I realize I haven't spoken about Riki at all yet. Unless I mentioned the last paragraph in a D1-post already.

In a vacuum, I find them to be very green. Almost as green as Banks. EoD-behaviour-wise also, only thing that slightly nags me is the consolidating because of aids -comment. But that could just be another pet peeve of mine.

Me and Riki have played before, and I've also seen Riki play in game/s I've GMd. Back during that time, I actually established a difference between his Scum- and Town-play -- IIRC I noticed that as Scum he starts the game much more sharply and provides much more accurate, even "spot-on" analysis, whereas as Town he starts more "softly", perhaps even "lazily" is the right word. (Ironically, the first time I got to use this analysis in a game was the game where Riki saw me as Mafia. Whiteknight'd him with it IIRC.)

Could've changed ofc but it's another slight nag for me that if my recollection is correct, this game would probably fit the Scum-meta bill better.

The relevant question here is, would TMI (too much information) have affected MSU in a submissive manner? Meaning did the Scumteam go into N1 thinking "man, Mafia!Ratchet's gonna be screwed come D2", not foreseeing that much of the suspicion is going to dissipate?

Could picking cue as the Seer Hunt -target also have had to do with the possibility of that alleviating some suspicions towards Ratchet? After it's revealed that it was a TOWNIE who cast the saving Vote?

So you feel hes more apt to be scum than villa based on meta and kinda haven't talked about him. Thats pretty weird bro.

How long ago was this?

Nah Riki's green in my books, just felt like saying Things about him.

Not sure. 8-9 months, maybe? Can check if that's relevant IYO, but since it's a Long Time ago I'm not sure it's important.

Which may usually make sense, but cue switched back to me at the end, and in what can only be described as a brush with a bullet for me, missed out by mere seconds. So I can't exactly say "look, it was a townie who saved me" when he clearly had some conflict there and he didn't save me for any reason I could reasonably use to defend myself.

@Banks I feel like I had to come out defending here, as I would rather not repeat the events of end of day 1 in day 2. As for replying to every point, thats kinda just what I do.

Dorian's TL; DR for the day so far. Each group in no particular order.

Top half: fontisian, Riki, Slendy, bhuber, Banks

Bottom half: road, MSU, Doc, Achromatic, Ratchet

Of the top 3 I said I'd shoot, Ratchet and road both already have votes. Let's bring the third into the mix too so we don't forget about him and he hopefully finds a little more reason/time to contribute.

DocEspana

within the year interesting. Might be useful

Have you linked games you have played previously? From both alignments?

So you have this plethora of information at your finger tips. i would love to see a list from you.

Also Doc, I pegged you as Town D1 due to the confidence you were brimming with. This is the time when I wait to see that it wasn't just an act -- a MIA-Mafioso would make a lot of sense at this point, and you'd fit the bill perfectly.

Ratchet - I'd like your thoughts on why cue was killed and who you think might have stood to benefit from that choice.

This thing I'm doing is taking a ****ing long time at work.

Yeah the White Knighting I mentioned happened last October.

Any thoughts on how (im)plausibly Mafia!MSU busses Mafia!Ratchet?

Not yet, although I have offered a few times. I'll keep it within the last year and a bit.

Town -
https://www.opbforums.com/forums/sho...45-Game-Thread
https://www.opbforums.com/forums/sho...43-Game-Thread
http://orojackson.com/threads/mafia-...-ant-arc.3492/

Mafia -
https://www.opbforums.com/forums/sho...47-Game-Thread
https://www.opbforums.com/forums/sho...42-Game-Thread
http://orojackson.com/threads/mafia-...appiness.3353/

I'm not going to have the time to go into full detail, but here's my list:

Town -
Banks
Riki
Fonti
Dorian

Scum -
Slendy
MSU
Achro

Rest being null. Slight lean scum on Doc, but I'd rather see more from him first.

Now, I can only really answer this from what would make sense to me. I think Cue was killed because of his style of play, he was never going to be an easy lynch to push despite being in the running and for that reason I think scum didn't want him to grow into the game and hurt them. Who stands to benefit? Well, Slendy/Achro initially, because of the idea that was pushed there, but other than those I think a large part of the kill is that it doesn't really benefit anyone in particular. It's entirely possible that this is completely wrong, but I couldn't work out cue's angle, and I am struggling to see how anyone would look at the kill and think "yeah, he might benefit us here or he might do this there". I think it was a really strong kill for Night 1, given the circumstances, and that's about all I have to offer on this issue.

Based on a reaaaaaally quick skim at random parts of games, I'd say it's possible Mafia!Ratchet tries to appeal to emotion more than Town!Ratchet, who seems much 'cooler' (except when they're annoyed by someone being ignorant in their opinion). Probably Town here if the hypothesis is correct.

Allllso yeah the more I think about it the more implausible it seems that Mafia!Ratchet would 1) tunnel on me--Achro and 2) be so woefully ignorant of the Seer Hunt Kill -aspect, unless the entire Scumteam shared the ignorance in which case the cue-hit was a brilliant stroke of luck for them, as it seems to ONLY make sense as a SHK.

Plus the responses have seemed consistent and the "attacking every point" -defense smells of Town!indignance.

All aboard the MSU-wagon! Choo choo!

Lets here some expansion when you get a chance.

I don't remember what it was a response to and will have to look it up.

Yes, after re-reading them this morning, I was swayed. During the EOD, I wanted to see Ratchet's body vs. Smartbomb BECAUSE Ratchet would have given me insight in the people who followed you vs. those who chose door number 3. Lemme explain.

Smartbomb kinda came out of no where (for me, in the moment, during EOD) and those voting for non-Ratchet seemed desperate to keep it off Ratchet, TBH.

What I saw was....so no one is voting for Cue, Slendy is doing a good job defending himself, no one is moving to Dorian...let's try Smartbomb because Bomb isn't defending himself (very well) right now. Hell, I almost switched to Bomb but decided to stick to my guns (I think because I really just wanted to see how Ratchet would flip). You turned on Ratchet when the guns were on you - out of everyone (including me), you went to him.

It was a little awesome and made me think you are Town because scum could have turned it back on me or Cue who I think would have been lynched. But you went after Ratchet - and i wanted to see it.

Hence, I am sad that Ratchet wasn't lynched because I wanted to know more about you and those who decided to follow you.

(especially since I think 3 of us were voting for you before you came on - except Cue who kept switching? Would have to go and see her voting pattern).

Make sense?

in his post above the one you quoted, he says that he hasn't finished posting his thoughts because he's busy at work

but anyway, more importantly, why do these things make him mafia iyo?

like these don't really seem like real reasons imo

I say what I feel, Ratchet. the more I think about it, the more scummy you become.

It's not personal, it's just mafia.

Oh if ratchet is scum and MSU thinks he is going down today for sure then busing makes a lot of sense. I am not sure I see that connection based on the EoD voting.

3 town:
bhuber
fonti
slendy

it was pretty close between slendy and banks for the last spot, i ended up giving it to slendy because his reads are really similar to mine afaict

3 mafia:
doc
msu
road

i think doc getting zero mention at eod is pretty sketchy, he also hasn't really done anything yet this game. i don't really like you going so hard at ratchet today after saying you were only lynching him for information yesterday, i also thought you made pretty good, coherent points in your game especially starting on day 2 and you haven't really started doing that today imo. road has kind of just been like floating through this game, idk

would save bhuber and shoot doc

MSU's Vote on Ratchet should probably be considered the critical one. Broke the three-way tie and gave the lead to the R-wagon IIRC. That Vote being a bus would be either an overreaction or a SUPER ballsy play -- so probably not knowingly co-aligned.

also i think there was a solid 1-2 months between the mafia and town games and i already changed how i played a bit by the town game

like iirc, in my mafia game i was still posting with proper grammar and stuff