This is a terrible, horrible mischaracterisation of the game state. You've managed to say terribly little in many words here my friend.

Where did I buddy to anyone?

The "overdefend" accusation is a bit odd. People mention me, I respond, see where it goes.

I'm seeing that from several people. Fluff posts abound!

Heaping praise = buddying, to me.

Many townies ignore slight mentions of their name - sometimes looking for reactions (Who would dare sheep that vote, for example)....but you pop up to defend every hint of your name.

Heaping praise? On who?

I just reviewed my own posts. I defended exactly twice, two posts, one for Mastin and one for Angry that clarified something I had said. I did not even respond at all to Murska first finding suspicion and then voting me. Hours later I did wonder why I still had two votes and nobody challenging me.

You have a strange definition of overdefending. I still want to see all the praise you allege I heaped.

If you are wolf, that was a pretty lame attempt. If you are village, I have no idea what you are thinking.

You're going to sit here and tell me all these votes for people are legit? Not hardly. We're still in Random Voting Stage for sure. At BEST you can claim that some people are lurker hunting.

And my posts say a lot more than you think it does.

K thanks you're town then.

binkles is very town. What are these votes.

I'm glad the attention has moved away from me.

After reading through all of these posts I think I've come to the conclusion that this is going to an unbearable game to read through.

At work, I'm behind like 8 pages. I'll get to this over lunch I think.

Well that's just stupid. You're going into the game with a huge disadvantage because you're assuming that everyone will act and play the same way.

If my counterpart from Wrestling Forum had posted yet he would be telling you that I'm obviously town because I never "act up" and get in trouble when I'm scum. There are quite a few people that tell you that I help town more when I'm scum because I'm good for at least one really good case of pushing teammate or being pushed as a teammate.

If you ignore that those facts about me it's possible you would think that I'm scum. Some players on WrestlingForum have a private discussion going and I'm sure that they are finding all of the scum accusations hilarious because, to them, I'm obviously town.


Everyone approaches a game differently. It's why it's much easier to play mafia with the same players over and over because you can learn the difference between Scum Taylor and Town Taylor.

Also your assumption of sameness seems to give you an easy reason to get people mislynched. There are obviously going to be people with different play style and by your logic you can justifiably vote them for not conforming to what you believe "town" play should be.

Actually the more I think about it the more annoyed I am by what you said and the more I think it's a scum tell.

mnowax is probably wolfia as well

Giga/mnowax

Gogo

I agree with everything you actually wrote, but I don't know that it applies to the post that you are talking about.

The exchange went something like this:

weareking: How is that post a scum tell? It's completely null. Town can jokingly say that and mafia can say that as a WIFOM as well.

fank: Exactly, But why deny someone who's been "blatantly" asking for more heat on the fire?

weareking: Because it's not a scum tell, it's null. A true scum tell is something that town are unlikely to do or say on the spur of the moment. As a result mafia tend to say things that they THINK appears to be the best thing for a townie to say in any given situation, and the result is that it reads as forced, maybe only from a gut level, to other players in the game.

Also you totally agreed with me when I said that it's completely null, yet you vote him?

fank: You Question my intentions, when I put it right there, In english???


I have found that when I am evil, I hate having to re-explain myself. I have found that I will get snarky and tell people to just read my previous posts. To be fair, I do this as a villager in some cases as well, but I generally have FAR more patience before I get to that stage -- the snarkiness usually doesn't come out unless it seems like people aren't even paying attention at all and just wasting my time. But as a wolf I might do it even if someone asks me about something that I just barely mentioned at all, days in the past. So, I would not just blindly say that the sarcastic response here was villagery.

When I look at this interaction, his initial explanation was phrased rhetorically, rather than straightforwardly. And it's obvious that weareking did not understand the response, because he proceeded to ask the same question again. At this point, fank still did not explain himself clearly. He's trying to imply that his vote is not a serious vote. Yet he won't actually come out and say it. And when he cast his vote originally, it certainly did not look like a joke vote. He quoted one specific post, called it wolfy, and voted based on that post, yet he's later implying that it was a joke in response to a completely different post.

This is something that draws some concern. I allow people some freedom to just do their own thing. But that freedom has a limit, and someone giving convoluted responses to straightforward questions about their actions is on the wrong side of that limit. That's in the land of deceptive behavior, and villagers don't have a reason to be there.

So to bring this back full circle, his confrontational response was also a deceptive response -- a form of attacking the attacker, by putting the responsibility on weareking for not understanding him, rather than accepting that his own explanation wasn't understandable. I would argue that the wolfiness of the deception outweighs the villageriness of the confrontation. fank is someone I want to keep an eye on.

Ok, so looks like I'm at least half a day late to this thread, but here's what I have so far.

1.) Athexx asked some good questions that I'd like to know the answer to as well (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...&postcount=103)

To add onto his list of questions, I'd like to add my own.:
a.) besides roleblocker, among the list of potential roles, can any/all of them belong to the mafia team? like can you have a bulletproof mafia, or a lover pair where one of them is mafia, etc?
b.) what are the rules on mod kill due to inactivity. If they dont post or vote in x days they are gone?
c.) how many night kills does the mafia team have. Does the # of nightkills go down when mafia hits x number of mafia alive?

As to Athexx asking helpful town questions doesnt remove him from the suspect list, so same goes for me I guess, but I'd rather ask these questions now as I think the answers are all important to town strategy.

2.) TaylorFitz - really didn't like how he started off posting. He soft claims a theme character, but then in the same post says that a theme is unlikely and its just good vs evil. How would he know that there's no theme when that was literally the 2nd post of the whole game and no one else confirmed their theme. At this point I'm getting really suspicious. He then advocates lynching vanilla town - which makes no sense to me. You lynch the people who are suspicious, you never want to lynch a town, regardless if they are a power role or not. At this point I'm thinking maybe he's mafia and/or bad at this game. He then justifies his play as 'thats how I usually play by walking the line', but then immediately in the next post he says he's regretting his play so far. He ends it by saying he did it on purpose to get reactions and possibly scum bait. Personally I think it's bad town play best case scenario and there are subtler and more effective ways of baiting and getting reactions. All he did was derail town discussion for 1-2 pages. My read on him so far: Bad town or bad mafia (lol)

3.) soah - not much other than I like him as town so far. His thinking on TaylorFitz is in line with my analysis. Other than his back and forth with TaylorFitz hasnt said much else, but he's started pressuring other people. I can't imagine I'd vote for him this round.

4.) Nana7 - Neutral on her so far. She's almost acting like as a disccusion moderator and prodding people to clarify their statements and very active in posting, but not contributing a whole lot of substance. Someone to keep an eye on I guess, but I wouldn't for her this round either.

5.) Weareking - suspicious that he has a strong read on TaylorFitz as a town, but otherwise his posts seem ok. Keep this in mind if TaylorFitz flips mafia.

I'll do the rest in a couple hours when I'm out of work.

lol, this thread moved almost an entire page while I was drafting the above post

I, too, had to stop and pause after reading that remark. :P

btw for the other people new to this forum like me, I found this useful to 'filter' peoples posts in the thread: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/mi...sted&t=1368321

Click the post count number

I appreciate your sense of humor : P

I found Cyan's post to be particularly uninspiring. I can see the vantage that he is offering flowers to Taylor prematurely (esp seeing as how Taylor is admitting to wanting to trap scum with his shenanigans), but I see some town generate reads that way as well. I'm curious why people are so eager to hand out reads on him based on a one line opinion about a controversial player. Mastin, did you ever explain your townread on Cyan?

I agree that the lack of followup posts is scummy on Cyan, but hes far from the only lurker and other people are actually scummy in this thread.

I find Nana's fence-sitty response way more scummy and shes been following it up with a lot of posts that leave her options open (avoiding hard stances) re taylor.

Just a general comment, in regard to what is somewhat of an ongoing point of discussion:

Generally, on this site, what I look for most heavily at the start of games are the people who drop in to establish their presence, and then disappear again before they've done anything.

I'm still keeping an eye on those people in this game, but I'm giving it a lot less weight because I understand that at some forums there isn't much activity and it could be normal for people to just drop in like that for one post at a time.

--

This whole progression looks bad to me. Nana avoids directly calling him scummy and instead asserts "hes walking the line", gives a cheeky post to him, and then votes him for ambiguous reasons.

Weareking says someone acting super town is likely a scum tell and Nana takes the Taylor situation out of context to imply that Weare is selectively scumhunting when Taylor definitely has not been trying to hard to look town. (And if she thinks he has, then she has not explained that). It feels like a really forced accusation of weareking, which she drops right away.

I'm having a hard time keeping up with the pace of the thread and also with the layout, so expect me to drop in from time to time and post chunks of analysis rather than try to keep up with the thread in realtime

I guess I don't have a concrete reason for disliking this, but trying to cast doubt on the Athexx townreads going around because you have done that as wolf before feels like an attempt to shake early townreads on the slot.....

Ok, its this. Instead of challenging people on their Athexx townread, she just dismisses it by saying she has done those things as wolf before. Shes doesn't admit that he could do it as town, but paints it negatively by saying she has done it as wolf and leaving it at that. And considering she was modestly interested in weareking before, I would have expected her to press him on what she thought was a sketchy reason to townread someone. And she is ignoring that part of his reason for the townread was specifically that it was a 'borderline illegal post'.

--

And saying that Athexx 'cleared' Taylor prematurely is a pretty hard to swallow translation of that Athexx post.

Hes saying its probable that Taylor is just being a troll. And a gut read on him. Its not like Athexx is hard selling a Taylor townread...its just an offhanded remark that his behavior is intentional and he feels ok so far.

Calling that a 'clear' is kinda missing the forest for the trees. And I think Nana scumreading Athexx for that is pretty contrived and likely intended to be controversial since a lot of people just expressed a townread on that slot.

I voted Taylor because he looked suspicious.

I did not say Taylor was trying to look townie. I said he was trying to look "a certain way" ie too focused on image. Not sure just how you manage to misread that, especially since he admitted it.

fyi, I retained suspicions on Weareking through most of the day and am still wary. Just because I am not pushing someone does not mean I am not suspecting them.

I'd be wary of that. I know Im used to being able to go 3 days without posting because the game culture on MS is a lot slower. I dont know what all these other players are used to, but 2 day long game-Days are shockingly short if people arent used to it.