I agree with Dwetzel except in my experience random people think it's takeout and it's only better or more experienced players who know that the "standard" meaning is penalty (if that makes any sense lol).

I think penalty is really awesome. Some analagous spots are

1m p 1M p 1N p p X = penalty showing the M bid on your right

1m (1M) p (1N) p (p) X = trap pass of the overcall.

I even like 1m p 1M p 1N X to be penalty (implying the minor that was opened) but the standard meaning by far there is definitely takeout of the major bid eg 4144 with an opening hand.

In this sequence you must ask yourself: what can I have that did not double in the first round and is making a take out double now? You will struggle to find an answer, hence it is better to play this double as 100% business.

In general, if you run a simulation of hands that dbl here and 90% doubles for business, then it is a good idea to make it 100% business in your system and with the other 10% you either pass two times or bid the first round.

In situations where both a penalty pass and take out double scenario are possible, I like the two way double, as noted before by the great DWetzel. It is noted that if your are in the position to pass out the auction and it is MP, it will tend to be more often some indiscrete attempt to fight the partscore, while in direct position it will less often be that.

A good meta-rule for doubles, which you'll occasionally wish you weren't using but which will save you headaches in the long run, covers this and many analogous situations: If it was possible to double for takeout on a previous round and you passed, then you cannot double for takeout of the same suit or suits now. (Note that here, "takeout" applies not just to a direct takeout double by intervenor, but to any double that is usually for takeout and that denies interest in the suit(s) opponents have bid). This will usually mean that a delayed double becomes penalty.

There may be exceptions you would want to use, I don't know. And note that the situation changes when opps have bid another suit between your first opportunity to double and your second; the metarule doesn't apply then.

Yeah for me, dbl is a good hand with hearts. Balancing here can be on a 4 card suit, especially at MP.

Agree, though I'd note that this is a prime example of what Lawrence would call "safe" versus "dangerous" suits to overcall in the auction. Lawrence's books are great and I'd say teach how to think about bridge concepts better than anyone else I've ever read, as opposed to telling you what to do with Hand X or Hand Y.

After, say, 1H-P-1NT-P, P - ?

the 1NT bidder might have clubs, they might have diamonds, but they won't have spades. Spades are a very "safe" suit to get frisky with (opener MIGHT have four, but probably won't, and certainly won't have five). Clubs and diamonds are not safe at all; you would potentially bid 1NT here with either Qxx xx KJTxx Jxx or Qxx xx Jxx KJTxx.

Knowing which suits are safe to get silly with (here, balancing with four nice spades or five crappy ones is pretty normal, and I haven't told you about your other cards) is a really really useful skill in terms of thinking about bridge.

Good point about the safe suits, and you're right that this is a good example auction for it. On this auction responder has 0–3 spades and 0–2 hearts, while opener will average a bit over 5 hearts and about 3 spades. That means the bad guys will average about 14 minor suit cards between them, so picking a minor is dangerous because even of your suit is good, partner will usually have very few, while by contrast if you don't have long spades, you can be fairly confident partner does. (That doesn't make a 2S bid automatic here, obviously, but it's definitely a reason to be aggressive about bidding them.)

An extreme example: KQJ Ax xxxxx Ax. In second seat we hear (H) P – (1NT) P; (P) and need to decide whether to pass it out. The answer is no. Partner didn't overcall his spades (which he has) because they stink, as does his hand. If we had a double available we would use it, but per the meta-rule, double is penalty oriented. I would chance a 2S bid, unless I were playing with a partner who wouldn't realize that he shouldn't get excited about his five-card "support".

if there isn't a chapter in "Why You Lose at Bridge" on stuff like this, obviously there should be. partner may or may not have spades, but he definitely has hearts, and your hand might be pretty great defending 1NT on a spade lead anyway

I should correct myself; partner might not definitely have hearts. But if he doesn't have hearts, ask yourself "what score are they likely to make with hearts as trumps" vs "what score are they likely to get in 1NT with partner leading a spade"

Don't try this at home or at all.

opener opened 1H on

Axxx
QJxxx
Kx
Qx

and passed 1NT

Responder choose to bid 1NT with:

Txxx
Jx
QTx
KJTx

because he thought he needed to play 1NT and not partner.

and you overcalled 2S and found the 3-2 fit.

So curious...world championships of some sorts have been going on. But for whatever godawful reason the only way to watch them are on a chinese bridge site. Normally I would be watching as much as possible, but have not watched any of the action so far since it isn't on BBO. Am I the only one?

BBO is showing tables 2,4,6. Chinese site ourgames (garbage piece of ****) gets tables 1,3,5.

I watched some on both sites last night. BBO vastly superior

johnnykran

Yeah, they played really well vs. Monaco...

wacky hand from regionals earlier

Playing MP NV vs V I pick up this hand as dealer

-
T98743
6
K98754

I decide to open it 2H, thinking I might bid again to show my clubs if the the opportunity presents itself (mahmood style)

auction proceeds

2H (P) P (X)
P (2S) 3H (3S)
4H (4S) P (P)
5C (P) 5H (P)
P (X) P (P)

Before any card is led the player on my right (almost yelling) begins to tell me that I should not keep bidding after a preempt. -Cut off by my partner, saying the same thing (looking incredulous). I reply something like, can we please save the comments til after the hand is played. Ace of Clubs is led immediately, but from the wrong side of the table and director is called. I decide to accept the lead, letting my hand become the dummy and partner play the hand.

The entire table (besides me) is dumbfounded when 5H is cold (the penalty didn't matter). Lots of questionable decisions on this auction but not one anyone at the table will soon forget.


N/S

-
T98743
6
K98754

J862
AJ2
AT93
Q3


EW

AQ94
Q5
KQ52
A62

KT753
K6
J874
JT

4S was also making



As a side note, does anyone think I should not accept the lead and take one of the other options?

Definitely not cool
Definitely not cool

Accepting Ac looks correct

Goldwater's rule* says take the AC lead

I wouldn't have opened 2H with that hand (I'd like, you know, a card with a letter on it), but I accept it CAN work out. Probably 4C instead of 4H so you can clue partner in there though -- taking the 5C save on your own is a bad idea, partner could be about to wrap a tire iron around 4S.

*

LOL

Seems the players at your table are living in a box and not thinking outside of it. I think opening 2H if it shows a weak two is totally fine with this hand. But after 2H gets doubled in the outpass, I would have bid 3C.

The pass of your partner over 2H is incorrect imo, he needs to bid 3H. Basically you can never pass with 3 in partner's suit, you are protected by the law. With two neat aces, it is even more obvious. Why allow opponents to bid 3c or so?

After 3S definitely bid 4C. If partner is not braindead, he will know his lack of spade values, two red aces, three trumps and Qc are all excellent values for playing.

if I have a 6/6 and partner voluntarily supports one of my suits I do not expect to defend the hand.

If your partner is yelling at you/lecturing you during an event, he should no longer be your partner. Find one with better partnership skills.

The only time I will bring something up with my partner during the course of play is if it is an egregious system mistake that needs to be corrected before we continue.

Partner was very pleasant overall, it was a rare slipup.

Though I was not amused by a postmortem playing teams today. We bid to 6h missing 2 aces. After I bid jacoby 2n she bid 4c with a 2524 14 Count (Clubs were something like at9x).

Of course, I had qjx in clubs, and no dime honors so keycard was automatic. After I got the bad news with 5s though there was no escape. But after the hand I was advised its never a good idea to keycard with a 'worthless doubleton' in diamonds. Luckily I had a few minutes to take a break and walk it off, because I was fuming.

edit: 3rd loser was offside K of clubs

Well this time your partner was right heh

my hand was something like

KQT9 KJTx xx QJx

That is not a maximum hand without any aces, so quickly bid 4H after 4C, also showing your leak in diamonds.

And even if you alter the hand to make it better, you can always bid 4S to illustrate that you have a diamond issue. Partner's allowed to be 1525 on this auction, so keycard is poor.