of the problem with education in the US is the low prestige and respect given to teachers

raising pay would make it more competitive and seems to me to be the simplest and surest way to raise the quality of teachers

I would hope people who become teachers would do it for reasons other than money too, but you could say the same thing for doctors, etc.
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Old Today, 04:11 AM   #6335
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Re: POG Politics Thread

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Originally Posted by Birdman10687 View Post
Also, excuse me, what the ****. Are we seriously arguing over the purpose of the law? Give me a break. Like any of us can know the "purpose" of even if we did like it would matter.



What matters it the effect of the law


I agree with you, mostly, but unless Iím misremembering isnít the US (supreme?) courtĎs ruling on the latest iteration of the muslim coincidentally impacts only Muslim countries ban that itís not unconstitutional because it doesnít explicitly say itís targeting Muslim countries.
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Old Today, 05:17 AM   #6336
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POG Politics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by metsandfinsfan View Post
On a change of topic, id like to see trump condemn this saudi Arabian attack that killed the kids with a missile we allegedely sold them.


Or maybe we could go further?

On the one hand:
Source of radical terrorist ideology and 9/11 participants
Deeply misogynist state
Prosecuting a war that is causing a massive humanitarian crisis.

On the other:
Buy a lot of arms
Oil
Dat glowing orb.
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Old Today, 07:55 AM   #6337
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Re: POG Politics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by metsandfinsfan View Post
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer...-the-data.html

Long iskand ny generally has excellent schools,

Probably because it has some of the highest paying districts

And obviously one of the highest paying property taxes



I do wish we could revamp the system. But it still might not help

Im a likel candidate to get a job in a low performing district near me. The demographic is 100% minority. The high school had shootings. The state got involved, oversee more of it. The test data improved slightly since the state got involved but it's still really low

Ive done 2 interviews and a demo lesson, and my references have told me they've been contacted. One reference, my mentor this past year says she gives me so much credit to even apply in this district, she wouldn't.

I hope to get the job. It pays about the same as others, and i enjoy teaching low performing students and hope to help them. That's why i loved running the learning center for a few years. I also have had other interviews but haven't gotten anything else. I have a leave of absence job from Sept to feb already as a backup plan

What would make a teacher want to teach in this district over another? 30% more pay than better performing districts? Would that make sense?

I don't know how to fix the problem

It could be bad teachers in bad districts

Bad supplies

Some of it is "bad parents"

By that i mean single working parents, parents never home, parents not speaking english, parents not checking kids homework because they raise 8 kids and have 3 jobs

And i don't know the solution to that either

------'

So yes we need to find ways to improve districts with poor performance. Some states have been shutting down poor performing schools and replace them with charter schools.

The idea of charter schools would be good but charter school teachers generally are expected to work more hours and more days for less pay so it's hard to get the quality you'd want

The idea of nclb requiring standards was good. Passing every kid isn't. Working hard to help every kid pass is.
Jesus wept, YOU are going to be a teacher?
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Old Today, 07:58 AM   #6338
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Re: POG Politics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by eyebooger View Post
Okay, let's make this work. How about we SIGNIFICANTLY increase teacher pay?

Studies show that other countries are better at this.

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/brown...und-the-world/

How about we dump a ton of money into education?
Wtf, who wrote this article? They need to learn to write better.
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Old Today, 08:07 AM   #6339
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Re: POG Politics Thread

My anecdotes from teachers are they are over educated and under trained and put in way too much time and money before knowing if teaching is actually for them.

Teaching can be either a great gig or terrible depending where you land a job and how much effort you put in. There isn't much upward mobility, as well.

I feel like teachers have decent prestige here? Everyone I know loves teachers.
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Old Today, 08:11 AM   #6340
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Re: POG Politics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by iamnotawerewolf View Post
Mets, you should know better than maybe anyone else itt about "teaching the tests" and the associated opportunity costs of engaging student creativity.
Teaching the tests always seemed like overblown rhetoric to me. Why is it bad, exactly? Is it just a matter of poorly written tests?
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Old Today, 08:17 AM   #6341
soah
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Re: POG Politics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossnerd View Post
Iím so glad Mets came back to flood this thread with racist ignorant DUMB AF musings.

I wonder why only the ****ty district wants you to teach, dildo...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossnerd View Post
Nice examples btw for what constitutes ďbad parentsĒ.

Racist sexist garbage, all of it. The rest of it is voting for Oprah level stupidity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by master3004 View Post
Jesus wept, YOU are going to be a teacher?
These posts are out of line.
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Old Today, 08:41 AM   #6342
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Re: POG Politics Thread

My take with regards to teaching is that it's an easily replaceable job where you are virtually guaranteed a position for life. Over here every major party picks out their darlings for each election, one takes medical workers, the other firefighters/police, one teachers etc. It's just a game of musical chairs and usually your pay raise will come at the expense of the others. Someone like nurses seem way more important to me but for some reason it's kinda taboo to have preferences among these groups. Their pay in the public sector is very similar despite the vast differences in job difficulty, responsibility and demand.

I think there's a fair bit of nostalgia in the positions that prioritize taking care of teachers first and that's why it's kind of a populist issue as mentioned earlier. Almost everyone has had teachers that were very good at their job and became to be a big part of shaping them. Thing is that for each of these cases, there are absolutely horrible teachers that will be able to be horrible for the rest of their lives. I've never heard of a teacher getting fired for being sort of a bad teacher in general. I think there needs to be a bigger part for feedback from children. If you could achieve a system where every teacher is mostly liked by their kids then I'd be okay with doubling their pay(or change the order and double fist if that's what's going to happen and then see how big the benefits are in a couple of decades). Every other quality like how big of an expert they are in their field should take a backseat and should not serve as an excuse for being a ****ty human being.
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Old Today, 09:11 AM   #6343
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Re: POG Politics Thread

I would say before you want to talk about any type of education reform you need to actually understand (or develop your own) goal for the education system. What is/what should the purpose of the education system be?
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Old Today, 09:37 AM   #6344
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Re: POG Politics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by pwnsall View Post
Teaching the tests always seemed like overblown rhetoric to me. Why is it bad, exactly? Is it just a matter of poorly written tests?
The processes of reading a narrative, writing a report, presenting to a group, engaging in discussion - these are skills that carry over across professions and create generally useful social beings.

Factual knowledge is important too, but frankly most of it is forgotten if not used (and the information is too broad for it all to be used), and if one learns how to learn then one can learn whatever factual knowledge one needs.

Teaching the tests prepares students for the exam by practicing examination strategies and drilling exam-style questions, which is not the type of scenario one generally has to deal with in life - "you have 45 minutes, solve as many of these multiple-choice math problems as you can... GO"



this is leaving aside issues with cultural biases within the test questions and other issues like testing conditions and social pressure/apathy

Last edited by iamnotawerewolf; Today at 09:46 AM.
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Old Today, 09:38 AM   #6345
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Re: POG Politics Thread

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Originally Posted by Birdman10687 View Post
I would say before you want to talk about any type of education reform you need to actually understand (or develop your own) goal for the education system. What is/what should the purpose of the education system be?
proposed: the creation of socially useful beings
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Old Today, 09:53 AM   #6346
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Re: POG Politics Thread

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Originally Posted by Sun Tzu View Post
giving schools more resources rather than raising teacher pay means spending more on administrative bull****
"more resources" does not mean administrative pay bumps

it means expanded facilities and faculty lists for smaller class sizes and less cramped classrooms; it means supplies for students who don't have to share textbooks or worry about mom & dad buying them all of the paper, pencils, calculators, etc for the year; it means field trips to immersive learning environments; it means quality nutrition at meal time; it means adequate campus security; it means guest speakers; it means recreational opportunities ...
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Old Today, 10:19 AM   #6347
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Re: POG Politics Thread

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Originally Posted by soah View Post
These posts are out of line.
Can you please not repost posts that are out of line so i don't have to read them. Thank you
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Old Today, 10:21 AM   #6348
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Re: POG Politics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by iamnotawerewolf View Post
proposed: the creation of socially useful beings
I believe that is currently the purpose of middle school
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Old Today, 10:52 AM   #6349
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Re: POG Politics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by iamnotawerewolf View Post
proposed: the creation of socially useful beings
I more or less agree. But Iím curious to what you mean by socially useful.
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