i wrote why i’m voting you on post #883

it’s true i discredited tehbank’s case on you but that doesn’t mean i have to think you are villager, it’s just i didn’t agree with some of his points

and i said "agree" to pizza to lynch abaham, that’s a bit more complicated, it was very long time to end of day and at that time i was indeed voting you while actually thinking abaham was more wolfy, i just did it for no particular reason to see what would happen i guess, anyway i don’t no longer think abaham is wolf

Has Adaham been an easy to lynch choice? Because my vote is half of his current votes.

If you want to apply "easy to lynch" logic to any wagon, I think you should look at the Road wagon - which you are on.

You are right and that is fair.

We have different reads. That happens. You could be scum but I'm not going to call you scummy simply for approaching the game differently from me.

You don't have to like my choice. I'm the one that will have to answer for it or own it. As far as progression goes? It's hard to progress on someone you are begging for interaction from that refuses to interact with you. Don't know how much progression I can make from that. And sorry, but this isn't an election. Having a minority opinion doesn't mean I'm wrong.

Mr capps:

He stars of with a lot of posts with little to no real content. He comments a little on Adaham and is pressuring q_q a little but mostly t just fluffs and so on. also he choosed to spend effort in finding a video of him playing a video game mafia with no sound, when i asked if he could link to some of his games (he explained too that they were behind paywalls though). I mean dafuq?

So like a lot of fluff in beginning.

Also he states early on that he doesnt like people who are syaing one thing is bad and doing the same thing hypocrites (referring to q_q). however in post #335 he states he doesnt want to talk to pizzaguy as he trusts himm At that time pizzaguy really havent posted anything useful - and actually he have been a hypocrite himself by showing "forced aggression" vs dgz and the us/we-thing. That statement from capps are so weird regardless of pizzaguys role

Also as someone else mentioned (Turnip or banks?) the postings from #366 and forward about who the most dangerous player was is like communicating to his team of wolves - i cant find a single reason to discuss this as a villager but more reason for the wolves.

And finally i just agree with everything dgz wrote in his case on capps.

I believe capps is often a wolf/scum here

Yes, adaham has been the easy wagon. A bunch of people have been putting tons of pressure on him, he is being obnoxious and asking to be killed, it looks like the 'safe' choice for a scum to be in and go unnoticed because **** him. Road's votes are mine that I haven't once explained (seriously), Pizza's that he came there not because he thought Road was scummy but due to crossing the other names out, and capps who I dont trust. There is nothing in the road wagon that spells easy.

Okay, so did I miss the short time window adaham was going to be here, or is he coming back?

The thing on capps is that as much as i want to kill the **** out of him he has a peek and it is a bad play to start Day 1 lynch with going against that. I think day has been hugely productive and I am not afraid to look elsewhere for today.

I agree with you. But I didn't have anything else to work with so all I could do was make assumptions based on stuff you HAD said in the thread.

You did it for "no particular reason?" I'm confused.

Yeah. I have no idea how I missed this.[/quote]
Does it make sense to you now?
Conversely, what's the Town motivation to obstructing someone's scumhunting process? I actually did respond to this already when I said that the motivation is to slow down the game, make reads difficult, and make the village a generally unpleasant place to be. And THAT is a pro Wolf environment.

See above. I don't think it's neutral at all.

What? What did I say was villagery and call you a wolf for? The attention thing?

I disagree strongly with the conclusion you believe my thought process should have lead to. Rather than stating my thoughts, because I don't think that will be as impact full for you, let me ask you a question; do you assume that wolves in this environment, with players that we have to assume have experience and competence enough to have been chosen, would have a tough time handling attention?

I think you can guess, but I do not. I have absolutely "Town lead" as wolf and I have absolutely fake claimed Miller in my first post as wolf and I have absolutely no doubts that the players here would be just as fearless in a wolf role.

he said cya. not. I doubt it, but maybe his sub is? I dont think they will find a sub this fast so dont hold your breath.

that’s dumb reason to not lynch someone, any wolf can have a "peek"

ok cool yates

By this logic I should have zero votes, then. I don't know if I subscribe to that.

askthepizzaguy


first of all i might actually just have a totally different style and then reading him wrong in every possible way. However i find him scummy for several reasons:

- His intro is just as scummy as they get. He knows that. Why would a villager do this? Weird intros are more often a wolf than the random %.

- His interaction with dgz is just pure fluff and seems extremely weird.

- He is way too confident in his initial reads and seems like he don't reconsider being wrong (or well he actually states late that he is still confident about his villa-leans, but not that much about his scum-leans - but only after it has been pointed out he seems to confident)

- He is seeking weird discussions and posting a lot and just makes it a lot harder to actually do some analysing and real work. Also the way he is trying to induce interactions are not something I find specially fruitful til analyse on.

But at the same time he actually have some kind of villagery posts, like thinking in non-possible w/w combis including himself. It is like a way of clearing himself if i turn out to pe a wolf (which he doesnt know as a villager that im not). If he was a wolf i would think it is just a weird post.

hmm. actually i would probably put him in the neutral box leaning wolfy.

So my biggest scumread is mr capps.
I would like to see either pizzaguy, Soneji or Hibiki in the last wagon

voting two people in same post road that’s not gonna work out

road is actually such a villager that’d be pretty elite wolfing

Ignoring the rest of your case for a minute:
This is quite clearly a play style thing. Even if Pizza is a wolf, it isn't for this reason. Hyperbole is a null tell.

capps

who peeked you i missed this

and @ q_q if scum peeked another scum that will be 2/3 scum down the drain in the following days and that is a favourable trade for town so I am perfectly fine with that.

that doesn’t make sense to me, why would it be 2/3 scum down the drain?

scenario a, scum pizza peeking scum capps

scenario b, scum pizza peeking town capps

if a happens, it will be 2 scum down the drain

if b happens capps is a mislynch regardless of if we kill him today or in the future days.

Turnip:

I see!

which reminds me, when will Turnip forwhat come out to play?

how about

scenario c, town pizza peeking wolf capps

that’s what i don’t understand, any villager could have peeked a wolf you’re acting like if that happens then the person will automatically get lynched

I got the general gist of what he was saying before he left.

A lot of what he's saying is stuff I agree with. My experience when I first started on 2+2 was generally identical to how Adaham reacted to this game so far. And the first champions series, basically the same.

I don't necessarily agree with how he's saying it, or his particular style. Styles clash, it's not a big deal. I've heard worse about me before.

I don't put a whole lot of stock in the idea that we're all champions, we're just the popular kids from wherever we come from and had a decent run in several games. But one would think if you sign up to something like this, and it's out of your comfort zone, your first instinct shouldn't be to abandon ship especially if you've been around since before even I started playing. Even if you get voted, even if you are having trouble keeping up on day one. Even if you aren't meshing with the other players.

Surely these are not novel experiences after this many years.

Snap judgments about the *quality* of the other players after half of a day one also strike me. Unless you know for a fact that most of the wolves are under zero pressure right now, and that we're largely at one another's throats, there's no reason to judge village so poorly at the moment.

And, if the wolves are the ones running the show, and not getting punished for it, that makes them excellent players.

So, a lot to disagree with as well.

The best thing to do with Adaham's slot, whether he replaces in or out, is potentially to burn a peek. Everything so far, since being accused, seems to be for the purpose of defending / obstructing / complaining, which is not necessarily wolfy, but it's also something that isn't solving, and an easy corner to go rest in when you're not making the impact you want to as a wolf.

In this way, either Adaham or the person replacing in will have the following going for them: either they will eat a murder instead of a lynch, which greatly improves the impact they have had on the game, or they will be a peeked wolf which means it won't be difficult to lynch this person in spite of their smokescreen, or they will be a peeked innocent and no longer will they have to defend, it can be pure attack from then onward.

Given that the guy has been playing since 2006, and how the game will get quieter as folks such as myself and other top posters are lynched, murdered, or peeked and thus removed before endgame, Adaham should be able to reach a point where he can keep up, if he remains in the game.

That's the best thing I can say to approach his situation- with only 10 villagers you can't afford to write off any villager slot as not needed or not having value, regardless of whether or not they're currently meshing with the game.

I can certainly understand why he can't be bothered with the game if it's not fun, and I can also understand why he doesn't feel the need to establish himself here. No one really needs to. But if he's a villager he becomes a mislynch at some point at this rate, and we only get a few of those, so if he's tapping out I would like to figure out a way to improve the situation.

What I won't do is alter how I'm playing- that is the one thing you be upset about and I won't budge. I have every right to be here.

+1

If I'm a vanilla villager then my seer cover is already blown and capps is therefore skating.

That's all I can say about that. But I am the seer so he's good.

It appears you missed him.

He claims he is replacing out now because we are all big meanies and a clique/secret society he is not a member of. Also, he can't keep up with the volume - which is at least conceivable.